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Forums - Sony Discussion - Rumor: PS5 announcement coming mid 2019 and more info at PSX 2019

Mr Puggsly on 20 November 2018
Intrinsic said:
Mr Puggsly said:

Well a SDD can certainly speed up load times, I don't think the X1 interface is sluggish due to the HDD. For example, my Windows 10 UI is a lot faster with the same HDD tech.

Maybe they use a combination of both though. Like 128GB (or smaller) SSD for OS functions snappy and a 2TB (maybe 4TB) HDD for games. Based on prices I'm seeing, that would still be cheaper than a single 2TB SSD and using two storage devices seems to speed up load times on 8th gen consoles.

I think 2020 is gonna be too soon to make the Switch to SSD. But its certainly looking like a feasible option at some point of the 9th gen.

That would just complicate things. 

And when I said snappy I wasn't particularly talking about OS functions but more about loading times in games. The faster drives wouldn't even be making those better per say but at least keeping them on par with what we have this gen as opposed to them getting worse.

And again if they are going with SSDs then they wouldn't put 2TB in the consoles. At best 1TB. And in 2020 that can cost them as little as $40. Remember, prices for them are very different from prices for us at amazon and co.....

More importantly though the storage problem can easily be fixed. They can just put in 1TB SSD and give buyers the option of upgrading or expanding their storage.

Honestly, I wouldn't even be surprised if the nand modules are soldered directly onto the board to further save costs.  

If a $40 1TB SD is feasible, then it could happen. It would suck considering we are already hitting 100GB with the current assets. Frankly, I would probably opt to buy a standard external with 4GB just to have more storage even if it means longer loads.



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Intrinsic on 20 November 2018
Mr Puggsly said:

If a $40 1TB SD is feasible, then it could happen. It would suck considering we are already hitting 100GB with the current assets. Frankly, I would probably opt to buy a standard external with 4GB just to have more storage even if it means longer loads.

Right now a WD and Crucial 1TB M.2 ssd (sata 3) on amazon is $130.

By 2020 and if prices continue dropping as they have been as the industry has fully jumped onto SSD storage, a 1TB SSD could be as little as $80 on amazon. 

For OEMs that same SSD can cost as little as $40. And it will cost them even less if they opt to solder the chips directly onto the boards.

Right now a 1TB 2.5 inch HDD cost around $57. But costs sony and MS around $25-$30. 



Mr Puggsly on 20 November 2018
Intrinsic said:
Mr Puggsly said:

If a $40 1TB SD is feasible, then it could happen. It would suck considering we are already hitting 100GB with the current assets. Frankly, I would probably opt to buy a standard external with 4GB just to have more storage even if it means longer loads.

Right now a WD and Crucial 1TB M.2 ssd (sata 3) on amazon is $130.

By 2020 and if prices continue dropping as they have been as the industry has fully jumped onto SSD storage, a 1TB SSD could be as little as $80 on amazon. 

For OEMs that same SSD can cost as little as $40. And it will cost them even less if they opt to solder the chips directly onto the boards.

Right now a 1TB 2.5 inch HDD cost around $57. But costs sony and MS around $25-$30. 

A 1TB HDD is more like $40 on Amazon. $60 should get you 2TB.

But MS and Sony are opting for the 1TB even in their premium consoles. That leads me to believe they will go for whatever the cheaper option is and if they want to go up to 2TB they will lean on a standard HDD.



Recently Completed: 
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Intrinsic on 20 November 2018
Mr Puggsly said:
Intrinsic said:

Right now a WD and Crucial 1TB M.2 ssd (sata 3) on amazon is $130.

By 2020 and if prices continue dropping as they have been as the industry has fully jumped onto SSD storage, a 1TB SSD could be as little as $80 on amazon. 

For OEMs that same SSD can cost as little as $40. And it will cost them even less if they opt to solder the chips directly onto the boards.

Right now a 1TB 2.5 inch HDD cost around $57. But costs sony and MS around $25-$30. 

A 1TB HDD is more like $40 on Amazon. $60 should get you 2TB.

But MS and Sony are opting for the 1TB even in their premium consoles. That leads me to believe they will go for whatever the cheaper option is and if they want to go up to 2TB they will lean on a standard HDD.

Nope.... a 1TB is exactly $57 on amazon. Cheapest I saw.

And media jargon aside..... the Pro and the X are not "premium" consoles. They are just what building a $399 and $499 console in 2016 and 2017 respectively would have looked like. Probably the exact same BOM and definately even cheaper with the Pro. In 2013 ~$30 would have got them 500GB, in 2016 it would get them 1TB. Simple as that.

And that cheaper option thing is only if capacity is the driving factor to their storage choice. I don't think it will be. It just can't be. In 2020 using a HDD is like building in a limitation into the console that will define them for the rest of that generation. You think loading times are bad now when only filling 5GB or RAM? How do you think it will be when filling 16-20GB of RAM using a HDD? It aso affects how developers can build their games.

