By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Politics - I Have Lost Faith in My Province's Politics

TheLastStarFighter said:
Eagle367 said:

I  don't know of any other religion but I would like to argue that Islam needs to go back to it's roots and muslims need to realize what this religion is in the first place. This ultra-conservative hate filled and propaganda spewing class of muslims age new age modern varieties that did not exist in the past. I know we use modern positively most of the time but modern isn't always better. I would argue that modern muslims are way worse than classical muslims.

Are you aware, at all, with the origins of Islam?

    I am a Muslim so at all is a  pretty low bar for me and I think I meet that requirement



Just a guy who doesn't want to be bored. Also

Around the Network

Yeah left wingers call themselves liberals. Words don’t mean shit anymore. I am liberal, not you lol. I’m taking my shit back. 

Last edited by massimus - on 31 July 2018

SpokenTruth said:
o_O.Q said:

oh and there's also the fact that they called themselves socialists?

Irrelevant. 

North Korea calls itself the Democratic People's Republic of Korea.
China calls itself the People's Republic of China.
East Germany was called the Democratic Republic of Germany.
Cuba is called the Republic of Cuba.

Just because they call themselves something, doesn't mean they are.

As I already mentioned the also had the word worker in their official name but they weren't pro worker.  As soon as they gained power they outlawed all unions, order a wage freeze and made worker strikes illegal not something I would call being pro worker.    



WolfpackN64 said:
HylianSwordsman said:

I agree, but perhaps he means theocratic? Not familiar with her politics, but the alt-right are frequently theocratic, wanting essentially a Christian version of what we see in the Muslim world.

Most of these alt-right types don't have the slightest understanding of what christian theology entails. Further then a vague notion of christian values, that are already warped when they reach them, they are unable to to go.

Of course they don't. They'd vote against Christ himself and declare him the anti-Christ if he appeared today. Forget the alt-right though, even most right-wing actual Christians don't know much about Christian theology. There are still theocrats among them though. They know what confirms their narrative, and they want to apply that to the government, so that only Christian identifying men can hold positions, and Christianity would be enforced. In their ultimate dream, it's convert or be exiled (or killed). Obey the Christian laws or be jailed for your sins. That's theocracy, even if every single policy isn't grounded in doctrine, and in fact the religion explicitly goes against everything they'd like to do. Such is how it goes with theocrats.



SpokenTruth said:
o_O.Q said:

oh and there's also the fact that they called themselves socialists?

Irrelevant. 

North Korea calls itself the Democratic People's Republic of Korea.
China calls itself the People's Republic of China.
East Germany was called the Democratic Republic of Germany.
Cuba is called the Republic of Cuba.

Just because they call themselves something, doesn't mean they are.

lmao it still amazes me that people do not understand that democracy often leads to tyranny

tell me something if the people of a society are stupid and vote away their rights collectively,

for example, the right to free speech, the right to protect themselves, the right to associate in groups etc etc etc

what would that result in?

 

"Just because they call themselves something, doesn't mean they are."

correct, but if someone calls themselves something and their actions or policies align with their stated title then i'd have to be pretty stupid to not acknowledge that right?

Last edited by o_O.Q - on 02 August 2018

Around the Network
Chris Hu said:
SpokenTruth said:

Irrelevant. 

North Korea calls itself the Democratic People's Republic of Korea.
China calls itself the People's Republic of China.
East Germany was called the Democratic Republic of Germany.
Cuba is called the Republic of Cuba.

Just because they call themselves something, doesn't mean they are.

As I already mentioned the also had the word worker in their official name but they weren't pro worker.  As soon as they gained power they outlawed all unions, order a wage freeze and made worker strikes illegal not something I would call being pro worker.    

which is what happens again and again and again

rely on democracy and misinformation to have people vote themselves into dependency on government and then exploit the people through that dependency

what you do not understand is that they obtain power with a mask of bringing about "equality" or "fairness" or "equity" or whatever

that does not mean that social policies are not needed... of course they are but within reason... the minute you get to stating that all people need to have the same outcomes across various criteria then you've lost your goddamn mind and you are the enemy of everyone around you



SpokenTruth said:
o_O.Q said:

lmao it still amazes me that people do not understand that democracy often leads to tyranny

tell me something if the people of a society are stupid and vote away their rights collectively,

for example, the right to free speech

                      ,the right to protect themselves 

      ,the right to associate in groups etc etc etc

what would that result in?

