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Forums - Politics Discussion - Delta and United join list of companies to cut ties with the NRA - maybe this truly is the end of gun rights in the US?

the-pi-guy said:
PwerlvlAmy said:
NRA membership has gone way up. Narrative went from ''Never Again'' like it should be, to ''Lets ban guns'' agenda pretty quick. Not coincidence that david hoggs dad is ex fbi, that cameron ainksly(if i spelled it right) who's been one of the main figure heads of the main kid group having dinners and meeting with Ohr, Fusion GPS wife.

Too much of the agenda is showing for a gun grab rather than an actually debate on things like mental health and the complete incompetence of law enforcement in Florida and the FBI

Ban guns is not the same thing as gun regulation.

The most "liberal" countries in the world also have some of the highest gun ownership rates.  Norway, Sweden, France, Austria, Canada are very near the top.

There are some leftists that do claim that banning guns is the answer, but they're a minority.  I've seen people from both sides claim that Australia banned guns.  They didn't.  

Here's one such gun lover in Australia:

http://time.com/4172274/what-its-like-to-own-guns-in-a-country-with-strict-gun-control/

Lespaul said:

17 kids died because no body did there stopping this nut.FBI didn't do anything.police didn't stop
The cop stood out side and there was other guards with gunsThey didn't stop it.dont blame the NRA my guns never killed nobody
In Chicago 50 people are shot dead every week from illegal hand gun's liberals don't say anything

50 people every week is an exaggeration.  Even 1 is too many, so I'm not excusing it.  But the actual numbers are closer to 12.  

Liberals talk all the time.

https://heyjackass.com/

If you look at that sheet, it was 49 people shot last week.

350 shot this year

149 in February.

This is just shot, not shot and killed. Those numbers are also still high. 11 shot and killed last week, 67 for the year. So 67 in 2 months. That is almost 10 people shot and killed a week. Otherwise its like 44 shot a week, which is much close to 50 than 12. 12 is close if you are talking shot and killed, but I would like to think being shot in general is not a good thing. I doubt those 30+ people being shot but lived are fine being ignored for stat purposes in showing the city as being safer than it is.



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Puppyroach said:
McDonaldsGuy said:

This guy murdered 3 teenagers/young adults drunk driving and was released on bail: http://www.localsyr.com/news/local-news/camillus-man-accused-of-driving-drunk-killing-3-people-released-from-jail-on-bail/989969759

If a guy shot up 3 teenagers the NRA would get attacked; the second amendment would be under threat; the shooter would get life in prison/death penalty (rightfully so); constant media coverage; etc. etc.

Another drunk driver who has had 2 DUIs in the past killed someone and only got 4 years in prison.

If you drink then you have no room to complain about guns.

Do you need a drivers license to operate a car? Can you loose that license if you are a reckless driver? Well, apply that principle to gun ownership and you would come a long way. And I did not know the purpose of alcohol was to use it as a weapon, good to know =) 

There are 2 major differences:

1. Once again, if you blame the NRA or all gun owners on a mass shooting then I can blame all drinkers on drunk driving kills. Not to mention almost the majority of gun violence is due to alcohol. Most crime in America has an alcoholic component. Want to save lives? Then get rid of alcohol. (And yes, I know prohibition is a mess which is why I think instead of prohibition we need tougher anti-drunk laws).

2.  "A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."



With all due respect, what would an airline have ties with a gun organisation for? It seems so random.



Dante9 said:
Where does this paranoia come from? I mean the story about how the people are only free because they have guns and if they didn't, the government would kick in everybody's doors and.. something? It's batshit crazy, where is it coming from? Why would you be at war with your own government? Do you think all other countries with strict gun laws are somehow held hostage by their governments? What would be the point of that? Gun nuts are always using arguments from like the 1700's. If there was a mention in the founding papers that everyone has the right to a horse, I suppose all of the nuts would have a horse as well, just because old papers.
Listen, the greatest force of all is capitalism. Everybody wants your money. They don't want to lock you up, they want you to go out there and make money and spend it on them.

