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Forums - Politics Discussion - Shooting at Robb Elementary School in Uvalde, Texas (19 Students, 2 Teachers Dead)

cyberninja45 said:
sundin13 said:

Two Professors Found What Creates a Mass Shooter. Will Politicians Pay Attention? - POLITICO

Solid article about how, instead of dumping law enforcement into schools, dumping money into mental health services may be a much better tool for the job of preventing mass shootings. Further, it explains how it doesn't really make sense to assume more guns will deter shooters as this is often seen as an act of suicide.

(My own opinion) Additionally, I was thinking a bit about the stats we were talking about a few days ago in regards to death rate increasing for mass shootings when there is an armed guard present. One possible explanation for this could be that armed guards don't deter attacks, but they do ensure that an individual is better prepared due to a greater expectation of resistance. This increased preparedness could result in a higher death rate if they are able to overcome that initial resistance.

Of course it deters wannabe massshooters, suicidal or not.

The more people armed around you the more likely your mass shooting attempt will fail.

Source: Basic common sense

If you see one kid beating another kid with a stick, you don't give the other kid a stick so they can both fight evenly, because you are encouraging that behavior.

You take -all- the sticks away.

***

The fact of the matter is, the United States is struggling with mass shootings, children are being killed.
More guns hasn't helped deter the situation as you have the most guns for a civilian population, more than twice as many as other developed nations.

https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/gun-ownership-by-country

So if more guns hasn't helped... What's something different you can try?

***

It's also pretty sad seeing people rag on police, I have worked alongside many officers over the years, no one wants to see dead children, the officers are human beings remember, with family, friends and a social life.

If officers hesitated or stepped away to avoid that, then I have the upmost respect for that decision, it's not for everyone, even if you are on the front lines daily, dealing with impacted children requires a very different mindset than dealing with Adults, it's not for everyone.



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RolStoppable said:
cyberninja45 said:

Of course it deters wannabe massshooters, suicidal or not.

The more people armed around you the more likely your mass shooting attempt will fail.

Source: Basic common sense

Speaking of common sense, what's your explanation for the USA having such a tremendously higher rate of mass shootings than any other developed nation on this planet?

People not exercising their 2nd amendment right as suppose to by listening to people in this thread.

Last edited by cyberninja45 - on 31 May 2022

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You guys are not understanding what CyberNinja is saying. America needs everyone packing and not only that everyone must be packing the most deadly weapon they can get their hands on including leaving the house everyday in body armor. If you are in a shootout and you have a hand gun while the other person is carrying 1000 rounds of ammo and a Semi Automatic rifle including being fully armored you are at a huge disadvantage.

We only have to look at the last dozen of these incidents to see that the more resistance expected by the shooter, the more prepared they are before executing the deed. In order to combat this, everyone needs to be packing and everyone needs the most deadly weapon. That should ensure every moment you leave your house, you are prepared for the dangers of living in the US. This should give you a warm sensation for every encounter you have with someone you have an issue with because if you are packing and they are packing first one to the kill gets to go home and see their family.



cyberninja45 said:

Source: Basic common sense

"common sense" is a meme and a fallacy

Empirical evidence is always required 



Handgrenades, mortars, mini guns and rocket launchers should be available for purchase by anyone. People need to protect themselves somehow.



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Pemalite said:
cyberninja45 said:

Of course it deters wannabe massshooters, suicidal or not.

The more people armed around you the more likely your mass shooting attempt will fail.

Source: Basic common sense

If you see one kid beating another kid with a stick, you don't give the other kid a stick so they can both fight evenly, because you are encouraging that behavior.

You take -all- the sticks away.

But what happens to the kids if a pervert, who wants to fuck kids in the ass, attacks them out of nowhere?

***

The fact of the matter is, the United States is struggling with mass shootings, children are being killed.
More guns hasn't helped deter the situation as you have the most guns for a civilian population, more than twice as many as other developed nations.

https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/gun-ownership-by-country

So if more guns hasn't helped... What's something different you can try?

People actually bearing such guns? Yes having lots of guns lying around but not enough people actually bearing them is the problem.


***

It's also pretty sad seeing people rag on police, I have worked alongside many officers over the years, no one wants to see dead children, the officers are human beings remember, with family, friends and a social life.

If officers hesitated or stepped away to avoid that, then I have the upmost respect for that decision, it's not for everyone, even if you are on the front lines daily, dealing with impacted children requires a very different mindset than dealing with Adults, it's not for everyone.

THREAD BAN (Trolling: 1 Week) ~ Baiting users/horrible comparisons/ignoring sources 

Last edited by CGI-Quality - on 01 June 2022

My 3ds friendcode: 5413-0232-9676 (G-cyber)



KiigelHeart said:

What I don't understand is how they fucked up so badly. No waiting for backup, go in to distract and try to eliminate the active shooter is the protocol, why didn't they do it? 

edit. Looked into it and apparently first officers to arrive did try to stop the shooter so they acted as they should. They also were inside the school preventing further casualties outside the barricaded room.

After the shooter barricaded himself behind a door whoever was in charge made a terrible decision to wait and make a tactical breach. Hard to defend such decision, even if they could be absolutely certain everyone inside the room has been shot there could be a child bleeding-out etc. 

