If you're playing Splatfest, are you competing with people or not?  If you're competing, it's competitive.  If you can expian to me how you compete in something that's not competitive, I'd love to hear it.

You can use a dictionary to verify my usage.  If you can show me a valid source that uses competitive as you do, go for it.

See, this is what a strawman argument is.  You're claiming that I made an argument I never made, then attacking that argument.  When you use the words "under your logic" 9/10 times you're making a strawman.

I never said using two joysticks at a time is hard.  I said it is more complex than using one joystick.  By that logic, using buttons and a joystick at the same time is more complex than just using a joystick.  And indeed it is more complex, which is different than hard.  Using two joysticks, multiple face buttons, multiple shoulder buttons, a d-pad, and gyroscopic sensors all at the same time is more complex than using a joystick, two face buttons, and one shoulder button at the same time.

I never said at any point that Splatoon was an especially hard game.  I said it was more complex than 3D Mario.  More things going on at once=more complex.  It's not complicated.

You know how before I said no Mario game in over a decade and a half has required a second analog stick?  After playing Mario Sunshine a bit, I have to admit I was wrong.  NO MARIO GAME SO FAR HAS REQUIRED A SECOND JOYSTICK.  In about a half hour of play, I was able to get five shines without ever touching the C stick.  Admittedly though, I had to use the four buttons (Fludd, jump, switch nozzle, center camera) consistently.  I also had to press the B button six times for what it's worth.

I used the L button solely for camera control.  However, if I was so inclined, the Y button functions to go into first person mode, where you can adjust the camera with the left stick.  There is literally no reason you would ever have to use the second joystick in any Mario game, so a player who has difficulty with that setup will never have to use it.

If you need to make a personal attack at every sentence because you don't have any point, maybe you shouldn't be arguing.  I am a very smart individual with a bachelor's degree in English and a Master's degree in education^_^.  My reading comprehension skills are pretty strong.

What I don't grasp is why you keep bringing up that simpler games are better selling to casuals, since that's a point I've agreed with you on several times.  I also can't grasp why when we're contrasting A and B you keep bringing up C, D, and E.

Galaxy does not have a fixed camera except in certain parts.  3D World's camera is mostly not fixed either.

Are you contending that enemies with set patterns that are only active in your immediate vicinity are more complicated than human opponents with no set pattern that are active regardless of where you are?  

I don't see how that proves it.  Having a way for a player to get past a challenge that is too hard for them makes something more casual friendly.  It lets you bypass any difficult part, and focus on the challenges they can handle.  A game having a parts where someone can die does not instantly make it not casual friendly O_o...

Super jumping puts a giant target on you.  If any enemy is in the area, you will most likely be killed.  My experience is that people will more often (in Splatfest at least) opt to not utilize it, particularly in smaller maps.  Your experience may have been different, so I'm not going to "question you" if you experienced something different.  

No, you're addressing an argument I never made, that I am now explaining for a fourth time I didn't make.  

I'll try this one more time.  I'll try one more way.  Adding sugar to a beverage makes it sweeter.  It doesn't necessarily make it sweet.  If I have a beverage with two teaspoons of sugar, 3 cups of hot sauce, and a gallon of citric acid, that beverage is not going to be sweet.  But, it is sweeter than it would be if it had 3 cups of hot sauce and a gallon of citric acid.

Similarly, just because Mario Kart has one complex element (intelligent enemies) doesn't mean it is automatically too complex for casual gamers.  It also has other elements that make it less complex.  For instance, the game gives better items and speed boosts to help players who are less skilled, offers an automatic mode for players who are unskilled, offers various control schemes of different complexity, primarily only involves guiding your character laterally, and so on.  

Just because it has one complex element does not mean it is a complex game.  Splatoon though has a lot of elements making it complex, and few to mitigate that.

As for your argument about AI controlled enemies being better, that's sort of ridiculous.  You've played Mario games right?  The enemies are controlled by incredibly simplistic patterns and are significantly more limited than you in what they could do.  Human foes are much more complex than goombas and koopas by a wide margin.  If a company made a game with incredibly advanced AI or where your character is vastly underpowered, you may have a point, but that's not the case here.  Mario's AI is among the simplest you'll find in any modern game.

Again for about the fifth time, there is no guarantee people are going to be equal to your skill, because that entirely depends on the average skill level of the players playing the game, and the effectiveness of the matchmaking algorithm.  The algorithm is shit, regularly pairing up level 50 players against players level 10 or below.  That's actually primarily why I stopped playing, because at level 20 something I was constantly 20+ levels below everyone else in the match, therefore less experienced, and therefore got my ass kicked.

Aside from that, if there aren't a lot of casual players to begin with, you're going to get matched up with better players.  For instance, if you have a game like Blazblue, you're going to have a hardcore fanbase, so you're not likely to get matched up with someone at your level.  If Splatoon's fanbase skews more to experienced players (which is what we're arguing about), then you're going to wind up getting paired up with people who are better than you.  

So, we could go round and round some more, but since you won't listen to reason (and I'm guessing you'd say the same to me) I have another idea.  I'll make a topic simply asking whether Splatoon or 3D Mario is more casual friendly, without any input from either of us to swat things (unless you'd like for us both to present our reasoning, we could do that too).  We'll count up the number of responses (up to the first 20 I think will be sufficient), and see which people feel is more casual friendly.  Winner gets sig control for a month.  Deal?

Casual is a gamer that has basic gaming habits they don't buy or play many games and aren't as informed as an avid gamer, they mainly follow the trends what you're describing are new gamers they're not the same groups at all, as someone gaming for 28 years casual has always meant the former and they;ve been around since the NES and make up the bulk of a userbase and mainstream. If your view is the latter the is no point continuing because the will never been an agreement on as we're arguing from different definitions on a subject.

I'm not sure why you're be using a definition of casual gamer that seemingly excludes children who haven't played games that much, excludes the kinds of people who bought the DS and Wii and made games like NSMB successful, people who are buying their first system, people who primarily play on phones, and the kinds of people who have for a while made up Nintendo's fanbase that aren't particularly into shooters or sports games (which have never sold well on Nintendo consoles, even the ones that succeeded with casual gamers).

Regardless, if we agree that simpler games sell better to casual gamers, then how we define that term is really not going to influence things.  All that would really matter is which game is simpler.  My offer stands to throw this to the community, although you understandably don't seem keen on doing so.

I'm using the definition of casual that's been around since the NES, new gamers aren't casual gamers as they've only entered into the market, kids can also be casual gamers as well if they've been gaming long enough so I don't get how that definition excludes them.

You can make the thread all you want to see whether people view 3D Mario or Splatoon as more casual friendly I never said you couldn't I just don't see the worth in a bet on it as it can go either way.

This is the first time I've heard anyone using a definition of casual gamers that specifically excluded new gamers.