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Forums - Nintendo - Nintendos 2018 Line up is pretty boring for me, so far

I’m 100% in favour of ports. Skyrim, Disgaea 5, Undertale, South Park, Dark Souls, the Crash remakes, Mario Kart 8, and Okami HD are all games I would not have otherwise played if they weren’t ported to Switch. I play games games roughly 60% of the time in portable mode - especially Mario Kart due to multiplayer being WAY better with handheld versions than home console versions due to all the extra people that can play (local is the only way to play this one). I don’t care about age, nearly all of the top 100 games I want to play right now a year old or more; and the big limiting factor is platform - I like playing games way more on Switch than PC, and it is not likely I will ever get an Xbox or PS4 due to their limited capabilities — Even the Wii U wasn’t portable enough (nor did it lend itself to multiplayer enough) for my needs.

As much fun as online multiplayer can be, I have always found it falls very short of local multiplayer; it’s kind of like a long distance relationship vs a real relationship. I get depressed playing PC games online because I feel it is a complete waste of time playing games with people over online connections; relationship building with people I interact with regularly is far more valuable use of time - so I can relax and have a lot of fun and joy with it without depressing over feeling that I need to be doing something better with my time.

I live about 10 hours a week on the train, that’s why I like the Switch, portability drastically increases the amount of time I can play (since I only really play home console on TV on day off/holiday mornings), and increases the multiplayer opportunities I play by probably something around 50X over what I would normally do. So getting everything I want to play on the Switch is awesome; and it will have to be ports, because, as I said, nearly all of what I want to play is already released on other platforms; also, I want VC as soon as possible.

Last edited by Jumpin - on 13 March 2018

I describe myself as a little dose of toxic masculinity.

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...too bad for you I guess? I love the lineup this year so far. basically atleast 1 game interest me for each month up until july



Idk, I mean 2018 already looks better than 2017. You sound like you need to broaden your interests.

Third party support is already stronger and we've still got E3 and another (at least) 2 full Nintendo Directs to go,

I'd say first party is arguable. Whilst nothing this year (from Nintendo) should top Odyssey and BOTW, the sales of Smash and (maybe) Pokemon or another title should compensate for that. This year we will see more Nintendo games i.e. Kirby, Yoshi, Smash, Fire Emblem, Mario Tennis, Pokemon(?), Pikmin 4(?) and it will be more of a quantity year than a quality year.



Miyamotoo said:
DélioPT said:

I'm saying that sales could be even better. 

That's called not settling.

Ever since we first talking my point has been "where are the 2018 games".
And by the looks of it i was write in questioning.
The result is that instead of selling "THIS MUCH", they might just sell "this much".
If that's ok with you, fine. But i believe it could have been better.

 

Man, i said write instead of right... look at what you make me do! :D  jk

Miyamotoo i don't really how to answer to you to at least show you what you aren't taking into consideration. I'm not even speaking about agreeing with me, just make you realise you aren't being objective.
GoOnkid got my point. He may not agree with me, but at least he got it.

I don't fail to see Switch is a success, i'm just not blind to how the success was achieved, nor am i blind to a point where i think this is the best that could happen.

"ports/remasters are popular, they are selling good and they keep Switch momentum,"
  In a context where it's pretty much that or Indies (if you want more than Nintendo games), that's not much of a win, if you ask me. Just imagine how better it would be for Switch if instead of ports/remasters being the majority, new games/multiplats were the majority. Wouldn't that be better?

If Labo does what you mentioned, it's not a one year hit.

Ps4 sales are normally good until March, then they fall during April until September. The same will most likely happen to Switch and it's not smaller franchises, ports/remasters that will change that, when PS4, which has a way better line-up, still suffers from that every year.

"They don't risking nothing, packed lineup from March and sales proves that."
They didn't risk? Miyamotoo, this decision (planning for 2017 and 2018) was made way back, even before Switch was a success and right after Wii U failed so miserably.
You really think that there wasn't a risk there? Really?

"But you do realise that could say for any product, even for PS4!?"
I'm no marketing expert, but even i know that what you just said is not only wrong, it's illogical.
Saying that "oh, you can always do better, so no point in questioning if Nintendo can do better", is not a valid argument. 
Of course you can do better: releasing 1 system seller + smaller franchises + FE (sells mostly to it's userbase, though), is not the same as releasing 4/5 system sellers in a year.
2017 proves you wrong.

I asked several times why wasn't Nintendo hyping 2018.
Your answers ranged from, "it's too soon" to "Nintendo announces them closer to launch, now".
Now, i understand why they weren't hyping 2018

Miyamotoo, if you can't even bother tp say anything different than Switch is a success and look how great this line-up of ports/remasters+smaller franchises is, there's really no point in continuing with this conversation.

