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Forums - Politics - Gina Carano - Disney fired her, what does that solve?

KLXVER on 14 February 2021
sales2099 said:
KLXVER said:

Whats the difference? I mean the person would still be nothing without an audience.

Losing a portion of the total audience doesn’t mean the end. The IP in question can bring in less money, be shrouded in controversy, but it can still live if the core fanbase, who remains invested, keeps it going. 

Cancelling makes a definitive choice for the core fanbase without their input. And it’s worse when the advocates for cancelling aren’t fans but merely people seeking to erase what they deem as problematic. 

Seems to me like the same thing. Unless you boycott someone because they give to charity or something that doesnt make sense. If you have a 100 fans and they all boycott you, then what would be different if those 100 people cancelled you instead?



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sales2099 on 14 February 2021
JWeinCom said:
sales2099 said:

Change in politics/policy is one thing. But I simply feel cancelling entertainment that has nothing to do with leanings of people involved is detrimental to the fandom and people who were positively impacted by it.

Harry Potter fans like Harry Potter and any opinion by its creator shouldn’t change that. Wasn’t that long ago that people didn’t resort to cancelling everything that triggered them. Again, I advocate for boycotting, not cancelling. 

When was this golden age when people didn't cancel everything that triggered them? As Ivor did a great job of pointing out, people have been applying pressure to shape media to their liking for pretty much ever. They tried to #cancel the fucking Beatles. This isn't a new thing. 

When you boycott, you tell a company you are not going to support their business unless they change X and you're going to organize other people to do the same.  That's the same exact thing as cancelling. You're just applying a special word to certain people do it. 

You simply can’t deny the increase in frequency and the bar for what constitutes cancellation. And I made myself very clear on the difference between boycott and cancelling. One is a warning for change, the other is definitive and swift. 



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JWeinCom on 14 February 2021
sales2099 said:
JWeinCom said:

He sure tried...

https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/07/politics/fact-check-trump-cancel-culture-boycotts-firings/index.html

and probably succeeded in some cases...

https://www.theguardian.com/media/2021/jan/19/two-fox-news-executives-involved-in-election-night-arizona-call-are-out

Like I said, cancel culture almost exclusivity relates to entertainment. Celebrities, content creators, movie, TV, etc. It’s very one-sided. 

Well, if you throw out all of the examples of it being done by people on the right, then yeah, it's very one sided.

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/no-true-scotsman

Why is it not a problem to fire a reporter for giving news people didn't like, but firing Gina is? Because one is about entertainment? I'm sorry, that's just stupid. 

Last edited by JWeinCom - on 14 February 2021

JWeinCom on 14 February 2021
sales2099 said:
JWeinCom said:

When was this golden age when people didn't cancel everything that triggered them? As Ivor did a great job of pointing out, people have been applying pressure to shape media to their liking for pretty much ever. They tried to #cancel the fucking Beatles. This isn't a new thing. 

When you boycott, you tell a company you are not going to support their business unless they change X and you're going to organize other people to do the same.  That's the same exact thing as cancelling. You're just applying a special word to certain people do it. 

You simply can’t deny the increase in frequency and the bar for what constitutes cancellation. And I made myself very clear on the difference between boycott and cancelling. One is a warning for change, the other is definitive and swift. 

Yes, I can deny it, because that which is asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence. 

You didn't make yourself clear at all.

If I say I'm not going to stop watching the mandalorian unless they fire Gina and try to get all of my friends to do it, am I cancelling or boycotting?



sales2099 on 14 February 2021
JWeinCom said:
sales2099 said:

Like I said, cancel culture almost exclusivity relates to entertainment. Celebrities, content creators, movie, TV, etc. It’s very one-sided. 

Well, if you throw out all of the examples of it being done by people on the right, then yeah, it's very one sided.

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/no-true-scotsman

We at a impasse then. If you wanna deny thats your right. In entertainment for the past several years, the vast majority affected by cancel culture are not left-wing. 



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JWeinCom on 14 February 2021
sales2099 said:
JWeinCom said:

Well, if you throw out all of the examples of it being done by people on the right, then yeah, it's very one sided.

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/no-true-scotsman

We at a impasse then. If you wanna deny thats your right. In entertainment for the past several years, the vast majority affected by cancel culture are not left-wing. 

Assuming that's right, why should we only care when it happens in entertainment? That's a ridiculous double standard.



sales2099 on 14 February 2021
JWeinCom said:
sales2099 said:

You simply can’t deny the increase in frequency and the bar for what constitutes cancellation. And I made myself very clear on the difference between boycott and cancelling. One is a warning for change, the other is definitive and swift. 

Yes, I can deny it, because that which is asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence. 

You didn't make yourself clear at all.

If I say I'm not going to stop watching the mandalorian unless they fire Gina and try to get all of my friends to do it, am I cancelling or boycotting?

Yes i did. Boycot gives a chance for change and a warning. A cancelation is swift with no chance of reconciliation. This is very clear. Look, you on the other spectrum as me, but you gotta meet me half way. This was described very simply. There is a difference. 



Xbox: Best hardware, Game Pass best value, best BC, more 1st party genres and multiplayer titles. 

 

sales2099 on 14 February 2021
JWeinCom said:
sales2099 said:

We at a impasse then. If you wanna deny thats your right. In entertainment for the past several years, the vast majority affected by cancel culture are not left-wing. 

Assuming that's right, why should we only care when it happens in entertainment? That's a ridiculous double standard.

That’s what cancel culture refers to by the majority of people that use the term. I didn’t invent that. 



Xbox: Best hardware, Game Pass best value, best BC, more 1st party genres and multiplayer titles. 

 

sundin13 on 14 February 2021
sales2099 said:
JWeinCom said:

Well, if you throw out all of the examples of it being done by people on the right, then yeah, it's very one sided.

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/no-true-scotsman

We at a impasse then. If you wanna deny thats your right. In entertainment for the past several years, the vast majority affected by cancel culture are not left-wing. 

I actually disagree with this too. You could make the argument that on twitter, those that are most visibly using "cancel" hashtags are left wing, but people on the left are more than willing to criticize others on the left. I'd say that people on the left hold others on the left to a higher standard than they hold people on the right, so it is often easier to "cancel" (aka get a "cancel" hashtag trending) someone on the left than on the right. 



JWeinCom on 14 February 2021
sales2099 said:
JWeinCom said:

Yes, I can deny it, because that which is asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence. 

You didn't make yourself clear at all.

If I say I'm not going to stop watching the mandalorian unless they fire Gina and try to get all of my friends to do it, am I cancelling or boycotting?

Yes i did. Boycot gives a chance for change and a warning. A cancelation is swift with no chance of reconciliation. This is very clear. Look, you on the other spectrum as me, but you gotta meet me half way. This was described very simply. There is a difference. 

I genuinely have no idea what the distinction is in what people are actually doing. Saying "it's quick" doesn't in any way help me understand the actual actions you define as "cancelling". 

Which is why I asked a clarifying question. Please answer it.

sales2099 said:
JWeinCom said:

Assuming that's right, why should we only care when it happens in entertainment? That's a ridiculous double standard.

That’s what cancel culture refers to by the majority of people that use the term. I didn’t invent that. 

Because the majority of people who use that term are doing so disingenuously to claim something is a problem, but only when people they disagree with are doing it.

Like what you're doing right now, when an example of the right calling for someone to be fired for expressing an unpopular opinion is being presented and you're just like. "Welp, it's not canceling so no need to address that". 


So, were the people who called for the news anchor to be fired for calling Arizona as much of a problem as people calling for Gina Carano to be fired?