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Forums - Microsoft Discussion - Soul Calibur VI is awful on Xbox One.

Mr Puggsly said:

Instead of nitpicking every game stressing what each does well, Im gonna get back to the problem with SCVI inparticular. Its an ugly game game that doesent leverage the capabilities of base hardware. I also suspect the optimization is poor.

I have Tekken 7 as well, I booted it today, that looks better at the same resolution and seems to struggle less with loading. Also, loading in character models at the character select screen is a terrible idea if the game chugs and freezes during. Thats just an example of poor design.

If UE4 is very demanding, then scale back the presentation. Even at 1080p/60 fps they should be able to create a game that looks better than SCV. I prefer the presentation of DOA5 just because the presentation is crisp, good post processing effects, essentially it looks seemless for the hardware and loads quickly.

Load times matter to me because I find myself losing interest between fights. I wanted SFV to have an Arcade mode at launch. But I dont use it much because the loading drives me crazy.

I get the impression developers will keep using UE4 because its easy to work with. SCVI actually looks fine on X1X, they cant be building for that in mind.

SCVI's optimization is somehow deemed "poor" yet Tekken 7 runs at the same resolution as well ? OK then I guess both games must be poorly optimized by your logic ... 

@Bold Dude, you're comparing a machine that has 4.6x the compute power to another one so of course you're going to see chunky pixels on the X1 and there's nothing Bandai Namco is going to do about it either. Not so coincidentally, both Tekken 7 and SCVI are developed from the same exact studio using UE4 ... (since the start of the generation there's a very good reason why the X1 is known for it's "resolutiongate") 

I don't remember DF mentioning loading times being an issue and you're complaining about a 3 second character model load which includes the character picture animation as well ? Somehow I feel that your criticisms are misguided ... 

If they want to produce something "better" as a minimum at 1080p/60fps then they need to stop using Unreal Engine 4 cause there's only 4 games built on the engine currently that can even manage 60fps on base consoles with only 2 of them reaching 1080p and both look nowhere near as graphically advanced as compared to what Bandai Namco puts out ... 

Developers will keep using Unreal Engine 4 since they don't want to make their own damn game/graphics engines and the Japanese developers like it because of Japanese documentation but it is not an ideal model that they should adopt since the ideal model is building custom high performance engines for high end game graphics like western developers ... 



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John2290 said:
NobleTeam360 said:
*throws base xb1 in trash can*
*buys Xbox One X*
*feels the power*
*goes SSJ God*

SSJ?

Super Saiyan. 



fatslob-:O said:
Mr Puggsly said:

Instead of nitpicking every game stressing what each does well, Im gonna get back to the problem with SCVI inparticular. Its an ugly game game that doesent leverage the capabilities of base hardware. I also suspect the optimization is poor.

I have Tekken 7 as well, I booted it today, that looks better at the same resolution and seems to struggle less with loading. Also, loading in character models at the character select screen is a terrible idea if the game chugs and freezes during. Thats just an example of poor design.

If UE4 is very demanding, then scale back the presentation. Even at 1080p/60 fps they should be able to create a game that looks better than SCV. I prefer the presentation of DOA5 just because the presentation is crisp, good post processing effects, essentially it looks seemless for the hardware and loads quickly.

Load times matter to me because I find myself losing interest between fights. I wanted SFV to have an Arcade mode at launch. But I dont use it much because the loading drives me crazy.

I get the impression developers will keep using UE4 because its easy to work with. SCVI actually looks fine on X1X, they cant be building for that in mind.

SCVI's optimization is somehow deemed "poor" yet Tekken 7 runs at the same resolution as well ? OK then I guess both games must be poorly optimized by your logic ... 

@Bold Dude, you're comparing a machine that has 4.6x the compute power to another one so of course you're going to see chunky pixels on the X1 and there's nothing Bandai Namco is going to do about it either. Not so coincidentally, both Tekken 7 and SCVI are developed from the same exact studio using UE4 ... (since the start of the generation there's a very good reason why the X1 is known for it's "resolutiongate") 

I don't remember DF mentioning loading times being an issue and you're complaining about a 3 second character model load which includes the character picture animation as well ? Somehow I feel that your criticisms are misguided ... 

If they want to produce something "better" as a minimum at 1080p/60fps then they need to stop using Unreal Engine 4 cause there's only 4 games built on the engine currently that can even manage 60fps on base consoles with only 2 of them reaching 1080p and both look nowhere near as graphically advanced as compared to what Bandai Namco puts out ... 

Developers will keep using Unreal Engine 4 since they don't want to make their own damn game/graphics engines and the Japanese developers like it because of Japanese documentation but it is not an ideal model that they should adopt since the ideal model is building custom high performance engines for high end game graphics like western developers ... 

I think Tekken 7 has better post processing effects, better character models, and shadows dont look like blobs. SCVI is just an overall unpolished looking game. One difference might be more demanding backdrops on SCVI, Im suggesting pull back the visuals amd create something that looks better on base consoles. 1 on 1 fighting should be this taxing and unpolished on current consoles.

