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Forums - Sony Discussion - Is Sony saving VR?

VAMatt said:
twintail said:

i am just going by Wikipedia here, but in 2016 Sony published 9 VR compatible games. MS published 6 X1 games. in 2017, the numbers were 6 and 8 respectively. In 2018, its is 5 to 4.

Now these numbers are not 100% accurate since I am doing this quickly but Sony has been publishing roughly the same amount of PSVR titles as MS is publishing games for the X1.

I would disagree that Sony isn't putting in the effort for VR software. They have even built a new studio just for VR (granted they have not announced their first game yet)

Faelco said:

Sony developed and published the best VR game of the year, Astro Bot (winner at the Game Awards at least). And they release new good VR games frequently. You usually hear the opposite "Oh, they announced too many VR games, I don't care about those" after each of their conferences.

I would love to know who, for you, pushes more VR software than Sony. And I mean real software, not "5 years old game: VR mode"...

My point is not that Sony isn't releasing VR games.  My point is that of all the developers out there, the one that you would expect to make the big budget system sellers is Sony.  Yet, they have failed to do so.  There really aren't any system seller VR games, unfortunately,  

Nobody except the hardware guys can possibly come up with justification for putting big development money into VR game development, as the install bases are too small for big budget games by third parties to be profitable.  Sony is the leader in VR hardware sales, which would usually lead to some big games that in turn drive further hardware sales.  We've seen it with PS4, for sure.  But, they haven't done so for PSVR. 

That shows me that for one reason or another, Sony has determined that there isn't big money to be made in VR right now.  And that spells problems for the future of VR. 

Except Batman, Driveclub, Rush of Blood are very fine and good budgeted games for VR made or comissioned by Sony, while one of the best implementations (RE7) certainly have been financed by Sony.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

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pokoko said:

Perhaps "saved" in the same way Nintendo "saved" console gaming before, in that someone will do it eventually.  The only question is timing and who steps into that void.  Sony probably understands that.  With technology, sometimes being in position to take advantage of technological breakthroughs is of utmost importance.  That's what they're doing now by establishing VR as a part of the Playstation brand.

More than anything, I'm surprised that it's not Microsoft.  At least, not yet.  They have the money to force their way into any market at any time (though they don't always succeed).  The Xbox track record on that front hasn't been spectacular, however, so maybe they're being a bit more careful.  Of course, I wouldn't be shocked to see the next Xbox launching with their own Windows VR solution.

Speaking of Xbox, I hope Sony remembers the Xbox One launch and remembers that consumers who have a choice don't much care for being forced into new things, especially expensive new things.  No matter how much they push it, they need to keep it optional.

I also wouldn't be surprised to see them drop it out of the blue.  Sony has definitely earned their reputation for not fully supporting their own products.

 

I just started watching Made in the Abyss. About 7 episodes in so far pretty interesting anime.



DonFerrari said:
VAMatt said:

My point is not that Sony isn't releasing VR games.  My point is that of all the developers out there, the one that you would expect to make the big budget system sellers is Sony.  Yet, they have failed to do so.  There really aren't any system seller VR games, unfortunately,  

Nobody except the hardware guys can possibly come up with justification for putting big development money into VR game development, as the install bases are too small for big budget games by third parties to be profitable.  Sony is the leader in VR hardware sales, which would usually lead to some big games that in turn drive further hardware sales.  We've seen it with PS4, for sure.  But, they haven't done so for PSVR. 

That shows me that for one reason or another, Sony has determined that there isn't big money to be made in VR right now.  And that spells problems for the future of VR. 

Except Batman, Driveclub, Rush of Blood are very fine and good budgeted games for VR made or comissioned by Sony, while one of the best implementations (RE7) certainly have been financed by Sony.

I don't think any of those games (save for RE7) are big-budget blockbusters, and none of them moved systems that I'm aware of. Batman in particular was disappointing to many people.

As for resident evil 7, while it had VR support it was certainly not just a VR game. But, I'll grant you that this is probably the biggest AAA entry into the VR space. It made a lot of noise. This conversation reminds me that I need to play it.



PSVR has a new bundle out with Borderlands 2 and Beat Saber, still pushing it.
I wanted a physical copy of Borderlands 2 yet it doesn't seem to exist.