Just stop thinking a 2TB and instead focus on the fact that they have a "storage" budget of around $40. In 2020 $40 will probably be able to get a 2TB HDD but it will also be able to get a 1TB SSD. I believe they would go the SSD route. The ONLY thing using a HDD has got going for it is capacity. And thats a silly thing to focus on if building something that will last for the next 7yrs. Keep in mind... the nintendo switch launched with 32GB of storage....... but out the box they talked up expandable storage and external HDD support.

Last edited by Intrinsic - on 20 November 2018

ironmanDX on 20 November 2018

Sshd drives should also be considered imo. I remember a video from digital foundry showing considerable improvements in loading times.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hftHjOvcUtc

Consoles are about bang for your buck, first and foremost.



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KBG29 on 21 November 2018
Intrinsic said:
Mr Puggsly said:

A 1TB HDD is more like $40 on Amazon. $60 should get you 2TB.

But MS and Sony are opting for the 1TB even in their premium consoles. That leads me to believe they will go for whatever the cheaper option is and if they want to go up to 2TB they will lean on a standard HDD.

Nope.... a 1TB is exactly $57 on amazon. Cheapest I saw.

And media jargon aside..... the Pro and the X are not "premium" consoles. They are just what building a $399 and $499 console in 2016 and 2017 respectively would have looked like. Probably the exact same BOM and definately even cheaper with the Pro. In 2013 ~$30 would have got them 500GB, in 2016 it would get them 1TB. Simple as that.

And that cheaper option thing is only if capacity is the driving factor to their storage choice. I don't think it will be. It just can't be. In 2020 using a HDD is like building in a limitation into the console that will define them for the rest of that generation. You think loading times are bad now when only filling 5GB or RAM? How do you think it will be when filling 16-20GB of RAM using a HDD? It aso affects how developers can build their games.

Just stop thinking a 2TB and instead focus on the fact that they have a "storage" budget of around $40. In 2020 $40 will probably be able to get a 2TB HDD but it will also be able to get a 1TB SSD. I believe they would go the SSD route. The ONLY thing using a HDD has got going for it is capacity. And thats a silly thing to focus on if building something that will last for the next 7yrs. Keep in mind... the nintendo switch launched with 32GB of storage....... but out the box they talked up expandable storage and external HDD support.

Storage Capacity with SSD will be a short term issue. By the mid way point of next gen you will be able to get SSD's with twice the storage, at half the cost of a HDD. We'll be looking at 32, 64, & 128TB SSD's later in next gen, while 2.5"drives will not be progressing much further.

You are completely spot on though. PS5 has to have an M.2 NVMe slot. Thry can ship with built in storage and a user upgradable M.2 NVMe slot, or just let users swap out the NVMe stick.

I don't see a need for external drives late next gen as look internal SSD's will offer more than enough space for 100's of titles. 



Stop hate, let others live the life they were given. Everyone has their problems, and no one should have to feel ashamed for the way they were born. Be proud of who you are, encourage others to be proud of themselves. Learn, research, absorb everything around you. Nothing is meaningless, a purpose is placed on everything no matter how you perceive it. Discover how to love, and share that love with everything that you encounter. Help make existence a beautiful thing.

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Mr Puggsly on 21 November 2018
Intrinsic said:
Mr Puggsly said:

A 1TB HDD is more like $40 on Amazon. $60 should get you 2TB.

But MS and Sony are opting for the 1TB even in their premium consoles. That leads me to believe they will go for whatever the cheaper option is and if they want to go up to 2TB they will lean on a standard HDD.

Nope.... a 1TB is exactly $57 on amazon. Cheapest I saw.

And media jargon aside..... the Pro and the X are not "premium" consoles. They are just what building a $399 and $499 console in 2016 and 2017 respectively would have looked like. Probably the exact same BOM and definately even cheaper with the Pro. In 2013 ~$30 would have got them 500GB, in 2016 it would get them 1TB. Simple as that.

And that cheaper option thing is only if capacity is the driving factor to their storage choice. I don't think it will be. It just can't be. In 2020 using a HDD is like building in a limitation into the console that will define them for the rest of that generation. You think loading times are bad now when only filling 5GB or RAM? How do you think it will be when filling 16-20GB of RAM using a HDD? It aso affects how developers can build their games.

Just stop thinking a 2TB and instead focus on the fact that they have a "storage" budget of around $40. In 2020 $40 will probably be able to get a 2TB HDD but it will also be able to get a 1TB SSD. I believe they would go the SSD route. The ONLY thing using a HDD has got going for it is capacity. And thats a silly thing to focus on if building something that will last for the next 7yrs. Keep in mind... the nintendo switch launched with 32GB of storage....... but out the box they talked up expandable storage and external HDD support.