Will you stop being so combative for a moment and listen, you're misinterpreting because of that. The problem isnt the X1 or even PS4 are so weak, the problem is SCVI being so demanding as if it was built with X1X and Pro as lead platforms. I would rather have less demanding graphics that does a higher resolution and has a cleaner presentation, maybe faster loading, maybe like DOA5. Certainly not great visuals on 8th gen consoles, but certainly a more polished looking game that gets to the action quickly.

DF mentions load times randomly, not a big focus for them. I play a lot of fighting and most dont chug at the character select. Just use pictures if thats the case.

Maybe UE4 is the problem or maybe theyre pushing effects too hard. I know Dragon Ball FighterX is lower quality visuals but its an argueably better looking UE4 game at 1080p and 60 fps. Sub 1080p is acceptable with good post processing applied, SCVI seems to have little or none given it looks pixelated. On a side note, I've been playing Fight Night Champion recently, a last gen 720p game and its arguably easier on the eyes.

X and Pro seem to brute force UE4 into working well where base consoles fail. But SCVI is an exceptionally unpolished product on a base X1. I didnt think I needed a X1X to make fighter look decent.

Last edited by Mr Puggsly - on 09 December 2018

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Honestly, you don't get a great idea of the presentation based on those pictures or video. I mean on a base X1 the image is very noisy with pixels moving around.

I saw the DF video and was still expecting better.



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How does it compare to the ps4 version?



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twintail said:
fatslob-:O said:

Developers will keep using Unreal Engine 4 since they don't want to make their own damn game/graphics engines and the Japanese developers like it because of Japanese documentation but it is not an ideal model that they should adopt since the ideal model is building custom high performance engines for high end game graphics like western developers ... 

I dunno, I think its not quite this cut and dry. I can definitely see why JPN devs are probably avoiding putting effort into their own engines due to fears of sales to recuperate the investment, and so UE4 was a blessing. But I do agree that their own optimised engines would probably be better in the long run. The RE Engine, from Capcom, is pretty damn good I feel.

As for Western devs, I think it also depends on the publisher and the respective team. Like, for example, Days Gone: considering their history of games not selling that well, or projects being cancelled etc, taking UE4 an optimizing it for what they needed obviously made financial success. Building an engine for a a failed game would get the studio nowhere, and the only other open world engine they have, Decima, isn't really designed with the Horde system in mind.

So I suppose what I am saying is that yes, publisher specific engines are definitely more ideal but I don't think every situation calls for it. Engines like UE should always be a possibility depending on the scope or demands of the game, otherwise dev time is just going to go into making another engine first, or visions need to be compromised because the current publisher engines don't do what the dev requires.

On a side note, Days Gone is actually looking great for a UE4 game. At par with some of the 1st party games using inhouse engines. If they can hit 1080p/30 fps, it would be impressive.

Also, nobody is arguing Gears of War 4 or 5 is suffering by using UE4. Gears 4 is a notable game visually this gen and a technical marvel for the X1.

So maybe it takes effort and a big budget to really squeeze top tier visuals/performance out of UE4. But those are also the same projects that made great looking UE3 games. How many AAA projects can we really point to using UE4? Not many.



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for 3DS (3/5) - River City: Tokyo Rumble for 3DS (4/5) - Zelda: BotW for Wii U (5/5) - Zelda: BotW for Switch (5/5) - Zelda: Link's Awakening for Switch (4/5) - Rage 2 for X1X (4/5) - Rage for 360 (3/5) - Streets of Rage 4 for X1/PC (4/5) - Gears 5 for X1X (5/5) - Mortal Kombat 11 for X1X (5/5) - Doom 64 for N64 (emulator) (3/5) - Crackdown 3 for X1S/X1X (4/5) - Infinity Blade III - for iPad 4 (3/5) - Infinity Blade II - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Infinity Blade - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Wolfenstein: The Old Blood for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Origins for X1 (3/5) - Uncharted: Lost Legacy for PS4 (4/5) - EA UFC 3 for X1 (4/5) - Doom for X1 (4/5) - Titanfall 2 for X1 (4/5) - Super Mario 3D World for Wii U (4/5) - South Park: The Stick of Truth for X1 BC (4/5) - Call of Duty: WWII for X1 (4/5) -Wolfenstein II for X1 - (4/5) - Dead or Alive: Dimensions for 3DS (4/5) - Marvel vs Capcom: Infinite for X1 (3/5) - Halo Wars 2 for X1/PC (4/5) - Halo Wars: DE for X1 (4/5) - Tekken 7 for X1 (4/5) - Injustice 2 for X1 (4/5) - Yakuza 5 for PS3 (3/5) - Battlefield 1 (Campaign) for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Syndicate for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: MW Remastered for X1 (4/5) - Donkey Kong Country Returns for 3DS (4/5) - Forza Horizon 3 for X1 (5/5)

think-man said:
How does it compare to the ps4 version?

Well the PS4 version moves from 720p to 900p. Also some increased quality in effects. It looks noticeably better just based on the DF video.

