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Forums - Website Topics - VGChartz Moderator Evaluation Survey August 2020

Bristow9091 said:
Ka-pi96 said:

How honest, exactly?

Super duper honest!


Pemalite should be one of the head mods.

Pretty sure that was reflected in my survey too, but that's me being super duper honest.

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axumblade said:
kirby007 said:

is Q1 based on purely knowing the person? or also on their "modding" activity?

for instance i know Axum and trasharm but them doing shit on the forum itself is pretty debatable

Trash is pretty active in other ways but it's understandable if the community can't really see it. I admittedly have fallen off lately due to personal issues. But feel free to judge me accordingly. 

VGChartz judges by the sword.*

*due to covid safe distancing is in effect 1.5 metres from the tip of the blade.

Research shows Video games  help make you smarter, so why am I an idiot

gergroy said:
I’d fill it out but I’m not too familiar with most of the mods anymore... just some of the old guard that are still around...

It’s crazy to think about, but me and axumblade were both working at Best Buy when I started on here... that seems so long ago... kinda surprised I’m still on here...

I thought you where going to say that you were surprised that (A) you were still at Best Buy  or (B) you aren't ceo and axumblade wasn't fired.

Research shows Video games  help make you smarter, so why am I an idiot

gergroy said:
I’d fill it out but I’m not too familiar with most of the mods anymore... just some of the old guard that are still around...

It’s crazy to think about, but me and axumblade were both working at Best Buy when I started on here... that seems so long ago... kinda surprised I’m still on here...

Your account is from 2009... so when you started here, I think I was at Best Buy too XD. I hated it.

gergroy said:
I’d fill it out but I’m not too familiar with most of the mods anymore... just some of the old guard that are still around...

It’s crazy to think about, but me and axumblade were both working at Best Buy when I started on here... that seems so long ago... kinda surprised I’m still on here...

Oh wow. I almost completely forgot we were both at Best Buy. Man...I haven't worked there in almost a decade xD 

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I found the whole Best Buy thing very touching.

- "If you have the heart of a true winner, you can always get more pissed off than some other asshole."

It's time to post my opinion on the state of things, which is of course valid, because the deadline of the evaluation hasn't passed yet.

Earlier today the mod team has made the decision to lock The Moderator Thread with this note:

CGI-Quality said:

As before, this thread has been an experiment unlike any other on the site. However, after some considerable discussion with other moderators, the mods agree that The Moderator Thread has run its course. Its benefits, as with previous mod threads, just do not exist anymore.

Here are a few things that lead this decision:

1) This makes Mod Thread number three. It only existed because the previous two were locked for the very same reason(s) this one is being locked. Continuous attacks on the mod team (much of the time without evidence of serious wrongdoing). Also, some of the OPs rules and suggestions were often ignored, which was then used as a way to again attack the mod team about clarity, and thus, became counter-intuitive. In fact, we've have a counter productivity problem for a good 3/4 of the thread's life.

2) Many mods (past and present) agree that the idea of The Moderator Thread is flawed. This is mainly due to the fact that banned users can discuss their bans with us at the moderator email and this thread adds a redundancy. It didn't feel like we could really connect with the banned user in a way that would lead to real discussion (and in the few times that it did, was then accompanied by backseat moderating, which I'll discuss in a moment). Too often, discussions would again turn into attacks on other users and the mod team. As noted, we did get some users just wanting reasonable discussions with us, but then that also lead to other issues with this thread.

3) Backseat Moderating. This was a serious issue with The Moderator Thread and every mod thread before it. Mods asked that people not do this, but this again exposes a flaw in the very core of the premise — it is invitational to backseat moderating and no amount of "please don't do this" had any real effect.

When I stepped up to Head, I knew several mods wanted to see this thread go, but we decided to keep it open thinking it may do more good than harm. Sadly, we've seen enough to realize that the dream is dead. Much of the time, people used this thread to perpetuate agendas, preconceived notions, etc.

That isn't a full list of everything we found wrong, but either way, it has become a burden on the mod team once again. It became something it wasn't supposed to (and shouldn't have), and generally ignored the main party it was intended to work with: the moderated user. This major flaw was removed with the addition of the mod email 5 years ago, so really, such a thread wasn't needed for a third time. As Smeags once put it, The Mod Thread: "only created middle men in the best sense, and agenda pushing at its worst."

Going forward, I encourage moderated users to use the mod email if you have issues with a moderation given to you. Of course, some of the same rules apply there, so please use it reasonably.

To the users that brought great discussion here, we really appreciate it. As in VERY MUCH! For now, we're moving forward and will keep looking for ways to improve.

-CGI-Quality and the rest of the Mod Team.

For the most part it's a poorly reasoned explanation. I'll address why:

1) If there had really been a notable number of attacks on the mod team, then The Moderator Thread would have been filled with moderations for users who did not respect the guidelines of the thread. There's a disconnect between what 'attack' means and what it is interpreted as by the mod team. When unpleasant questions are already considered attacks, it explains both why the mod team experienced grief, yet could not make the step to moderate people who caused said grief.

