By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Gaming Discussion - Do gamers really want Cloud gaming?

goopy20 said:
sales2099 said:

- He also said cloud gaming is a convenience and will never be as responsive as traditional gaming. People have been speculating the “last gen” since Ps3/360. He also said 10 years +. That plus could mean any number, literally any number. 

- “Does not care”. Then why all the PR for the past year? Why even make the thing? Clearly they want to promote options, and you bet they will market the Series X this launch. Of course they would prefer you buy a Series X, but if you don’t care for one they have other options. 

- Your last sentence is accurate but this helps traditional gaming just as much. 

Again why you pretending it’s all up to the Series X? You know Lockhart is a thing and will be official soon enough. And people more technical then I explained to you that it’s more “scientific fact” to build high and scale down, which has nothing to do with cloud gaming preferences btw. 

So yes, your quotes were taken out of context to say the least. 

He didn't say never, he said around 10 Years. Look at it this way. If MS is convinced that after next gen, we will all be playing in the Cloud and they will become the netflix of gaming. Why would they then care about winning the console race? Phil even said he doesn't want to be in another format race with Nintendo and Sony, which simply means selling Series X consoles is not their top priority next gen. So why did they make it? Of course they want to sell it, just like the they want to sell the $200 elite controller and X1X, but they didn't expect those things to be mass market products. They were niche products for those who are willing to pay a premium price for a premium product. That's why I think Series X will be pretty expensive. It's also why making their exclusives cross gen and putting them on GP from day one actually does make sense.

We will see if the games will be scaled down from Series X or if they will be scaled up from X1 as the base platform. But like I said, if reaching more players through GP has a higher priority than selling Series X boxes, it kinda makes sense that they will design them so the lowest common denominator isn't getting left behind. Maybe I'm totally wrong here and they are willing to take a big hit on each console sold, sell them for $399 and try to reach a 100m installbase. But if it's $599 or higher, I'm sure they know it's not going to sell those kind of numbers. Financially it would then not make sense to focus too much on the Series X version of their exclusives, when 80% of the sales will likely come from the X1 and main stream pc gamers.

  

I’ll say it again. He said streaming will never be as responsive as traditional gaming. He said 10 years +. I can’t stress enough he said + because nobody can predict an industry that far later. 10 years later he can easily say another 10 + years. Your whole argument is null and void because you not only took a quote out of context but you neglected another where he admitted it’s just a convenience.  

Of course Series X will be expensive, nobody is disagreeing with you. That’s the premium gamer console and Lockhart is the mass market console. Why won’t you acknowledge the existence of Lockhart?

It’s kinda hilarious you STILL don’t understand what GP is. It merely changes your buying habits from buying outright to a sub model. Like me dropping cable and get Netflix. Except here I can still buy games outright. That’s the point...it’s all options. Nothing is replacing anything. 

Stay on topic....it’s your thread. It’s about people wanting to use cloud gaming. This isn’t about Series X or Game Pass. 



Xbox: Best hardware, Game Pass best value, best BC, more 1st party genres and multiplayer titles. 

 

Around the Network
sales2099 said:
sethnintendo said:

Cloud gaming can take smartphone gaming to the burn pile. All trash in my opinion. To each their own but your way is shit.  Consoles and PCs are superior to streaming.

To be fair you aren’t playing f2p phone games. You are streaming core console games. Otherwise I agree with you, but who’s to say in 10 years what it’ll be like. It will always be a option and nice to have but nothing compares to a big Tv and your couch. 

Edit: I may have misunderstood your first point but I think you get where I stand 

Yes in 10 years it might be better.  Right now internet speeds aren't always up to par for streaming games.  Sure if you have 1 GB speeds then you are probably fine but most people have 100 mb or less in USA.  I see it more like a niche market like VR.  It might linger and be around for awhile but it won't be mainstream for at least 10 years.



sethnintendo said:
sales2099 said:

To be fair you aren’t playing f2p phone games. You are streaming core console games. Otherwise I agree with you, but who’s to say in 10 years what it’ll be like. It will always be a option and nice to have but nothing compares to a big Tv and your couch. 

Edit: I may have misunderstood your first point but I think you get where I stand 

Yes in 10 years it might be better.  Right now internet speeds aren't always up to par for streaming games.  Sure if you have 1 GB speeds then you are probably fine but most people have 100 mb or less in USA.  I see it more like a niche market like VR.  It might linger and be around for awhile but it won't be mainstream for at least 10 years.

100 mbps is more than enough to stream games in 4k. 35-50 mbps range is the optimal to 4k streaming. But if other person is using the internet to watch Netflix The resolution will be adjusted in case you only have the bare minimum 35-50 mbps speed.



zero129 said:
sales2099 said:

I’ll say it again. He said streaming will never be as responsive as traditional gaming. He said 10 years +. I can’t stress enough he said + because nobody can predict an industry that far later. 10 years later he can easily say another 10 + years. Your whole argument is null and void because you not only took a quote out of context but you neglected another where he admitted it’s just a convenience.  