 

GoOnKid said:
DélioPT said:

 

In bold. Sorry if I sound like an ass. I see your point. I can see that you want them to be even more succesful than they already are, but you must be realistic as well. How many system sellers do you expect?If you ran Nintendo you would release one system seller after another, right? Name them.

Please, I honestly want to know what you even expect at this point.

I know that system sellers come from 2017.
MK8, Splatoon 2, Mario, Zelda, these four games continue to be really high at the charts. But that doesn't real change what i'm saying.

It doesn't need to be better if you don't mind selling less than what was at your reach.

What i expected from Nintendo was to not use all so many guns in 2017 and leave us with Smash for 2018 - so far.
I think it would have been better if they had decided to at least give us Xenoblade 2 and Fire Emblem (not that it would have done a difference in this case, but we didn't know) for the 1st half.
After not supporting Wii U since 2015 and 3DS close after, and focusing the majority of your resources on Switch, i would also expect more new franchises already and 1-2 system sellers to help boost console sales alongside Smash, for 2018. 

Nintendo has now the means to do way, way better than they are doing. And although that takes time, they have had enough to show us more than what we are seeing in 2018.
Wasn't the point of streamlining your SW development to do better than ever before?



Lonely_Dolphin said:

DélioPT said:   

"Again pointless because you can always say that no matter how well Nintendo sells or how much Nintendo does, like you are right now despite them selling very well by any standard which proves they're doing enough and planned very well."
No, you can't always do better. That exaggeration isn't true.
In this context, there's a big gap between how Nintendo is doing and how they could do if 2018 had been better prepared. Not to mention that all this will influence 2019's sales.

Who said anything about sales?
I was talking about release shcedules and how a better for 2018 could/would have resulted in better sales.

PS4 has been doing great, hasn't it? Even up YoY, right? Did that stop PS4 from droping in sales during the second and most of third semester, like, every year? No.

Why is that contradictory? Just because a game isn't a system seller, doesn't mean it's as if it doesn't exist or so bad that people pretend it doesn't exist.
Not all game libraries have the same appeal or value.
The more [the game library] is made off system sellers, the better. Below that, the less appeal it will have until it reaches a point where, for the majority of gamers, it just doesn't justify buying a console (like Wii U).

Except it is true. The only way sales couldn't get any higher is if you sold to every human on the planet, but then not really, because double dipping is a thing, and the human population isn't stagnant. Console sales will never get to that extreme of course, so saying sales could be higher will forever be a realistic possibility, but still a pointless statement when the sales are exceptional. This should really be common sense, but I'll even give examples using your logic to show how silly it is. "PS2? Sales coulda been higher, so it's a lame system with poor planning. DS? Sales coulda been higher, so it had terrible execution. Switch's record breaking first year? Sales still coulda been higher, so they clearly did not have good execution and planning."

Feigning ignorance wont help you. You said you're speaking from a business standpoint, and business's obviously use sales as the measurement for how good or not they're doing, not personal bias.

lol using the PS4 to try and foreshadow the Switch's sales trajectory helps me more than it does you, especially since you admit that PS4 sales are good.

Unless you can explain how a system can be more appealing but not sell more systems, the very measurement of how appealing a system is, then it's contradictory.

"No, you can't always do better. That exaggeration isn't true."
The keyword here is exaggeration.
Now, you can read into it, and get the meaning of what i said, or, you can read it literally and not get it.

Did i ever say that sales weren't good or hinted that if Nintendo saw the sales figures they would realised what i have been writing?
What i have seen saying is based on observation of how they are doing and trying to see if it could be better (this observation includes what they decided prior to Switch's success (a fair observation)).

You believe that Switch couldn't do more if the line-up was better? Fine. You don't care if it could be better and it isn't - or at least shaping up to be? Fine.
I look at it and see that the line-up could have been better and i gave reasons to it.
I think that me caring for it [Switch] to do better is implied.

The PS4 comment was made in reply to Zorg who implied that we are seeing a strong momentum and we would continue to see it.
I merely used PS4 as an example of that might not happen and then followed up with a questioning regarding what games would help pick-up sales, starting September. Just Smash?

I don't really understand your last paragraph.
All i have been saying is that sales could be better, if there were better/more reasons to amke it more appealing, as you put it.



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peachbuggy said:

LABO is #35 on the Amazon yearly chart, right behind the highest PS4 SKU, so if Amazon is any indicator, we can expect it to sell roughly the same FW that the PS4 Slim has this year. Any idea of that figure?