1TB for $40. https://www.amazon.com/Seagate-BarraCuda-Internal-3-5-Inch-ST1000DM010/dp/B01LNJBA2I/ref=sr_1_3?s=pc&ie=UTF8&qid=1542779714&sr=1-3&keywords=1tb+hdd

Lets not bother with semantics. When I say premium I mean the superior model. Whether you get the base or premium consoles, its 1TB HDD.

Standard HDDs are seem fine with X1X's 9GB of RAM. I've seen a good number of videos showing the X1X also loads faster using the same HDDs. I've seen what SSD can do and its impressive, but not essential at this point.

We will have to wait and see what happens in 2020. But if load times are fine with a standard HDD or hybrid, they might go that route. Frankly, I wouldn't be surprised they go with a 1TB SSD either if the price is right. Maybe MS will try an have it both ways by putting a cheap/large HDD in the console, but sell an external SSD. Essentially make faster loading a premium item.

Last edited by Mr Puggsly - on 21 November 2018

Recently Completed: 
River City: Rival Showdown for 3DS (3/5) - River City: Tokyo Rumble for 3DS (4/5) - Zelda: BotW for Wii U (5/5) - Zelda: BotW for Switch (5/5) - Zelda: Link's Awakening for Switch (4/5) - Rage 2 for X1X (4/5) - Rage for 360 (3/5) - Streets of Rage 4 for X1/PC (4/5) - Gears 5 for X1X (5/5) - Mortal Kombat 11 for X1X (5/5) - Doom 64 for N64 (emulator) (3/5) - Crackdown 3 for X1S/X1X (4/5) - Infinity Blade III - for iPad 4 (3/5) - Infinity Blade II - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Infinity Blade - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Wolfenstein: The Old Blood for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Origins for X1 (3/5) - Uncharted: Lost Legacy for PS4 (4/5) - EA UFC 3 for X1 (4/5) - Doom for X1 (4/5) - Titanfall 2 for X1 (4/5) - Super Mario 3D World for Wii U (4/5) - South Park: The Stick of Truth for X1 BC (4/5) - Call of Duty: WWII for X1 (4/5) -Wolfenstein II for X1 - (4/5) - Dead or Alive: Dimensions for 3DS (4/5) - Marvel vs Capcom: Infinite for X1 (3/5) - Halo Wars 2 for X1/PC (4/5) - Halo Wars: DE for X1 (4/5) - Tekken 7 for X1 (4/5) - Injustice 2 for X1 (4/5) - Yakuza 5 for PS3 (3/5) - Battlefield 1 (Campaign) for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Syndicate for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: MW Remastered for X1 (4/5) - Donkey Kong Country Returns for 3DS (4/5) - Forza Horizon 3 for X1 (5/5)

Intrinsic on 21 November 2018
Mr Puggsly said:

1TB for $40. https://www.amazon.com/Seagate-BarraCuda-Internal-3-5-Inch-ST1000DM010/dp/B01LNJBA2I/ref=sr_1_3?s=pc&ie=UTF8&qid=1542779714&sr=1-3&keywords=1tb+hdd

Lets not bother with semantics. When I say premium I mean the superior model. Whether you get the base or premium consoles, its 1TB HDD.

Standard HDDs are seem fine with X1X's 9GB of RAM. I've seen a good number of videos showing the X1X also loads faster using the same HDDs. I've seen what SSD can do and its impressive, but not essential at this point.

We will have to wait and see what happens in 2020. But if load times are fine with a standard HDD or hybrid, they might go that route. Frankly, I wouldn't be surprised they go with a 1TB SSD either if the price is right. Maybe MS will try an have it both ways by putting a cheap/large HDD in the console, but sell an external SSD. Essentially make faster loading a premium item.

The HDD you linked is a 3.5" drive. Consoles typically use 2.5" drives and also those that peak at a thickness of 9mm. This is a space thing.

Problem with those 2.5", 9mm thick drive is that it pretty much peaks at 2TB. Anything higher and you have to make the drive thicker. 

Most importantly, lets not forget that its the next 7 years we are talking about. While $40 can get you only a 1TB SSD in 2020, that same $40 could very well get you a 3TB SSD in 2024. There is just more room to grow and more flexibility with SSDs. 

Oh and the reason standard HDDs seem fine when it comes to the X has more to do with the I/O bus bandwidth (that was also improved) ad faster CPU than anything else.



Mr Puggsly on 21 November 2018
Intrinsic said:
Mr Puggsly said:

1TB for $40. https://www.amazon.com/Seagate-BarraCuda-Internal-3-5-Inch-ST1000DM010/dp/B01LNJBA2I/ref=sr_1_3?s=pc&ie=UTF8&qid=1542779714&sr=1-3&keywords=1tb+hdd

Lets not bother with semantics. When I say premium I mean the superior model. Whether you get the base or premium consoles, its 1TB HDD.

