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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Lawsuit filed against Nintendo over Switch’s detachable controllers

caffeinade said:
These guys are going to bleed Nintendo dry.

RIP Mario Odyssey.

Don't forget to mention the Switch in first place.



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fatslob-:O said:
Azuren said:

...

 

And if Gamevice doesn't want to settle, doesn't want royalties, and wants to specifically stop the sale of the Switch as it exists right now, that's what will happen in the affected territories should Gamevice win.

 

Now, unless you can respond with something that addresses that outside of "but it doesn't usually do that" despite Gamevice already expressing interest in doing just that, just stop. I'm not interested in getting caught in a repeating discussion.

Huh ? It doesn't make much sense for a business to pass on easy profits such as royalties but that presumes if Nintendo wants to also pay these royalties too ... 

The worst case scenario is Nintendo creating a Switch without detachable joy-cons for the US market ... 

And why the aggressive tone with your last line ? (oh and neither Nintendo or Gamevice can recall the sold Switch systems either as it goes specifically against US laws)

I never said it made sense. I'd go after royalties myself, but last I checked Gamevice was going after a sale ban.

 

And that worst case scenario would involve the recall of unsold Switches. I don't believe I said all, but if I did I can assure you it was a typo.

 

And I just don't have patience for cyclical arguments anymore. Been arguing with SJWs at work too much, and I tell ya: they can literally make the same argument all day long and fully believe it was the best response to their argument being dismantled.



Watch me stream games and hunt trophies on my Twitch channel!

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fatslob-:O said:
Dravenet7 said:

*Sigh*....

I don't care if you didn't ask for my input. Maybe stop acting oblivious to what's said in plain English and maybe I wouldn't feel a need to give it. How about that?

For example: you say, "why exactly do people feel the need to discuss what Gamevice is suing Nintendo over?"

This completely oblivious. The thread is literally about Gamevice suing Nintendo. If it bothers you maybe you shouldn't post in the first place, but you considering the fact you posted here several times and you initiated a response to another user as well and asked an open question towards all who were in support of Nintendo in the thread, its not that you are clueless as to why people are debating it. It is simply the fact you want to dismiss ither people's opinions and it really isn't working out for you now is it?

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Exaggerating what? I counted your redundancy before posting. Here are the 5 times I was refering to:

1. What ?! Nintendo's not going out of business just because they have to pay relatively small damage fees (for their size as a corporation) and royalties for every Switch sold in the US ... 

2. Then Nintendo only has to pay royalties in America or just design the Switch without detachable joy-cons ... 

It's not the end of the world if Nintendo can't have detachable joy-cons on the Switch

3. Just like how Nintendo is trying benefit off of other people's invention ? Let Nintendo defend themselves in court and we'll see whether the judges determine Nintendo will or will not have to pay for damages and royalties ... 

4. No more Switch in america ... (doesn't mean Nintendo can't sell Switch's in other territories providing they didn't infringe patents in those territories either) 

Besides paying royalties is a relatively small price for Nintendo's size and they could design the Switch without detachable joy-cons to get around the patent issue ...

5. Patents are usually sovereign grants which only affects trade with a specific nation ... 

If a patent is infringed on there's usually no recall since it's presumably settled in court (or outside) between the corporations so customers still get to keep the product in question, it's just that the defendant (Nintendo) hast to pay the damages and royalties (if Nintendo decides to keep detachable joy-cons) to the plaintiff (Gamevice) ...   

You must've missed the second question ... 

1. Nintendo is not going out of business ..

2. It's not the end of the world for Nintendo since they can design without detachable controllers ...

3. People need to stop assuming that Nintendo is the guiltless party ...

4. Nintendo may not be able to sell detachable Switch's in america ...

5. Patents are granted by nation ... 

Sooo many redundancies cause I use the words 'royalties, damages and detachable joy-cons' too much LOL ...