2) The Moderator Thread's primary purpose was never about getting in touch with banned users. It was about general questions regarding moderation including specific examples to determine what is still okay and what is crossing the line, quick feedback regarding how strict or lenient the current approach was, and suggestions for how to deal with new problems when they arose. It being a public thread allowed anyone with interest to chime in which in turn allowed the mod team to better gauge the climate of the forum as a whole.

3) Backseat moderating is portrayed as inherently bad here, but moderators tend to end up in their own bubble where they don't know how to connect to the average user anymore.

CGI-Quality's explanation states that it is not a full list, but it hardly qualifies as a list to begin with. It barely touches on things in the most general manner and does not provide any concrete examples of what went wrong and which incidents in particular fueled the decision to lock. It's just a general aversion to having a Moderator Thread.

What had happened most recently in the Moderator Thread was reduced transparency by the head mod himself, followed by inquiries why everything has to be discussed behind the scenes all of a sudden. Shutting down the thread is the next step in reducing transparency. A preceding step to reduce transparency was the changed coding for locked threads that made them vanish from Forum Buddies, so that people couldn't see how the mod team actually handled threads that got out of hand. Commonly, the bloated threads with plenty of moderable posts got simply locked without consequences for any offenders. That made the whole thing look like a cover-up act to me; the mod team doesn't do a proper job, but nobody will know about it.

Likewise, taking things to PM in the Moderator Thread came across as an effort to sweep things under the rug more easily, and locking the thread as a whole will make that even easier in the future. It should be obvious to everyone that in any private conversation, it will be the word of a mod against the word of a regular user, with the mod having the convenient option to declare that they are right because they are the mod.

One positive thing that The Moderator Thread always accomplished is give the perception that the mod team and the community are on the same level. The mod team had the executive power, but the community could still act as a controlling body to keep the mod team down to Earth, preventing outright dictatorships like on comparable websites (NeoGAF, ResetEra).

So to answer the questions in the original post of this thread, you aren't doing well with this recent move. It's not good this way. You are pushing in a direction where you are free to do whatever you want, whether it is right or wrong. You are giving all the power in your own hands, you are free to sweep anything under the rug if you feel to do so, and that is concerning for a mod team that has already shown signs to disregard users for asking unpleasant questions, whether that was by way of diplomatic token responses that didn't say anything of substance, attempts to divert from the subject at hand or outright ignoring people's posts.

I do not have the same faith in this mod team as I had in Smeags's team, that's why this time locking the mod thread is a serious problem. Also, the timing of the lock could almost not be more convenient. You run an evaluation survey, hopefully collect good grades, lock The Moderator Thread and then pretend for a year that the mod team has been doing great because the biggest decision you made in a long time just so happened to be right after the community provided you with feedback. But I am actually leaning strongly towards plain coincidence rather than a sinister plan here.

I see that I still have 20 minutes left until the deadline, but I think I've said what I wanted to say.

Actually, if The Moderator Thread is such a burden, then simply let it be handled by the few mods who can entertain the idea of talking to the community. You don't need to control absolutely everything, CGI-Quality, and by now it's abundantly clear that you'd rather not talk to people in public about the thought processes that went into moderations.

Last edited by RolStoppable - on 15 August 2020

Legend11 correctly predicted that GTA IV (360+PS3) would outsell SSBB. I was wrong.

A Biased Review Reloaded / Open Your Eyes / Switch Shipments

This ia not the correct thread to do this Rol you need to make a seperate topic for this point i got a few title suggestions
"Bring back the mod thread" or "1984 the vgchartz edition"

 "I think people should define the word crap" - Kirby007

Join the Prediction League

Instead of seeking to convince others, we can be open to changing our own minds, and seek out information that contradicts our own steadfast point of view. Maybe it’ll turn out that those who disagree with you actually have a solid grasp of the facts. There’s a slight possibility that, after all, you’re the one who’s wrong.

I said this on my evaluation, but it has been a long time since we've shuffled head mods - it's about time, if not for the sake of variety. At the very least, they could add a second or third person like they used to have.

Last edited by Moren - on 15 August 2020

We know some people don't agree with The Moderator Thread's closure and that's fine (as with the previous, people didn't agree then either). They don't have to. 

But, @RolStoppable 

You tend to push conspiracy theories and this often leads to further issues we face. I get the idea of "sticking it to the man", but it does more harm than good and that is a problem. I generally don't entertain it because there are much bigger things that mods (and admins) have to deal with, but sometimes, it just gets to be too much and you know this. Plus, this idea that the head mod "works on his own" is patently false, but like I said, I generally try not to entertain conspiracy theories.

So, simply put, not everything is a "conspiracy" and we're not going to turn this into a "why The Moderator Thread was closed". That isn't to say that you cannot inquire (though what was said in that thread covers just about everything), but not in here.

Last edited by CGI-Quality - on 15 August 2020