Let's be real about Sony having to deliver big budget blockbusters in VR. VR games are still in a discovery phase, see what works and what doesn't. You can't spend 100 million on making a game for an install base of less than 4 million, certainly not with the inherent risk it turns out to be a Batman instead of an Astrobot. Sony is doing very well at diversity and trying out different things for psvr. Better that than blow the budget on one big game that might never make it out of development hell. MS could throw billions at it like they did with XBox and Kinect, however Sony doesn't have that luxury.

Anyway the tide is slowly turning. Nowadays there is less noise about VR making people sick or isolated and more positive news about game experiences. Steady as she goes.



VAMatt said:
DonFerrari said:

Except Batman, Driveclub, Rush of Blood are very fine and good budgeted games for VR made or comissioned by Sony, while one of the best implementations (RE7) certainly have been financed by Sony.

I don't think any of those games (save for RE7) are big-budget blockbusters, and none of them moved systems that I'm aware of. Batman in particular was disappointing to many people.

As for resident evil 7, while it had VR support it was certainly not just a VR game. But, I'll grant you that this is probably the biggest AAA entry into the VR space. It made a lot of noise. This conversation reminds me that I need to play it.

You can't really blockbuster on a userbase of 3M. But considering attack ratio of about 7 games per owner I would say it's pretty healthy.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."

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twintail said:
VAMatt said:

My point is not that Sony isn't releasing VR games.  My point is that of all the developers out there, the one that you would expect to make the big budget system sellers is Sony.  Yet, they have failed to do so.  There really aren't any system seller VR games, unfortunately,  

Nobody except the hardware guys can possibly come up with justification for putting big development money into VR game development, as the install bases are too small for big budget games by third parties to be profitable.  Sony is the leader in VR hardware sales, which would usually lead to some big games that in turn drive further hardware sales.  We've seen it with PS4, for sure.  But, they haven't done so for PSVR. 

That shows me that for one reason or another, Sony has determined that there isn't big money to be made in VR right now.  And that spells problems for the future of VR. 

It's pretty strange to compare a console to a console peripheral requiring said console, especially one with a high price tag involved. 

So of course there can't be AAA budget investment in a game right now, but that doesn't mean that their current lineup is lacking. 

DriveClub, Rigs, Farpoint, Firewall, Wipeout and Astrobot (especially this) are all strong investments. Blood & Truth and Dreams still have to release, and those aren't small investments either. 


Just because they don't have a system seller doesn't mean there is a lack of trying. SCEJ are making VR games, Sony London is making games, contracts with US companies for games. And don't forget that they built a whole new studio for VR game development, Manchester Studio.

Besides, PSVR has a software ratio of 7:1. There is money in VR in its current form for Sony.  

I don't disagree with any of those statements. But, there really has been no AAA level investment in psvr games. If there had been some, maybe sales would be a lot higher. We don't know that.  

I should probably walk back my statement from my original comment in this thread. Clearly Sony has done quite a bit to further virtual reality.  But, I think it is also true the Sony would have been the most obvious candidate for pproduction of a big-time, system seller, AAA type of game.  They have not attempted to make a game of this sort, at least not that I'm aware.  And, as we see mentioned on this site all the time, the software sells the hardware.  

I'm happy with my psvr. I think it's cool to play around with, and I'm glad to have a virtual reality device that did not require a massive investment on my part. It gets a steady streams of games, some of which appear to have a fair amount of effort and investments behind them.  But, I had higher hopes for VR a few years ago. With gigantic names like Sony, Facebook,   HTC, Samsung, and Valve behind the technology, I thought we'd see some real serious investment in software.  The fact that we have not seen this investment leads me to believe that these companies have determined that there is not going to be widespread appeal in the gaming market for this stuff in the near future.  And I find that disappointing.



Sony are doing by far the most for VR. Hopefully the support on PS5 is even better.



twintail said:
VAMatt said:
I actually don't feel like Sony has done very much for VR at all. They're making the hardware available, but they haven't put any real money into software development. That's the thing that first parties are generally good for when we talk about supporting hardware. Sony has proven more or less useless in that regard.

i am just going by Wikipedia here, but in 2016 Sony published 9 VR compatible games. MS published 6 X1 games. in 2017, the numbers were 6 and 8 respectively. In 2018, its is 5 to 4.