This is cute. I like it. It makes drilling the facts in easier for me. This is what Azuren said:

"And if Gamevice doesn't want to settle, doesn't want royalties, and wants to specifically stop the sale of the Switch as it exists right now, that's what will happen in the affected territories should Gamevice win.Now, unless you can respond with something that addresses that outside of "but it doesn't usually do that" despite Gamevice already expressing interest in doing just that, just stop. I'm not interested in getting caught in a repeating discussion."

Most of these 5 posts were responses to what Azuren's post in which the scenario of having to the Switch sales shut down by gameVice were essentially given the response of, essentially, "but it doesn't usually do that". In other words saying royalties were the only option. The reason your response is cute is because you literally trim out the bulk of what you said in which, is about royalties, damages, yada yada yada. The fact that in those posts I quoted, its MOST of what you said, and you clipped out a small piece of sentence for each in order to frame it as you only sprinkled royalties and the like in is sad. Sad and irrelavent. Your redudancy is in line with you ignoring the scenario Azuren was talking about. The only time you remotely address it is in #4.



Suky said:
twintail said:

im pretty confident the lawsuit is because of this:

https://gamevice.com/collections/mobile-console-gaming/products/iphone-street-fighter-bundled-edition

 

Oh,if this is the case, Nintendo is screwed.

The lawsuit is over the patent for the Wikipad patent, not the Gamevice controller. 

A key feature explicitly stated in the patent is a "bridge" section which sits behind the tablet and connects both halves of the controller, which act as one unit. You can even see above in the second photo that the Gamevice controller is one device connected by a strap which sits behind the phone.

Seeing as the Switch Joycons are two separate controllers that individually work and connect to the Switch console, the entire lawsuit hinges on their claim that the Switch console itself is acting as this "bridge" section of the Wikipad controller patent.

If this were the case, there would be no need to mention a "bridge" section in the patent design in the first place, so the suit is without merit.  



mysteryman said:
Suky said:

Oh,if this is the case, Nintendo is screwed.

The lawsuit is over the patent for the Wikipad patent, not the Gamevice controller. 

A key feature explicitly stated in the patent is a "bridge" section which sits behind the tablet and connects both halves of the controller, which act as one unit. You can even see above in the second photo that the Gamevice controller is one device connected by a strap which sits behind the phone.

Seeing as the Switch Joycons are two separate controllers that individually work and connect to the Switch console, the entire lawsuit hinges on their claim that the Switch console itself is acting as this "bridge" section of the Wikipad controller patent.

If this were the case, there would be no need to mention a "bridge" section in the patent design in the first place, so the suit is without merit.  

Well you have the issue backwards.  They are making the argument over the Switch being the bridge because their patent specifically mentions that bridge.  Which matters.  Mentioning such specific details narrows your control over similar designs.  This was famously used by Tesla in 1893 to get around Edison's patent on the lightbulb.  The Tesla bulb looked almost identical but used a different plug system and different filament shape/design.  Because of the specificity of Edison's  patent, it worked.

Another issue is purpose.  See, patents for things like this deal in utility, not just appearance.  And the Wikipad patent specifically references - if the quote I saw is accurate - bringing physical control inputs and traditional gaming experiences to a tablet.  And the new Gamevice controller similarly references tablets and smartphones.   This is obviously problematic for the suit since the stated utility of the Joy-Con's are entirely different since they pertain to only a proprietary device and serve more than that individual function.

As for appearance, that is convered in patents but to win solely on that, the thing needs to be virtually identical.



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Nuvendil said:
mysteryman said:

The lawsuit is over the patent for the Wikipad patent, not the Gamevice controller. 

A key feature explicitly stated in the patent is a "bridge" section which sits behind the tablet and connects both halves of the controller, which act as one unit. You can even see above in the second photo that the Gamevice controller is one device connected by a strap which sits behind the phone.

Seeing as the Switch Joycons are two separate controllers that individually work and connect to the Switch console, the entire lawsuit hinges on their claim that the Switch console itself is acting as this "bridge" section of the Wikipad controller patent.