Comparing software to hardware on Amazon is worthless since there's no correlation for comparison (three most popular Switch games along with both of the Switch SKUs all have them outselling any PS4 SKU last year in the US when the reality is different according to NPD yearly totals) and using the yearly charts is even worse ... 

At most, a game's performance can only be compared within their respective platforms ... 



friendlyfamine said:
Idk, I mean 2018 already looks better than 2017. You sound like you need to broaden your interests.

Third party support is already stronger and we've still got E3 and another (at least) 2 full Nintendo Directs to go,

I'd say first party is arguable. Whilst nothing this year (from Nintendo) should top Odyssey and BOTW, the sales of Smash and (maybe) Pokemon or another title should compensate for that. This year we will see more Nintendo games i.e. Kirby, Yoshi, Smash, Fire Emblem, Mario Tennis, Pokemon(?), Pikmin 4(?) and it will be more of a quantity year than a quality year.

I think people on this site are in love with being negative.

After the January event last year that highlighted most of the main software, people complained that there was almost nothing coming out. Then a year later the same people are saying it was one of the best to the best year for releases on a Nintendo system ever. Last year was also mostly ports or remakes, and people ended up praising the fact that the Switch was the best platform to play these games on - I am guessing 2018 will end up the same in the end; and lots of last years software is going to help tremendously with sales for this year (and likely next year as well, since Zelda is such a unique and sought after experience, and Mario Kart traditionally sells millions for years).

Cut off Mario and Zelda, and 2018 is already stronger than 2017 (Wolfenstein, Dark Souls Remastered, Undertale, Kirby, Smash, South Park, Crash remakes, Little Nightmares, Mario Tennis, Okami HD, No More Heroes, Atelier Lydie, DKC: TF, Hyrule Warriors, Shantae, War Groove, YS VIII, Pillars of Eternity 2, Bloodstained, the World Ends with you, De Blob 2, Yoshi Switch, Bayonetta 1-3, Valkyrie Chronicles 4, ); it is unlikely that Nintendo just happened to not have any software for this Christmas, and more likely it is going to be announced this Summer when it is closer to that time (Pokemon, Fire Emblem, Metroid, Dragon Quest, Diablo, and a new Monolith Soft game have already been teased).

And saying Nintendo needs a Breath of the Wild caliber game every year to be worth it is unreasonable, games like that generally come around only once every few years, and it is amazing that we got two in one year; there are basically 3 dev teams in the world capable of making such games (Mario team, Zelda team, and Rockstar North), they can only work on one thing at a time, and a game like that takes a half a decade or more. Only 8 games in the entire history of video games have scores that high - they are all within the Mario, GTA, and Zelda franchises. So unless Rockstar has GTA6 coming to Switch, it’ll be years before we can expect another Breath of the Wild or Odyssey caliber game, because those are the only three franchises in that top tier; and guess what, everyone with a Switch - and everyone who will get one this year - has access to playing two of them already.



I describe myself as a little dose of toxic masculinity.

flashfire926 said:
curl-6 said:

I am withholding my judgement of the year as a whole until after E3, but so far their 2018 lineup is looking very poor.

Almost everything announced or released so far is either an ancient port or looks mediocre to bad. There is nothing shown so far on the level of games like Splatoon 2, Xenoblade 2, or Kingdom Battle. At this rate, this year might end up ranking below Wii U's 2013, 2014, and 2015 for me.

Fingers crossed they come out all guns blazing at E3 and announce some new A-tier games for August-December.

Crash, South Park and little nightmares came out in 2017. Far from ancient, I would say. And by "bad", you mean that sushi game right? Kirby looks like Kirby, and Mario Tennis Aces looks to be a huge huge improvement on Ultra Smash, especially with the new story mode. And even as a person that is not into rpg's, Octopath looks gorgeous. 

I can totally admit that we dont have enough brand-new games. 100% right.

However, none of those games are inherently "bad". The only case could be the sushi game.

Yeah, it's actually a pretty solid lineup for the first half of the year, minus the lack of new AAA third parties.

I try to avoid being an all out Nintendo apologist and even try and go out of my way to criticize them or call them out when they screw up (Labo anyone?), but this genuinely seems like a strong lineup, at least for those who don't own a Ps4/Xb One AND Wii U. Even I own(ed) a Wii U and have an XB One and still found many games I'd like to try from this list.



 

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fatslob-:O said:
peachbuggy said:

LABO is #35 on the Amazon yearly chart, right behind the highest PS4 SKU, so if Amazon is any indicator, we can expect it to sell roughly the same FW that the PS4 Slim has this year. Any idea of that figure?