Of course Series X will be expensive, nobody is disagreeing with you. That’s the premium gamer console and Lockhart is the mass market console. Why won’t you acknowledge the existence of Lockhart?

It’s kinda hilarious you STILL don’t understand what GP is. It merely changes your buying habits from buying outright to a sub model. Like me dropping cable and get Netflix. Except here I can still buy games outright. That’s the point...it’s all options. Nothing is replacing anything. 

Stay on topic....it’s your thread. It’s about people wanting to use cloud gaming. This isn’t about Series X or Game Pass. 

Whats also funny is how this thread is about cloud gaming yet out of Sony and MS only Sony has a cloud gaming service fully released since Xcloud is still in beta but Goopy keeps going on about how bad it is for MS.

Not only that but Goopy keeps talking about how MS is losing money on Gamepass (Something i have kept subbed to on my pc) for €1 but thats only the first month. Whats even funnier is how i wont stay subbed to PSNow cos Gamepass offers me as a PC Gamer a much better service since they offer me PC versions of the games not only the console versions with no settings or higher res etc.

So like i said the funny thing is I just need to sign up for the 7 day free trial whenever Sony adds a game i want to play. Its helped me finish God of War ascension,The Last of US and many other PS3/4 exclusives all for free by just making new accounts and signing up for the free trial, so well MS is getting €1 off everyone who is doing the same thing Sony is getting nothing. And since for me since i have so many games to play i dont mind waiting for Sony to add their backlog to PSNow to play for free, however what i really think worries Goopy is he sees Game subscriptions is the future and when it comes to that MS is way a hard of everyone else and it worries him even if he is trying to downplay it cos he knows when that future comes MS is going to be the leader. Only Nintendo imo will be able to survive this future and stay doing what they are doing (While streaming XCloud and PSNow on their console/Handheld) cos their IP's are just that big.

No offense but I think you're just not looking at the bigger picture and understand how big a business Cloud services is. I'm not trying to debate or convince anyone here, just read this if you don't believe me... 

"Microsoft is no longer a “Windows” company. It’s no longer an “Xbox” company. It’s a cloud company, just like Amazon."

https://www.equities.com/news/microsoft-has-quietly-made-the-switch-of-the-century

MS's stock have been skyrocketing because of their ventures in Cloud computing, while the Xbox division's revenue is dropping $1 billion year-over-year and console sales basically crashed. MS's console business is falling apart but their gaming services are still blooming. From a business perspective, it only makes sense that that's going to be their main focus moving forward, and not selling their next gen consoles. If that was the case they would be using their 1st party studios to makes Series X exclusives, launch a $399 console and try to dethrone Sony. But that's not what they're doing. They're making all their 1st party games cross-gen, practically give them away for free on GP, and will probably launch a $599 console instead.

They already said they don't want to get into another format war with Nintendo and Sony and are looking at Amazon and Google as their main competitors. It's because they're already looking past next gen. GP subscribers are simply a lot more valuable for MS and their Xcloud vision, compared to the number of next gen consoles they'll sell. 

And no, I don't think MS will do great as a subscription service. If we do actually get a future where we will all be gaming in the Cloud, Sony and Nintendo will just copy paste GP and it will still be about which company has the best exclusives. MS will no doubt make a fortune by hosting their Cloud platform, though.   

Last edited by goopy20 - on 05 March 2020

goopy20 said:
zero129 said:

Whats also funny is how this thread is about cloud gaming yet out of Sony and MS only Sony has a cloud gaming service fully released since Xcloud is still in beta but Goopy keeps going on about how bad it is for MS.

Not only that but Goopy keeps talking about how MS is losing money on Gamepass (Something i have kept subbed to on my pc) for €1 but thats only the first month. Whats even funnier is how i wont stay subbed to PSNow cos Gamepass offers me as a PC Gamer a much better service since they offer me PC versions of the games not only the console versions with no settings or higher res etc.

So like i said the funny thing is I just need to sign up for the 7 day free trial whenever Sony adds a game i want to play. Its helped me finish God of War ascension,The Last of US and many other PS3/4 exclusives all for free by just making new accounts and signing up for the free trial, so well MS is getting €1 off everyone who is doing the same thing Sony is getting nothing. And since for me since i have so many games to play i dont mind waiting for Sony to add their backlog to PSNow to play for free, however what i really think worries Goopy is he sees Game subscriptions is the future and when it comes to that MS is way a hard of everyone else and it worries him even if he is trying to downplay it cos he knows when that future comes MS is going to be the leader. Only Nintendo imo will be able to survive this future and stay doing what they are doing (While streaming XCloud and PSNow on their console/Handheld) cos their IP's are just that big.