Standard HDDs are seem fine with X1X's 9GB of RAM. I've seen a good number of videos showing the X1X also loads faster using the same HDDs. I've seen what SSD can do and its impressive, but not essential at this point.

We will have to wait and see what happens in 2020. But if load times are fine with a standard HDD or hybrid, they might go that route. Frankly, I wouldn't be surprised they go with a 1TB SSD either if the price is right. Maybe MS will try an have it both ways by putting a cheap/large HDD in the console, but sell an external SSD. Essentially make faster loading a premium item.

The HDD you linked is a 3.5" drive. Consoles typically use 2.5" drives and also those that peak at a thickness of 9mm. This is a space thing.

Problem with those 2.5", 9mm thick drive is that it pretty much peaks at 2TB. Anything higher and you have to make the drive thicker. 

Most importantly, lets not forget that its the next 7 years we are talking about. While $40 can get you only a 1TB SSD in 2020, that same $40 could very well get you a 3TB SSD in 2024. There is just more room to grow and more flexibility with SSDs. 

Oh and the reason standard HDDs seem fine when it comes to the X has more to do with the I/O bus bandwidth (that was also improved) ad faster CPU than anything else.

My mistake but the 2.5 inch is only 5 bucks more, https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss_2?url=search-alias%3Delectronics&field-keywords=1tb+hdd+2.5

I don't think the slightly thicker HDDs would be an issue for a home console.

Right, its not like the base were using HDDs to their full potential per se, even if they do load faster with SSDs. Some videos showed the X1X had similar load times with a stock internal HDD as an external SSD. Hence, the 9th gen console will have even better specs and should be able to maintain similar load times even with more demanding assets, memory use, etc. It would be great to see load times actually decline as SSDs become standard on consoles, but I argue its not crucial.

On a side note, maybe MS and Sony will use stats to determine if HDD or SSD is the best route. For example, if MS really wants people using the subscriptions like Xbox Live ("free games"), EA Access or Game Pass then a massive storage HDD is crucial. But if the average user is just playing a few titles that fits in a 1TB SSD, well moving to SSD makes sense.



Recently Completed: 
River City: Rival Showdown for 3DS (3/5) - River City: Tokyo Rumble for 3DS (4/5) - Zelda: BotW for Wii U (5/5) - Zelda: BotW for Switch (5/5) - Zelda: Link's Awakening for Switch (4/5) - Rage 2 for X1X (4/5) - Rage for 360 (3/5) - Streets of Rage 4 for X1/PC (4/5) - Gears 5 for X1X (5/5) - Mortal Kombat 11 for X1X (5/5) - Doom 64 for N64 (emulator) (3/5) - Crackdown 3 for X1S/X1X (4/5) - Infinity Blade III - for iPad 4 (3/5) - Infinity Blade II - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Infinity Blade - for iPad 4 (4/5) - Wolfenstein: The Old Blood for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Origins for X1 (3/5) - Uncharted: Lost Legacy for PS4 (4/5) - EA UFC 3 for X1 (4/5) - Doom for X1 (4/5) - Titanfall 2 for X1 (4/5) - Super Mario 3D World for Wii U (4/5) - South Park: The Stick of Truth for X1 BC (4/5) - Call of Duty: WWII for X1 (4/5) -Wolfenstein II for X1 - (4/5) - Dead or Alive: Dimensions for 3DS (4/5) - Marvel vs Capcom: Infinite for X1 (3/5) - Halo Wars 2 for X1/PC (4/5) - Halo Wars: DE for X1 (4/5) - Tekken 7 for X1 (4/5) - Injustice 2 for X1 (4/5) - Yakuza 5 for PS3 (3/5) - Battlefield 1 (Campaign) for X1 (3/5) - Assassin's Creed: Syndicate for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare for X1 (4/5) - Call of Duty: MW Remastered for X1 (4/5) - Donkey Kong Country Returns for 3DS (4/5) - Forza Horizon 3 for X1 (5/5)

Pemalite on 21 November 2018
Intrinsic said:

By 2020 and if prices continue dropping as they have been as the industry has fully jumped onto SSD storage, a 1TB SSD could be as little as $80 on amazon. 

It's interesting you mention 2020 and prices continuing to drop... The same will hold true for mechanical drives as well you know.
2tb drives are getting cheaper and cheaper.

KBG29 said:

I don't see a need for external drives late next gen as look internal SSD's will offer more than enough space for 100's of titles. 

If the drives are only a terabyte or two... External storage will still be a must.

Mr Puggsly said:

I don't think the slightly thicker HDDs would be an issue for a home console.

They aren't. It's just a common design choice that Microsoft and Sony take for whatever reason.
Notebook drives tend to have the advantage of lower heat and noise as well.



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