Comparing software to hardware on Amazon is worthless since there's no correlation for comparison (three most popular Switch games along with both of the Switch SKUs all have them outselling any PS4 SKU last year in the US when the reality is different according to NPD yearly totals) and using the yearly charts is even worse ... 

At most, a game's performance can only be compared within their respective platforms ... 

Agreed Amazon is not the best parameter to judge software performance but prior to release it is practically the only parameter. Unless you include COMG which, incidentally it also appears to doing well on. Given your original comment was that LABO was doing badly in preorders, i would say this Amazon information is somewhat relevant.



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DélioPT said:

 

GoOnKid said:

In bold. Sorry if I sound like an ass. I see your point. I can see that you want them to be even more succesful than they already are, but you must be realistic as well. How many system sellers do you expect?If you ran Nintendo you would release one system seller after another, right? Name them.

Please, I honestly want to know what you even expect at this point.

I know that system sellers come from 2017.
MK8, Splatoon 2, Mario, Zelda, these four games continue to be really high at the charts. But that doesn't real change what i'm saying.

It doesn't need to be better if you don't mind selling less than what was at your reach.

What i expected from Nintendo was to not use all so many guns in 2017 and leave us with Smash for 2018 - so far.
I think it would have been better if they had decided to at least give us Xenoblade 2 and Fire Emblem (not that it would have done a difference in this case, but we didn't know) for the 1st half.
After not supporting Wii U since 2015 and 3DS close after, and focusing the majority of your resources on Switch, i would also expect more new franchises already and 1-2 system sellers to help boost console sales alongside Smash, for 2018. 

Nintendo has now the means to do way, way better than they are doing. And although that takes time, they have had enough to show us more than what we are seeing in 2018.
Wasn't the point of streamlining your SW development to do better than ever before?

I might have been able to see your point but I also wanted to make sure you see things in a more realistic way. Please don't think I agree with you.

So, something about your entire point is valid: for what we know so far, 2018 might be less stellar than 2017. But on the other hand, two things need to be considered:

1) Quality is subjective, some will value Smash much more than Splatoon for example. Some will even value Ys VIII much more than Smash, for example. Many will want to try Labo and Smash, though, this is very safe to say. Also, every new customer must be considered as a non-Wii U owner. Because the Switch install base is already bigger than Wii U's. If we assume that every single Wii U owner already owns a Switch until now, every new customer values every single one of the Wii U ports as brand new games since they had no chance to experience them so far. Also, even ports that had already been released on other consoles like Skyrim are worthy because it's simply not correct to assume that everyone already played them on other systems. I never played Skyrim or Doom even though I own a PS4. I bought both on the Switch. So, back to my examples from before: some will value DKCTF, Bayonetta, Captain Toad and Hyrule Warriors much higher than any game from 2017. Some will value Wolfenstein II higher than MK8D. For these people, 2018 is superior.

2) We don't know what more games are going to come. There will be more announcements. We don't know how big or small those might be, but they still complement the library nonetheless. You might even try to count Nintendos studios, look at what they already released for the Switch or 3DS so far and see how much is still missing. Look at Retro studios for example. We still know nothing. Also, there's always a chance for surprise games like that sushi game. I'm not saying this sushi game will set the world on fire, but such small games go well with similar ones and they make a few quick bucks.

And finally I picked three sentences from your answer above that really bother me.

Nintendo has now the means to do way, way better than they are doing. And although that takes time, they have had enough to show us more than what we are seeing in 2018.

This is only your opinion. You don't know how much time they need to make certain games, nor do I. We have to wait for them to show the games. Don't be impatient.

Here's a contradiction:

What i expected from Nintendo was to not use all so many guns in 2017 and leave us with Smash for 2018 - so far.
I think it would have been better if they had decided to at least give us Xenoblade 2 and Fire Emblem (not that it would have done a difference in this case, but we didn't know) for the 1st half.

This is your best case scenario that I asked to tell us. But at the same time your answer to Miyamotoo is the opposite:

Of course you can do better: releasing 1 system seller + smaller franchises + FE (sells mostly to it's userbase, though), is not the same as releasing 4/5 system sellers in a year. 

So, what is it now? I might be misinterpreting this but one time you say they should release 4 to 5 system sellers each year but on the other hand you wanted to them to spare some system sellers for later. I don't get it.  

It doesn't need to be better if you don't mind selling less than what was at your reach.

Nintendo wants to sell more units of the Switch in 2018 than in 2017. They wouldn't claim that if they didn't have some cards on their hand. Whether it's Labo or Smash or more smaller games or a combination of all of these or something completely different is something that we don't know yet but Nintendo knows. They woudn't be that optimistic if they had nothing left anymore.

 

Last edited by GoOnKid - on 13 March 2018