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Runa216 said:

I love that the critics of CRT don't actually know what it is/does. Just another delicious layer of hilarity that comes from certain political groups.

CRT is the school of thought that says we need to be aware of our racial history and how it impacts the current cultural landscape. If you default to assuming "CRT is making white kids hate their country", maybe you need to reflect on the history of your country. If thinking critically made them realize that the nation they live in isn't perfect and has flaws, then maybe that says more about the accurate reflection of history vs your rose tinted glasses than it does about scholars and educators.

Seriously, if critical thinking reveals imperfections in history, and you personally think that's somehow offensive, then you are not on the right side of history. IT's just that simple. If you're the type of person who defaults to 'CRT makes kids hate themselves' and 'Teaching CRT is anti-patriotic' without actually factoring in any of the scholarly work that goes towards those conclusions or are incapable of self-reflecting enough to think that maybe there's something poignant there...well, I just don't even know what to say to you or your kind anymore.

You're outright admitting that you've got a perspective borne of revisionist history and that anything critical of that perception is seen as a threat. that's not the mindset of someone who is right about stuff. People who are correct generally don't act that way.

Well if we ask John Oliver himself, someone I understand you hold in high regard, yes. CRT can potentially screw kids up sometimes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EICp1vGlh_U (9:00, 9:55)



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KLAMarine said:
Runa216 said:

I love that the critics of CRT don't actually know what it is/does. Just another delicious layer of hilarity that comes from certain political groups.

CRT is the school of thought that says we need to be aware of our racial history and how it impacts the current cultural landscape. If you default to assuming "CRT is making white kids hate their country", maybe you need to reflect on the history of your country. If thinking critically made them realize that the nation they live in isn't perfect and has flaws, then maybe that says more about the accurate reflection of history vs your rose tinted glasses than it does about scholars and educators.

Seriously, if critical thinking reveals imperfections in history, and you personally think that's somehow offensive, then you are not on the right side of history. IT's just that simple. If you're the type of person who defaults to 'CRT makes kids hate themselves' and 'Teaching CRT is anti-patriotic' without actually factoring in any of the scholarly work that goes towards those conclusions or are incapable of self-reflecting enough to think that maybe there's something poignant there...well, I just don't even know what to say to you or your kind anymore.

You're outright admitting that you've got a perspective borne of revisionist history and that anything critical of that perception is seen as a threat. that's not the mindset of someone who is right about stuff. People who are correct generally don't act that way.

Well if we ask John Oliver himself, someone I understand you hold in high regard, yes. CRT can potentially screw kids up sometimes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EICp1vGlh_U (9:00, 9:55)

Maybe we need to first stop calling everything CRT because then you would appear to truly understand the subject but that would mean you actually understood what this video was saying. For conservatives, everything is CRT that deals with race which of course is in correct.  The first order to understand CRT is to actually look up exactly what its about and then separate the political portion that is basically a whole different subject.  As Rona clearly stated, the majority of people have absolutely no clue what CRT is, since they just knee jerk into the pollical aspect which is a false narrative.



Machiavellian said:
KLAMarine said:

Well if we ask John Oliver himself, someone I understand you hold in high regard, yes. CRT can potentially screw kids up sometimes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EICp1vGlh_U (9:00, 9:55)

Maybe we need to first stop calling everything CRT because then you would appear to truly understand the subject but that would mean you actually understood what this video was saying. For conservatives, everything is CRT that deals with race which of course is in correct.  The first order to understand CRT is to actually look up exactly what its about and then separate the political portion that is basically a whole different subject.  As Rona clearly stated, the majority of people have absolutely no clue what CRT is, since they just knee jerk into the pollical aspect which is a false narrative.

I have to be honest, I can see why some have trouble understanding what CRT is. JWeinCom's own link refers to it as it not being a noun but a verb:

"CRT is not a noun, but a verb."

So one can CRT something? Can I CRT my textbook? I'm going to critical race theory my lunch today. Critical race theory: I'm 99% certain 'theory' is a noun, not a verb and what do you know, this dictionary here declares it a noun.

MW also calls CRT a noun...