Just a gut feeling, but in a world of cancel culture, with a growing focus on police enforcement over the past decade, I tend to believe more and more, cops are no doubt thinking twice about every move they make, based more and more on cancel culture. You just don't really see that because the media only shows you a tiny fraction of what happens with the police day to day since they tend to focus on one event where the cops seemingly did something really stupid.

If the cops just rushed in and blew the shooter away, saving more lives, odds are they would end up getting smeared, just in another, worse way, where their career(s) may be quickly ended due to some other outrage.

Why didn't they wait and think it through more? Why didn't they wait for the professionals? They could have saved that troubled young mans life!

Of course, there's the scenario where they burst in, the shooter, ready, guns down 4 or 5 kids because of it, or heaven forbid one of the cops makes a mistake due to rushing and injures or kills one of the hostages. Kiss your life goodbye officer.

Again, why didn't they wait in this scenario? Fire them all!

This shouldn't be the case, since it's police enforcement, but how many people, cops or not, can sit there and honestly say they would've just burst in immediately, full well knowing what could go wrong and how that could ruin your own life, not to mention everything connected to you. Your family, the department, etc.

The deeper you go, the sadder the entire situation looks to be, at least to me.



^^So long for common sense gun laws. Guess I win this debate



My 3ds friendcode: 5413-0232-9676 (G-cyber)



Pemalite said:
cyberninja45 said:

Of course it deters wannabe massshooters, suicidal or not.

The more people armed around you the more likely your mass shooting attempt will fail.

Source: Basic common sense

If you see one kid beating another kid with a stick, you don't give the other kid a stick so they can both fight evenly, because you are encouraging that behavior.

You take -all- the sticks away.

***

The fact of the matter is, the United States is struggling with mass shootings, children are being killed.
More guns hasn't helped deter the situation as you have the most guns for a civilian population, more than twice as many as other developed nations.

https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/gun-ownership-by-country

So if more guns hasn't helped... What's something different you can try?

***

It's also pretty sad seeing people rag on police, I have worked alongside many officers over the years, no one wants to see dead children, the officers are human beings remember, with family, friends and a social life.

If officers hesitated or stepped away to avoid that, then I have the upmost respect for that decision, it's not for everyone, even if you are on the front lines daily, dealing with impacted children requires a very different mindset than dealing with Adults, it's not for everyone.

And that's the point I tried to get across. Not all officers are trained equal and have the mental capacity for such scenarios. We have seen evidence of that in the past how they have behaved in other scenarios across the US. 

A few years ago there was this video making the rounds of a guy with a crowbar who was drunk or on drugs. Now he was so out of it you could have casually walked up behind him and forced him down to the ground. But instead about 4 cops put about 12 rounds into him. I mean shit if you need to fire, put one in the arm the crowbar is in and he will drop it. then arrest.

Mean while in other countries you get outcomes like this:

Now I am not saying all police officers are bad in the US, but it seems like their either under trained, or they hire people not capable for the role because there isn't enough people filling positions and you end up in these situations where someone gets killed who shouldn't have been killed.

Perhaps this is part of the problem in the US that fuels the fear that cops are out to get you so you need guns to protect yourself. 



 

 

ConservagameR said:
KiigelHeart said:

What I don't understand is how they fucked up so badly. No waiting for backup, go in to distract and try to eliminate the active shooter is the protocol, why didn't they do it? 

edit. Looked into it and apparently first officers to arrive did try to stop the shooter so they acted as they should. They also were inside the school preventing further casualties outside the barricaded room.

After the shooter barricaded himself behind a door whoever was in charge made a terrible decision to wait and make a tactical breach. Hard to defend such decision, even if they could be absolutely certain everyone inside the room has been shot there could be a child bleeding-out etc. 

Just a gut feeling, but in a world of cancel culture, with a growing focus on police enforcement over the past decade, I tend to believe more and more, cops are no doubt thinking twice about every move they make, based more and more on cancel culture. You just don't really see that because the media only shows you a tiny fraction of what happens with the police day to day since they tend to focus on one event where the cops seemingly did something really stupid.

If the cops just rushed in and blew the shooter away, saving more lives, odds are they would end up getting smeared, just in another, worse way, where their career(s) may be quickly ended due to some other outrage.

Why didn't they wait and think it through more? Why didn't they wait for the professionals? They could have saved that troubled young mans life!

Of course, there's the scenario where they burst in, the shooter, ready, guns down 4 or 5 kids because of it, or heaven forbid one of the cops makes a mistake due to rushing and injures or kills one of the hostages. Kiss your life goodbye officer.

Again, why didn't they wait in this scenario? Fire them all!

This shouldn't be the case, since it's police enforcement, but how many people, cops or not, can sit there and honestly say they would've just burst in immediately, full well knowing what could go wrong and how that could ruin your own life, not to mention everything connected to you. Your family, the department, etc.

The deeper you go, the sadder the entire situation looks to be, at least to me.

This scenario is a bit different in urgency for such worry but I guess overall you do make a valid point as this would be something they experience now in their day to day job on the street, so hard to get out of that mind set. How many times do we see people recording cops these days and then slamming edited videos up onto social media. This is the main reason I reckon why cops are wearing more and more high tech camera to try and protect themselves from scrutiny. However public perception won't change and they get slammed further when the findings of an investigate clears the police officer, like there is some conspiracy theory protecting them from the law.

Agree the more you think about this the sadder it is as it ends up being a no win situation no matter how you play out the scenario.