Now these numbers are not 100% accurate since I am doing this quickly but Sony has been publishing roughly the same amount of PSVR titles as MS is publishing games for the X1.

I would disagree that Sony isn't putting in the effort for VR software. They have even built a new studio just for VR (granted they have not announced their first game yet)

Cloudman said:
I feel the more fitting word is 'relevant' rather than saving, as VR doesn't really seem like tech that's really been dying, but rather has just been... there. It's something that's never really caught on, but attempts have been made on it many times. As for the answer to the question, not sure really. PSVR isn't really something I hear mentioned when the topic is brought up. Usually it's Oculus I hear about, and how that's the best VR tech currently. I'd give Sony part of the credit, but not the sole contributor.

I suppose it depends on how we look at contributing to VRs growth. But I dont think PSVR is out of the conversation. There have been stats that have shown PSVR as having the highest shipment numbers for 2017 and 2018, and highest sales for 2018. According to Sony they have sold 3 million VR units and had 21 million pieces of software sold for VR use in 2 years on the market. What is really important is for all VR to be viable going forward. So whoever is part of the conversation is good for those who want more VR gaming

Well, I mean I didn't say they were out of it. I recognize they're part of the push for VR currently. Personally, I wouldn't say the main driving force though. I'd say theirs is the most accessible device available.



 

              

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Id say they play an important part. However, like it is with all technology, it evolves with time. Mobile phones for instance didnt start out as super slim multi purpose devices. Once chunky, cumbersome, expensive and nowhere near as widespread as it is today. It took decades to evolve into the smartphone.



Hunting Season is done...

VAMatt said:
twintail said:

It's pretty strange to compare a console to a console peripheral requiring said console, especially one with a high price tag involved. 

So of course there can't be AAA budget investment in a game right now, but that doesn't mean that their current lineup is lacking. 

DriveClub, Rigs, Farpoint, Firewall, Wipeout and Astrobot (especially this) are all strong investments. Blood & Truth and Dreams still have to release, and those aren't small investments either. 


Just because they don't have a system seller doesn't mean there is a lack of trying. SCEJ are making VR games, Sony London is making games, contracts with US companies for games. And don't forget that they built a whole new studio for VR game development, Manchester Studio.

Besides, PSVR has a software ratio of 7:1. There is money in VR in its current form for Sony.  

I don't disagree with any of those statements. But, there really has been no AAA level investment in psvr games. If there had been some, maybe sales would be a lot higher. We don't know that.  

I should probably walk back my statement from my original comment in this thread. Clearly Sony has done quite a bit to further virtual reality.  But, I think it is also true the Sony would have been the most obvious candidate for pproduction of a big-time, system seller, AAA type of game.  They have not attempted to make a game of this sort, at least not that I'm aware.  And, as we see mentioned on this site all the time, the software sells the hardware.  

I'm happy with my psvr. I think it's cool to play around with, and I'm glad to have a virtual reality device that did not require a massive investment on my part. It gets a steady streams of games, some of which appear to have a fair amount of effort and investments behind them.  But, I had higher hopes for VR a few years ago. With gigantic names like Sony, Facebook,   HTC, Samsung, and Valve behind the technology, I thought we'd see some real serious investment in software.  The fact that we have not seen this investment leads me to believe that these companies have determined that there is not going to be widespread appeal in the gaming market for this stuff in the near future.  And I find that disappointing.

I agree with all your points. But I would say that 2 things are missing for they to really put AAA game exclusive on VR even considering they are willing to lose money. The display/processing needs to get much higher so they can have high level graphics plus they need a concept that would be "revolutionary" game so it become a system seller by itself.

That will probably be more likely to happen on start of next gen.



duduspace11 "Well, since we are estimating costs, Pokemon Red/Blue did cost Nintendo about $50m to make back in 1996"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=8808363

Mr Puggsly: "Hehe, I said good profit. You said big profit. Frankly, not losing money is what I meant by good. Don't get hung up on semantics"

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=9008994

Azzanation: "PS5 wouldn't sold out at launch without scalpers."