If you elect someone despite all the warning signs and the constant stream of information about their bad history. You deserve that someone as president and whatever they bring. It's not like it was 2 really good candidates who were sensible and championed the betterment of humanity, there was only one. And you chose the other guy. The guy who drags you to war, tries to cut social security, is an obstacle to your healthcare.

Also Socialism doesn't fail Europe is doing fine and I would hardly call roads, universal healthcare, public schools and universities, universal education, the post office, emergency services, etc a failure. And US is also socialist already. It's just corporate socialism because guess what, subsidies, grants and bailouts are also socialism. It gives people freedom to do things, not breed dependence. It provides economic freedom. The US is socalism for the rich while rugged individualism for the poor. Socialism has been successful in keeping democracy alive because pure capitalism devolves into oligarchy and plutocracy. Socialis has it's flaws but it's an awesome system and mixed with some capitalism, it is the best system humans have developed.

I’m from Canada and I understand a system that’s capitalist with socialist social services. That said Europe is by and large economically stagnated (the northern countries anyway). Don’t think Americans are really to get skyrocketed tax rates to pay for these initiatives. Cause it won’t just be the rich paying. Point being, Bernie had 2 tries and failed both times. There is a reason for this. His ideas are good on paper but the follow through has a lot of potential for disaster in implementation. 

Btw I don’t like trump, but from what I hear the economy is overall improved since he became president. Comment on that?

The economy is great for the rich and wealthy. For most people though, their wages haven't increased by more than 1%. That's how the US has been for decades now. The economy looks good because the rich are getting so much richer while the poor and working class are the same or poorer when accounting for inflation.

Also Bernie didn't lose because people don't support his ideas. His policies are still widely favoured looking at exit polls. It's this mythical"electibility" argument that he lost. 

The unemployment percentage went down. Working class or not that’s an improvement over welfare. 

Bernies polls also showed he was going to win as well. If the problem was his electability then he is a glutton for punishment trying twice. Definition of insanity comes to mind. 

Just going to stop you right there.  You are obviously not familiar with Bernie Sanders policies and/or are only parroting talking points from the right.

Do you ever hear him advocating for the public ownership over the means of production? Hmm? Do you ever hear him talking about collectivism? Central planning? Price controls? Dissolution of all privatization? The Use over Profit model? Single party government?

No. You don't. Because he's never advocated for any of it.  And he's certainly never presented any as a policy. 

So why are you associating him and his policies with countries that are not aligned with him and his policies?

Your last paragraph is idiotic and you can't survive with a job in the US if you're paid like 13 an hour or less. Those sorts of jobs being given our might be a little bit good, but not a lot of good. Also how are unemployment stats measured? That makes a huge difference

Sure, it's a slippery slope in the same way that Donald Trump is a slippery slope into totalitarianism.  Right?

Seriously though, how in the hell do you go from universal healthcare to.......any of that?   Do you recognize just how far down the slope those are?

If you have the data, lay it out.  Always better to be informed.  Though I myself don't see much of his plans reaching beyond the Nordic Model. 

Keep in mind, one program is far different from an entire economic model being based on classic socialism as was alluded to by Sales2099.  We have several markets or portions of the economy that are fully under government control but no one would date say those programs are the slippery slope to Venezuela, Cuba, old Vietnam, etc...  Which were far more communistic with totalitarian authorities than just socialistic economies.

For the most part, we've had some solid dialogues in the more serious threads. The tone that gets set by the first post is often the tone that carries through the rest of the thread...mostly.  If you can set the narrative as one of constructive discourse, they'll be great threads.

Also, are you familiar with the concept of overshooting?  If follows that you shoot for the stars but if you only hit the moon, that's great too.  A lot of Sanders plans were a reach but they did move the public discussion further left overall such that even if we can't get the stars, we might still get the moon. 

You are the prime example of why Joe will lose. He has no chance of expanding his base. The democrats that will vote for Joe will also vote for Bernie, just like Clinton. The republicans will vote for Trump over Joe, like you are and just like Clinton. If anyone has a ceiling, it's a moderate corporatist democrat. The imaginary conservative democrat voter doesn't exist and there's no use going there. The aim is to get people to vote who don't. And those are the people Bernie does best with, whether the youth or the independents. That's why I said to mobilize and drag the youth to vote because they have become too apathetic to all parties. They believe the DNC will rig it anyways so what's the use anyways. But if Bernie wins the primaries, they are much more likely to come out and vote in the general than the primaries. 

The best chance of beating Trump is Bernie. Trump can beat Bernie but it's harder for him. Trump can more easily beat Joe.