The only reason the UK/Australia/Canada/etc. etc. are free is because of America.

If it weren't for us you guys would be a Soviet colony by now.

The only country that needs guns is the United States. Why do we need guns? Well, China just made Xi the permanent President. https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/26/world/asia/china-xi-jinping-authoritarianism.html

THAT'S why we need guns.



irstupid said:
WolfpackN64 said:
I don't see how people can see this and jump to the conclusion this is "the end of gun rights". Very few people are clamoring for a total ban on guns. But one can easily see that the near complete lack of control on what guns can be sold to what people is catastrophic in the USA.

More of the whole slippery slope. Each new shooting we ban one more gun, or one more gun accessory. Fox News is told in court they are not real news cause of all the opinion stuff. The way other news sites are like CNN these days, I can see others lose that. Trump mentions a gov't run news station to prevent bias. Protesters constantly preventing people they don't agree with from speaking at public places like universities. Mentions of banning certain words due to their hatefulness.  ECT.

In say 100 years, is it unfathomable to imagine a US that all weapons are banned, all news is government run and you can be jailed for speaking out in public on something people don't agree with?

But lets talk only this one case. But as for your bolded. Lets say their are better rules for gun ownership. Tell me how that would have prevented this event? The only people surprised by the school shooting and didn't see it coming where his guardians who are coincidentally trying to now get his $800,000.00 inheritance. At least two people contacted the FBI and warned them about this person doing a school shooting. The police had been to his house like 30+ times. He was expelled from school. He had photos of animals he killed and such on facebook. What did anyone do to prevent him from his mass murder? NOTHING. Whether he used a gun or not, he would have done something and it was apparent to everyone, except the people trying to get his money. Yet what was done? NOTHING.

Can you structure your argument more clearly? I don't see the point you're trying to make.



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McDonaldsGuy said:
Puppyroach said:

Do you need a drivers license to operate a car? Can you loose that license if you are a reckless driver? Well, apply that principle to gun ownership and you would come a long way. And I did not know the purpose of alcohol was to use it as a weapon, good to know =) 

There are 2 major differences:

1. Once again, if you blame the NRA or all gun owners on a mass shooting then I can blame all drinkers on drunk driving kills. Not to mention almost the majority of gun violence is due to alcohol. Most crime in America has an alcoholic component. Want to save lives? Then get rid of alcohol. (And yes, I know prohibition is a mess which is why I think instead of prohibition we need tougher anti-drunk laws).

2.  "A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."

1. Where did I blame the NRA or all gun owners for mass shootings? I blame the availability of guns and ease of access for people to get guns. Would the number of gunrelated alcoholinduced homicides go down if there were less guns available? Ofcourse, which is evident in every country that has heavier weapon laws than the US. It always fascinates me how so many people who seem so suspicious of the government that having alot of weaponry somehow would make them feel safer, at the same time live in one of the unsafest country within the OECD. It doesn´t seem to help very much.

2. Exactly, and the text right there opens up for massive regulation of guns. The 2nd amendment doesn´t guarantee availability to all types of weaponry, the government could, if they wished, regulate so that you are only allowed to own up to two hunting rifles for example. They would still follow the 2nd amendment in that case since they don´t infringe on your right to bear arms, just the amount and types of arms. This has also been validated by the supreme court.



McDonaldsGuy said:
Dante9 said:
Where does this paranoia come from? I mean the story about how the people are only free because they have guns and if they didn't, the government would kick in everybody's doors and.. something? It's batshit crazy, where is it coming from? Why would you be at war with your own government? Do you think all other countries with strict gun laws are somehow held hostage by their governments? What would be the point of that? Gun nuts are always using arguments from like the 1700's. If there was a mention in the founding papers that everyone has the right to a horse, I suppose all of the nuts would have a horse as well, just because old papers.
Listen, the greatest force of all is capitalism. Everybody wants your money. They don't want to lock you up, they want you to go out there and make money and spend it on them.