If this were the case, there would be no need to mention a "bridge" section in the patent design in the first place, so the suit is without merit.  

Well you have the issue backwards.  They are making the argument over the Switch being the bridge because their patent specifically mentions that bridge.  Which matters.  Mentioning such specific details narrows your control over similar designs.  This was famously used by Tesla in 1893 to get around Edison's patent on the lightbulb.  The Tesla bulb looked almost identical but used a different plug system and different filament shape/design.  Because of the specificity of Edison's  patent, it worked.

Another issue is purpose.  See, patents for things like this deal in utility, not just appearance.  And the Wikipad patent specifically references - if the quote I saw is accurate - bringing physical control inputs and traditional gaming experiences to a tablet.  And the new Gamevice controller similarly references tablets and smartphones.   This is obviously problematic for the suit since the stated utility of the Joy-Con's are entirely different since they pertain to only a proprietary device and serve more than that individual function.

As for appearance, that is convered in patents but to win solely on that, the thing needs to be virtually identical.

My point was that if any screen used alongside the wikipad could be counted as a bridge, the bridge itself is redundant and would not be a noteworthy feature.



Well this got out of control.



Azuren said:

I never said it made sense. I'd go after royalties myself, but last I checked Gamevice was going after a sale ban.

 

And that worst case scenario would involve the recall of unsold Switches. I don't believe I said all, but if I did I can assure you it was a typo.

 

And I just don't have patience for cyclical arguments anymore. Been arguing with SJWs at work too much, and I tell ya: they can literally make the same argument all day long and fully believe it was the best response to their argument being dismantled.

Here's what Gamevice has filed so far ... 

1. Under 'Nature of Action', it says "Gamevice seeks injunctive relief and monetary damages" ... 

2. Gamevice has declined to comment according to Engadget ... 

Gamevice haven't even said that they were intending to seek a full ban on Switch sales at all! 

Dravenet7 said:

This is cute. I like it. It makes drilling the facts in easier for me. This is what Azuren said:

"And if Gamevice doesn't want to settle, doesn't want royalties, and wants to specifically stop the sale of the Switch as it exists right now, that's what will happen in the affected territories should Gamevice win.Now, unless you can respond with something that addresses that outside of "but it doesn't usually do that" despite Gamevice already expressing interest in doing just that, just stop. I'm not interested in getting caught in a repeating discussion."

Most of these 5 posts were responses to what Azuren's post in which the scenario of having to the Switch sales shut down by gameVice were essentially given the response of, essentially, "but it doesn't usually do that". In other words saying royalties were the only option. The reason your response is cute is because you literally trim out the bulk of what you said in which, is about royalties, damages, yada yada yada. The fact that in those posts I quoted, its MOST of what you said, and you clipped out a small piece of sentence for each in order to frame it as you only sprinkled royalties and the like in is sad. Sad and irrelavent. Your redudancy is in line with you ignoring the scenario Azuren was talking about. The only time you remotely address it is in #4.

The first bit isn't true as Gamevice wants to settle regardless ... (Why else would they file a civil lawsuit ?) 

@Bold How nice of you to pull a strawman ... (And BTW response #3 wasn't intended for Azuren so that was just a reach on your part.)

Just because I recycle some of what I've said before doesn't mean that I can't raise a new point ... (Are you gonna forbid me for repeating some of the things I say now ? LOL)



CaptainExplosion said:

The detachable controllers are one of the main draws of the Switch though.

Hmm, I say we do a survey study to determine how much detachable controllers are worth to Switch customers ... 

The most important thing about detachable controllers to Nintendo are is that they only have to make 1 set of controller rather than 2 sets of controllers if they intend for the Switch to be used as a hybrid ... (it's cheaper this way for them or they could just make the Switch an entirely integrated portable unit)



CaptainExplosion said:

It's still an integral part of the system.

I'd say no if you intend to fully use the Switch as a portable system ... 

If you use it as a hybrid then maybe ...