"It cannot be confined to a static and narrow definition but is considered to be an evolving and malleable practice"

This just makes CRT more difficult to work with if its definition is fluid rather than static... I can sort of see why Tucker Carlson is confused by CRT...

https://www.americanbar.org/groups/crsj/publications/human_rights_magazine_home/civil-rights-reimagining-policing/a-lesson-on-critical-race-theory/



KLAMarine said:

Well if we ask John Oliver himself, someone I understand you hold in high regard, yes. CRT can potentially screw kids up sometimes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EICp1vGlh_U (9:00, 9:55)

IT's honestly quite profound just how absolutely you've missed all the points brought up in this thread and especially in that video. 

I've watched that clip, that episode multiple times and I can assure you he does not say what you think he says. And until we can agree on a single reality I just don't see discussions with you being fruitful on either side. 

You see what you want to see, as filtered through your personal views. Others see the world for what it really is. 

CRT is the idea that we should think more critically about how race has impacted history and how it continues to impact modern society through its own ripple effects. If 'thinking critically' of something leads you to be offended, maybe that says more about you than it does the reality of the situation.



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Runa216 said:
KLAMarine said:

Well if we ask John Oliver himself, someone I understand you hold in high regard, yes. CRT can potentially screw kids up sometimes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EICp1vGlh_U (9:00, 9:55)

IT's honestly quite profound just how absolutely you've missed all the points brought up in this thread and especially in that video. 

I've watched that clip, that episode multiple times and I can assure you he does not say what you think he says. And until we can agree on a single reality I just don't see discussions with you being fruitful on either side. 

You see what you want to see, as filtered through your personal views. Others see the world for what it really is. 

CRT is the idea that we should think more critically about how race has impacted history and how it continues to impact modern society through its own ripple effects. If 'thinking critically' of something leads you to be offended, maybe that says more about you than it does the reality of the situation.

So what sort of critical thinking have you been up to thanks to CRT? I'd love to get your perspective...



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KLAMarine said:
Machiavellian said:

Maybe we need to first stop calling everything CRT because then you would appear to truly understand the subject but that would mean you actually understood what this video was saying. For conservatives, everything is CRT that deals with race which of course is in correct.  The first order to understand CRT is to actually look up exactly what its about and then separate the political portion that is basically a whole different subject.  As Rona clearly stated, the majority of people have absolutely no clue what CRT is, since they just knee jerk into the pollical aspect which is a false narrative.

I have to be honest, I can see why some have trouble understanding what CRT is. JWeinCom's own link refers to it as it not being a noun but a verb:

"CRT is not a noun, but a verb."

So one can CRT something? Can I CRT my textbook? I'm going to critical race theory my lunch today. Critical race theory: I'm 99% certain 'theory' is a noun, not a verb and what do you know, this dictionary here declares it a noun.

MW also calls CRT a noun...

"It cannot be confined to a static and narrow definition but is considered to be an evolving and malleable practice"

This just makes CRT more difficult to work with if its definition is fluid rather than static... I can sort of see why Tucker Carlson is confused by CRT...

https://www.americanbar.org/groups/crsj/publications/human_rights_magazine_home/civil-rights-reimagining-policing/a-lesson-on-critical-race-theory/

So lets dispense with the word play and get to the meat.  Exactly what part of CRT are you actually interested in, the political part or the actually academic part since both are actually not the same.  I believe we have already established that the political part actually really has nothing to do with the academic part since CRT is not taught outside of a university.  Even the diversity subjects that are taught in some schools doesn't even come close to what CRT actually discusses. 

For example you state that Tucker is confused by CRT but actually Tucker is not confused at all.  Tucker does not really care about CRT the academic part and instead looks to give a reality to CRT the political part by redefining it for the purpose of his audience.  The easiest way to manipulate people is to use their own bias against them. As with most people who get their news from a talking head, taking the time to learn about a subject is to much work, instead just let someone tell you instead and form your opinion from there.



KLAMarine said:

Well if we ask John Oliver himself, someone I understand you hold in high regard, yes. CRT can potentially screw kids up sometimes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EICp1vGlh_U (9:00, 9:55)

Damn, the dishonesty in this take is palpable. 



I see this thread has devolved into people arguing with each other about whether or not they know what they are arguing about.



Dulfite said:

I see this thread has devolved into people arguing with each other about whether or not they know what they are arguing about.

Well when one half of the argument doesn't seem to understand what it is they're arguing for or against, it's hard to have any sort of civil debate. 