The only reason the UK/Australia/Canada/etc. etc. are free is because of America.

If it weren't for us you guys would be a Soviet colony by now.

The only country that needs guns is the United States. Why do we need guns? Well, China just made Xi the permanent President. https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/26/world/asia/china-xi-jinping-authoritarianism.html

THAT'S why we need guns.

You are crazy.  There is no way, your  guns are going to protect  us from China.  They have nukes.   Just sit down.  Why do all of your paths lead in our death.  How to people even survive in other countries.  Has Russia taken over all other countries?  When did that happen? You can't do a damn thing to 'protect us from China'... you going over there to attack another countries for your own beliefs?  Just so you know thats why no one wants you to have a gun lol. 



CosmicSex said:

You are crazy.  There is no way, your  guns are going to protect  us from China.  They have nukes.   Just sit down.  Why do all of your paths lead in our death.  How to people even survive in other countries.  Has Russia taken over all other countries?  When did that happen? You can't do a damn thing to 'protect us from China'... you going over there to attack another countries for your own beliefs?  Just so you know thats why no one wants you to have a gun lol. 

China just made Xi it's Emperor.

Is that what you want the future of the world to be like? Under one Emperor?

During the Cold War it was the USA vs. Soviet Union. We could've let the Soviets take over Western Europe but we didn't. You should thank us every day for your freedom.



Puppyroach said:
McDonaldsGuy said:

There are 2 major differences:

1. Once again, if you blame the NRA or all gun owners on a mass shooting then I can blame all drinkers on drunk driving kills. Not to mention almost the majority of gun violence is due to alcohol. Most crime in America has an alcoholic component. Want to save lives? Then get rid of alcohol. (And yes, I know prohibition is a mess which is why I think instead of prohibition we need tougher anti-drunk laws).

2.  "A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."

1. Where did I blame the NRA or all gun owners for mass shootings? I blame the availability of guns and ease of access for people to get guns. Would the number of gunrelated alcoholinduced homicides go down if there were less guns available? Ofcourse, which is evident in every country that has heavier weapon laws than the US. It always fascinates me how so many people who seem so suspicious of the government that having alot of weaponry somehow would make them feel safer, at the same time live in one of the unsafest country within the OECD. It doesn´t seem to help very much.

2. Exactly, and the text right there opens up for massive regulation of guns. The 2nd amendment doesn´t guarantee availability to all types of weaponry, the government could, if they wished, regulate so that you are only allowed to own up to two hunting rifles for example. They would still follow the 2nd amendment in that case since they don´t infringe on your right to bear arms, just the amount and types of arms. This has also been validated by the supreme court.

1. Yeah you're right, mass murders NEVER happen in Western Europe. Aside from Manchester, Paris, Nice, London, the German airplane dude, Norway, etc. etc.

Oh look - rape in London has increased 20% in just one year: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/rape-london-reports-met-police-rise-crime-sexual-assault-a8225821.html

In the UK, 2 10 year olds raped and beat a 2 year old (named James Burglar) for HOURS if not DAYS. They were both released under new names. Guess what? One of the murderers has been convicted of having child pornography. His sentence? 40 months. He only got 40 months!

Yeah, the UK is "safe" because they don't charge dangerous people with actual crimes. It's what Broward County does to lower it's crime rate - the crime rate is low when you don't charge people with crimes.

2. SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED. Meaning they can't limit us to how much we own - the Supreme Court already ruled on stuff like this in 2008.



Getting a gun should be like getting a drivers license.

You need a permit, and then take a formal test to get your license. You then need to renew your license every 2 or 3yrs. You need good eye vision to drive, if you have bad eye vision then maybe you shouldn't be shooting a gun. You need insurance, and regular maintenance checks. Gasoline is taxed, and you can't buy gasoline online, so they should do that for bullets as well.

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