No offense but I think you're just not looking at the bigger picture and understand how big a business Cloud services is. I'm not trying to debate or convince anyone here, just read this if you don't believe me... 

"Microsoft is no longer a “Windows” company. It’s no longer an “Xbox” company. It’s a cloud company, just like Amazon."

https://www.equities.com/news/microsoft-has-quietly-made-the-switch-of-the-century

MS's stock have been skyrocketing because of their ventures in Cloud computing, while the Xbox division's revenue is dropping $1 billion year-over-year and console sales basically crashed. MS's console business is falling apart but their gaming services are still blooming. From a business perspective, it only makes sense that that's going to be their main focus moving forward, and not selling their next gen consoles. If that was the case they would be using their 1st party studios to makes Series X exclusives, launch a $399 console and try to dethrone Sony. But that's not what they're doing. They're making all their 1st party games cross-gen, practically give them away for free on GP, and will probably launch a $599 console instead.

They already said they don't want to get into another format war with Nintendo and Sony and are looking at Amazon and Google as their main competitors. It's because they're already looking past next gen. GP subscribers are simply a lot more valuable for MS and their Xcloud vision, compared to the number of next gen consoles they'll sell. 

And no, I don't think MS will do great as a subscription service. If we do actually get a future where we will all be gaming in the Cloud, Sony and Nintendo will just copy paste GP and it will still be about which company has the best exclusives. MS will no doubt make a fortune by hosting their Cloud platform, though.   

So this entire thread isn’t about gamers thoughts on cloud gaming. It’s just a Trojan horse to take a dump on MS, got it.

None of what you said is true, but let’s face it too many people all ready covered your shaky at best points 

(Thanks for ignoring my reply where I proved you misrepresented Phil’s quotes on cloud gaming, especially where he said it’s just a convenience and never will be as responsive).  

Last edited by sales2099 - on 05 March 2020

Xbox: Best hardware, Game Pass best value, best BC, more 1st party genres and multiplayer titles. 

 

Around the Network
sales2099 said:
goopy20 said:

No offense but I think you're just not looking at the bigger picture and understand how big a business Cloud services is. I'm not trying to debate or convince anyone here, just read this if you don't believe me... 

"Microsoft is no longer a “Windows” company. It’s no longer an “Xbox” company. It’s a cloud company, just like Amazon."

https://www.equities.com/news/microsoft-has-quietly-made-the-switch-of-the-century

MS's stock have been skyrocketing because of their ventures in Cloud computing, while the Xbox division's revenue is dropping $1 billion year-over-year and console sales basically crashed. MS's console business is falling apart but their gaming services are still blooming. From a business perspective, it only makes sense that that's going to be their main focus moving forward, and not selling their next gen consoles. If that was the case they would be using their 1st party studios to makes Series X exclusives, launch a $399 console and try to dethrone Sony. But that's not what they're doing. They're making all their 1st party games cross-gen, practically give them away for free on GP, and will probably launch a $599 console instead.

They already said they don't want to get into another format war with Nintendo and Sony and are looking at Amazon and Google as their main competitors. It's because they're already looking past next gen. GP subscribers are simply a lot more valuable for MS and their Xcloud vision, compared to the number of next gen consoles they'll sell. 

And no, I don't think MS will do great as a subscription service. If we do actually get a future where we will all be gaming in the Cloud, Sony and Nintendo will just copy paste GP and it will still be about which company has the best exclusives. MS will no doubt make a fortune by hosting their Cloud platform, though.   

So this entire thread isn’t about gamers thoughts on cloud gaming. It’s just a Trojan horse to take a dump on MS, got it.

None of what you said is true, but let’s face it too many people all ready covered your shaky at best points 

(Thanks for ignoring my reply where I proved you misrepresented Phil’s quotes on cloud gaming, especially where he said it’s just a convenience and never will be as responsive).  

This is about cloud gaming and if people want it. Personally, I don't but I'm sure there are plenty of people who will dig it. And I'm sorry if you somehow got your feelings hurt but I think you're taking it to personal. In the end MS is a behemoth of a tech company and their decisions do make a lot of sense when you consider how much they're invested in Cloud tech and how much of their profits are coming from it.

In a recent interview Ted Price asked Phil how giving their exclusives away for free on GP can work financially, and Phil didn't know what to say. He says something like "It does make sense but that's just me as a dude saying it does. If more people play more games and more hours, we all win". What kind of rainbow and unicorn BS is that lol?

http://interactive.libsyn.com/head-of-xbox-phil-spencer    00:38 mark

In any case, MS is all in when it comes to Cloud gaming and reaching more gamers. We'll just have to wait and see what that means for Series X and their regular console business. 



goopy20 said:
sales2099 said:

So this entire thread isn’t about gamers thoughts on cloud gaming. It’s just a Trojan horse to take a dump on MS, got it.