It's a consistent problem with some folks. Christopher Rufo even said that they wanted to ruin the brand of CRT by making people default to 'critical race theory' any time something came up that made them feel self-conscious about what has happened between races. They want anything crazy on the TV to automatically associate it with CRT. And it worked. we've got people all over the place spewing nonsense about how CRT is bad because it makes white children hate their country or resent being white and on so many levels that's just absolutely NOT what it does, not what its goal is, and not who it's taught to. 

Their takes are so misguided and factually wrong on so many levels it's hard to know what the first step is in educating them in a way they won't just brush it off and think we're brainwashed or that we're just pushing an agenda. 

IT's almost like CRT as an academic concept is university-level and not easy to teach to the masses, especially when the masses don't want to hear uncomfortable truths. 

It SHOULD be a chance for solemn self-reflection and an opportunity for self-improvement, but instead it's just seen as an attack on American values. Which shows a level of insecurity I just don't know how to deal with. I'm a smart person, but I'm not 'educating conservatives about advanced legal theory' smart. And my very basic 'CRT is the teaching of how racial history impacts modern society' explanation is doing much of anything to convince anyone. It's easier to just go 'it's indoctrination, teaching the next generation to hate their country and hate white people' because SOME people are so insecure at the even remote, tangential, frankly unrelated possibility that maybe they'll be treated as bad as black people were 150 years ago. 

IT's white privilege. 



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Runa216 said:
Dulfite said:

I see this thread has devolved into people arguing with each other about whether or not they know what they are arguing about.

Well when one half of the argument doesn't seem to understand what it is they're arguing for or against, it's hard to have any sort of civil debate. 

It's a consistent problem with some folks. Christopher Rufo even said that they wanted to ruin the brand of CRT by making people default to 'critical race theory' any time something came up that made them feel self-conscious about what has happened between races. They want anything crazy on the TV to automatically associate it with CRT. And it worked. we've got people all over the place spewing nonsense about how CRT is bad because it makes white children hate their country or resent being white and on so many levels that's just absolutely NOT what it does, not what its goal is, and not who it's taught to. 

Their takes are so misguided and factually wrong on so many levels it's hard to know what the first step is in educating them in a way they won't just brush it off and think we're brainwashed or that we're just pushing an agenda. 

IT's almost like CRT as an academic concept is university-level and not easy to teach to the masses, especially when the masses don't want to hear uncomfortable truths. 

It SHOULD be a chance for solemn self-reflection and an opportunity for self-improvement, but instead it's just seen as an attack on American values. Which shows a level of insecurity I just don't know how to deal with. I'm a smart person, but I'm not 'educating conservatives about advanced legal theory' smart. And my very basic 'CRT is the teaching of how racial history impacts modern society' explanation is doing much of anything to convince anyone. It's easier to just go 'it's indoctrination, teaching the next generation to hate their country and hate white people' because SOME people are so insecure at the even remote, tangential, frankly unrelated possibility that maybe they'll be treated as bad as black people were 150 years ago. 

IT's white privilege. 

I can't really address CRT specifically. What I can address is how terrible it was, as a white teacher, to be told by black administrators that we should teach our students that white people are inherently evil. To even bring up conservative perspectives would bring terrible retribution down from the admins, and we always tried to along with liberal and independent perspectives, because that's what is fair. Students should learn about all perspectives and all religions. That same administrative team of principles literally said, "You wouldn't teach a bunch of Jews about Hitler either, would you?". Yes, yes we would! We learn from history, not trying to hide what happened! And I don't know any teachers that believe white people were in the right over slavery centuries ago. We aren't trying to hide that. We, of course, know our ancestors messed up. But teaching black and white students that white people are evil or more evil than the rest of mankind to this day? You've got to be kidding me! This isn't me exaggerating, this actually happened to me and my fellow social studies teachers. The amount of abuse I witnessed firsthand and heard from fellow teachers I worked with about how they were dealt with by black administrators was horrifying, all because we were born white. I had the privilege of having black administrators make me out to be the bad guy simply because of the color of my skin.

So I don't know what CRT teaches, frankly I don't care. These administrators used CRT to justify their actions. Maybe it isn't CRT's fault, maybe it is, but regardless, there are people interpreting things from it to justify horrible actions and perspectives done upon white people who had nothing to do with slavery.