The X1X version isn't just a resolution boost, its a big improvement on the graphics settings as well. Which is a great use of the X1X specs, but the base X1 version is just ugly.



Recently Completed
River City: Rival Showdown
for 3DS (3/5) - River City: Tokyo Rumble for 3DS (4/5) - Zelda: BotW for Wii U (5/5) - Zelda: BotW for Switch (5/5) - Zelda: Link's Awakening for Switch (4/5) - Rage 2 for X1X (4/5) - Rage for 360 (3/5) - Streets of Rage 4 for X1/PC (4/5) - Gears 5 for X1X (5/5) - Mortal Kombat 11 for X1X (5/5) - Doom 64 for N64 (emulator) (3/5) - Crackdown 3 for X1S/X1X (4/5) - Infinity Blade III - for iPad 4 (3/5) - Infinity Blade II - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Infinity Blade - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Wolfenstein: The Old Blood for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Origins for X1 (3/5) - Uncharted: Lost Legacy for PS4 (4/5) - EA UFC 3 for X1 (4/5) - Doom for X1 (4/5) - Titanfall 2 for X1 (4/5) - Super Mario 3D World for Wii U (4/5) - South Park: The Stick of Truth for X1 BC (4/5) - Call of Duty: WWII for X1 (4/5) -Wolfenstein II for X1 - (4/5) - Dead or Alive: Dimensions for 3DS (4/5) - Marvel vs Capcom: Infinite for X1 (3/5) - Halo Wars 2 for X1/PC (4/5) - Halo Wars: DE for X1 (4/5) - Tekken 7 for X1 (4/5) - Injustice 2 for X1 (4/5) - Yakuza 5 for PS3 (3/5) - Battlefield 1 (Campaign) for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Syndicate for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: MW Remastered for X1 (4/5) - Donkey Kong Country Returns for 3DS (4/5) - Forza Horizon 3 for X1 (5/5)

twintail said:

I dunno, I think its not quite this cut and dry. I can definitely see why JPN devs are probably avoiding putting effort into their own engines due to fears of sales to recuperate the investment, and so UE4 was a blessing. But I do agree that their own optimised engines would probably be better in the long run. The RE Engine, from Capcom, is pretty damn good I feel.

As for Western devs, I think it also depends on the publisher and the respective team. Like, for example, Days Gone: considering their history of games not selling that well, or projects being cancelled etc, taking UE4 an optimizing it for what they needed obviously made financial success. Building an engine for a a failed game would get the studio nowhere, and the only other open world engine they have, Decima, isn't really designed with the Horde system in mind.

So I suppose what I am saying is that yes, publisher specific engines are definitely more ideal but I don't think every situation calls for it. Engines like UE should always be a possibility depending on the scope or demands of the game, otherwise dev time is just going to go into making another engine first, or visions need to be compromised because the current publisher engines don't do what the dev requires.

For many of the smaller Japanese developers/publishers or projects, it does make sense to use generic engines like UE4 but even building a custom engine in their case can pay off tremendously like we see with the RE Engine from Capcom as you mentioned since it could be potentially used for many titles they work on but there's absolutely no excuse why much bigger publishers such as Square Enix or Bandai Namco can't do the same for their own in-house and affiliated developer teams since they undertake many projects ... 

Technical limitations may rear it's head far earlier when using a generic engine and that especially applies to UE4 since consoles aren't a priority anymore to Epic Games since the advent of UE3 but I don't blame them for it when they don't have stake anymore in consoles. Ever since Tencent acquired a 40% stake in Epic Games and Microsoft secured full rights to the Gears of War franchise they very clearly went astray from their own roots ... (even their original franchise Unreal Tournament took a massive backseat) 

UE3 was a good enough solution because Epic Games back then was far more motivated in delivering the cutting edge high performance graphics technology for console games instead mobile platforms such as Android, iOS, and even the Switch becoming the spotlight but UE4 on the other hand succeeded for totally different reasons ... 

Unlike UE3, it's successor UE4 stopped building upon it's solid technical foundation or fundamentals and management started heavily focusing on Japanese documentation along with mobile devices which is why we see a massive shift in the user's of these engines today. UE went from being a Western centric to a Japanese centric game engine. It's pretty clear Epic Games stopped answering calls from EA/Ubisoft and started taking calls from Bandai Namco/Square Enix ...

Hopefully, Sony Bend will use Decima for their next project instead because I don't think it was a technical limitation that stopped them from using it but rather it wasn't ready in time for mass production when they were developing Days Gone and I hope Capcom for their own sake they keep expanding on their new RE Engine which looks extremely promising since they had painstaking start for the first half of this generation by using interim solutions and we badly need to see a new Monster Hunter game built on it. As for Microsoft and their game studios, I don't know what they'll do next and I'm somewhat disappointed that Square Enix Japan has exited the race for developing a high end engine technology ... 

Not arguing the UE shouldn't be an option but for big high end graphics projects, it should be the absolute last resort since it'll very hard to get optimization issues under wraps ...