 

"Just because they call themselves something, doesn't mean they are."

correct, but if someone calls themselves something and their actions or policies align with their stated title then i'd have to be pretty stupid to not acknowledge that right?

You missed my point though I largely agree with you regarding a democracy.  It can become a mob rule and eventually tyranny if opposition doesn't exist (or is squelched) as happened in Germany nearly 90 years ago.

My point was that these names don't apply accurately.  NK is certainly not a democratic republic. Neither was East Germany.  And Cuba isn't a really a republic because elections are, currently, for show (seeing hope for this soon).

i acknowledged that just because someone uses a title, that doesn't automatically mean that their actions/policies are in alignment with that title

 

that's not the case with the nazis since their policies, just about all of them, were socialist policies, most or maybe all of which socialists are clamoring for today in america

a retort being thrown around is that some of the policies existed before the nazis... but so what? they still promoted and enforced those policies while they were in power so its a silly argument to make



Anyone can run for a political seat. Who cares? It only matters if the fringe candidate wins.



"We'll toss the dice however they fall,
And snuggle the girls be they short or tall,
Then follow young Mat whenever he calls,
To dance with Jak o' the Shadows."

Check out MyAnimeList and my Game Collection. Owner of the 5 millionth post.

Nazis were not left or right, they were somewhere in the middle. Thats it and shouldn´t be that hard to understand.

I watched some of those videos etc. and she doesn´t seem to be openly racist, but definetely seems to be leaning that way.



SpokenTruth said:
o_O.Q said:

i acknowledged that just because someone uses a title, that doesn't automatically mean that their actions/policies are in alignment with that title

 

that's not the case with the nazis since their policies, just about all of them, were socialist policies, most or maybe all of which socialists are clamoring for today in america

a retort being thrown around is that some of the policies existed before the nazis... but so what? they still promoted and enforced those policies while they were in power so its a silly argument to make

Similarities of policy or concepts being used as means to decry a policy is intellectually dishonest.  With regards to the Nazis...were some polices on the left?  Yes, but with right wing ideologies mixed in.  Socialized X but only for Y people.  How was their immigration policy?  Wasn't military adventurism a core tenet?  Nationalism was also pretty central. They outlawed the Social Democratic Party and even sent leaders to their deaths.  Basically, they bastardized the right and the left and using either political, economic or ideological side as ammo against the other because of some connection to the Nazis is ignorant.

Totalitarianism can make any policy, left or right, sound horrible.

"How was their immigration policy?  "

sure depending on your perspective you could argue that this is a right leaning policiy

but, are you equating socialism with international socialism? seems to me like you are, as far as i know socialism generally is a concept that is bound to a particular community

to extent it beyond that is moving into international socialism

do socialists want open borders? i'm not so sure on that one... if they do then it makes their ideology even more stupid for obvious reasons

 

"Wasn't military adventurism a core tenet?"

many socialists would argue that violence is a core part of socialism... necessary to seize the means of production for control by workers/the state

 

"Nationalism was also pretty central."

i don't necessarily see a contradiction between nationalism and socialism

nationalism is the emphasis on the importance of the state... socialism is the means of transferring control of the means of production to the state

 

"They outlawed the Social Democratic Party and even sent leaders to their deaths."

i didn't argue that socialists are loyal people but regardless people persecuting people with a similar ideology is not something that is unheard of throughout history

when the soviets came to power there was much conflict and murder between the people that came to power, which does not take away from the fact that they all were allies to begin with

i don't understand why people think that this is a point considering that you can observe this behavior over different situations through history

jeez just the other day feminists fought to throw women out of jobs as grid girls while holding the banner as being the group in society to fight for women's freedom

 

" Basically, they bastardized the right and the left and using either political, economic or ideological side as ammo against the other because of some connection to the Nazis is ignorant."

as i have stated continuously, i consider the political affiliation of an entity to be determined by its policies/actions

when i look at socialised healthcare, government control over business, extensive child care services, state funded education, gun control and on and on and on

the vast majority of their policies are the same policies that dominate socialist talking points of today and that is where my conclusion is coming from