None of what you said is true, but let’s face it too many people all ready covered your shaky at best points 

(Thanks for ignoring my reply where I proved you misrepresented Phil’s quotes on cloud gaming, especially where he said it’s just a convenience and never will be as responsive).  

This is about cloud gaming and if people want it. Personally, I don't but I'm sure there are plenty of people who will dig it. And I'm sorry if you somehow got your feelings hurt but I think you're taking it to personal. In the end MS is a behemoth of a tech company and their decisions do make a lot of sense when you consider how much they're invested in Cloud tech and how much of their profits are coming from it.

In a recent interview Ted Price asked Phil how giving their exclusives away for free on GP can work financially, and Phil didn't know what to say. He says something like "It does make sense but that's just me as a dude saying it does. If more people play more games and more hours, we all win". What kind of rainbow and unicorn BS is that lol?

http://interactive.libsyn.com/head-of-xbox-phil-spencer    00:38 mark

In any case, MS is all in when it comes to Cloud gaming and reaching more gamers. We'll just have to wait and see what that means for Series X and their regular console business. 

Lol it’s more low key admiration that you are able to avoid the mods by masking obvious contempt for Xbox while maintaining a perspective that is literally unmovable despite what is put in front of you. Personally I find this to be a fun distraction during work and when I can spare a few minutes. 

In older interviews he actually explained how GP users on average play more games, buy more dlc, and recommend games to non GP users. More time playing Xbox = higher chance of spending more money on Xbox. It’s not rocket science. 

A console provides a direct gateway to all their services, so long as there is a sizeable market for consoles you bet Ms will invest.

That said, leave the tin foil conspiracy theories out of the thread, as nobody can predict where this is heading, especially the irony that Sony was the first to do this. It’s brilliant because it’s anti Ms while having no way to counter such blatant speculation, while avoiding the mods with careful wording. If nothing else I give you props on that. 

(And you still didn’t address where I called you out on ignoring Phil’s quote on Cloud gaming never replacing traditional gaming) 

Last edited by sales2099 - on 05 March 2020

Xbox: Best hardware, Game Pass best value, best BC, more 1st party genres and multiplayer titles. 

 

I can't speak for anyone else, but I certainly don't care for cloud gaming. Not even a little bit.



LudicrousSpeed said:
goopy20 said:

I already told you. IT's not a traditional console in the sense that they're not pushing next gen tech and try get to people to migrate asap. Instead they're making all their exclusives cross-gen for 2 years, effectively creating less incentive to leap in the next gen until the big 3rd party titles come out a couple years later. They know this isn't a good way to sell a ton of Series X's and push next gen gaming forward. But they don't care because they're aiming to reach 8 billion non-gamers through Xcloud on a ton of different devices. They're basically saying we don't need next gen consoles or pc anymore when we got the Cloud.

Neither Google nor Amazon has publicly announced plans to launch a game console, but both are positioned to compete directly with Microsoft’s Xbox when it comes to what Spencer sees as the next great expansion in gaming.

“Amazon and Google are focusing on how to get gaming to 7 billion people around the world,” Spencer told Protocol. “Ultimately, that’s the goal.”

"Though game consoles like Xbox One and PlayStation 4 sell in the tens or, in the case of PS4, hundreds of millions, the real potential market for gaming, Spencer believes, is in the billions of people on Earth who don’t – or can’t – own a game console. "

https://www.businessinsider.nl/xbox-boss-says-xbox-now-competes-with-google-and-amazon-2020-2?international=true&r=US

Your delusions regarding how MS is prioritizing xCloud versus local hardware doesn’t magically make the XSX a non-traditional console. We should have contained this nonsense to one thread 😬

This.

The truth of the matter is that Microsoft has a monumental track record when it comes to over-promising and under-delivering. To suggest that they don't care about selling consoles is not true. I'd like to hear them say that to their investors. It seems like so many people lack the basic ability to be skeptical when being fed information from a source that is trying to market their own product. Of course they are going to try and hype it up. But the amount of bullshit Microsoft has tried to pass off as legit should be downright illegal.

Does anyone remember Project Natal? Jesus, all of their tech demonstrations were entirely acted out. I still remember that tech demo where the girl had a conversation with Milo, and Milo responded back to her in a non-computerized voice. As though Microsoft had created an AI capable of understanding and holding a conversation with someone without sounding robotic. And this was a decade ago. Even today, the very best in digital voice synthesis (Siri, Alexa) is still easy to distinguish from an actual human, and they are nowhere near capable of retaining memories and having an emotional conversation as depicted in the Milo demo.

I dunno, but I've always sort of noticed a layer of BS when it comes to their marketing.



Ignoring platform preference I agree with Mummelmann.
I'd prefer physical copies even in this age of Steam on the PC or Google Stadia.



Good to see this site is still going