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Forums - Nintendo - Kimishima: "Nintendo currentily studying VR, will come to Switch once it's right!"

setsunatenshi said:
spemanig said:

720p is more than adequate. Virtual Boy was bad because its only two colors were black and red. 720p is only an issue because of the screen door effect, which won't be a deal breaker for the mass market at a cheap price and there's absolutely no reason to believe that framerates would be bad. It definitely wouldn't make people more sick than better devices. The only difference is the level of immersion.

A 720p VR screen running at 60fps would be more than fine. All it has to be is good enough for cheap enough.

Ok, you've clearly never used VR.

A 720p screen may be ok for everyday use, where the screen is at an arms distance from your face.

But when the screen is strapped to your face, the individual pixels are not only seen but make it so that you can't even read text on it.

Using the PSVR, if you attempt to read anything except pretty decently sized fonts it's damn near impossible (and we're talking about a 960 x 1080 per eye at 90 Hz. 5 minutes on a VR screen of 720p quality would literally make your eyes bleed.

One of the reasons why VR is so demanding physically is because your brain has to constantly compensate for some poor image quality that comes with it. It needs to constantly try to ignore the individual pixels and build a smooth image for you.

All of this is assuming the machine would even be powerful enough to run any game in VR, which it isn't.

Oh and before you say "but phones..." again, every phone that has some form of VR has a much better and higher resolution screen than the switch does and their main purpose is for VR video, not gaming. And even at that they are pretty poor (I know, I have and S7 edge with Gear VR)

Except that isn't true, at all. Plenty of phones far weaker than the Switch has been used for VR gaming with a 720p LED screen, and there's never a major issue. It just looks worse, which I never objected to. As for fonts, Nintendo will just use big fonts then. Problem solved. No eye bleeding. And again, of course the Switch is powerful enough.



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Pemalite said:
spemanig said:

A 720p VR screen running at 60fps would be more than fine. All it has to be is good enough for cheap enough.

720P and 60fps is NOT fine for VR. You should try using VR some time.


I've seen enough impressions of just that to believe that it absolutely is fine.



spemanig said:
setsunatenshi said:

Ok, you've clearly never used VR.

A 720p screen may be ok for everyday use, where the screen is at an arms distance from your face.

But when the screen is strapped to your face, the individual pixels are not only seen but make it so that you can't even read text on it.

Using the PSVR, if you attempt to read anything except pretty decently sized fonts it's damn near impossible (and we're talking about a 960 x 1080 per eye at 90 Hz. 5 minutes on a VR screen of 720p quality would literally make your eyes bleed.

One of the reasons why VR is so demanding physically is because your brain has to constantly compensate for some poor image quality that comes with it. It needs to constantly try to ignore the individual pixels and build a smooth image for you.

All of this is assuming the machine would even be powerful enough to run any game in VR, which it isn't.

Oh and before you say "but phones..." again, every phone that has some form of VR has a much better and higher resolution screen than the switch does and their main purpose is for VR video, not gaming. And even at that they are pretty poor (I know, I have and S7 edge with Gear VR)

Except that isn't true, at all. Plenty of phones far weaker than the Switch has been used for VR gaming with a 720p LED screen, and there's never a major issue. It just looks worse, which I never objected to. As for fonts, Nintendo will just use big fonts then. Problem solved. No eye bleeding. And again, of course the Switch is powerful enough.

Have you actually every tried it yourself? Ever?

Use VR on a 720 screen and tell me it's an enjoyable experience. I dare you



Why did the new 3DS-XL add eyetracking?
"eye-tracking ability means that the headset can increase the resolution of the area that the user is looking at, and decrease the resolution elsewhere, allowing for better graphics with a lower-end processor."

Screen door effect can be reduced by moving the display further from your eyes and using a bigger screen instead. Say a 6.2" display v 5.7" on PSVR.

Nintendo doesn't need to split displays in half to achieve 3D like other VR setups. They already have 3D tech remember?

If Nintendo has shortened the focal length of 3DS tech, 3-4" instead of 18" and added eye tracking, Nintendo's VR power requirements won't be as high as other VR setups.



Nov 2016 - NES outsells PS1 (JP)

Don't Play Stationary 4 ever. Switch!

I want VR but when ready and good and cheap!



Switch!!!

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setsunatenshi said:
spemanig said:

Except that isn't true, at all. Plenty of phones far weaker than the Switch has been used for VR gaming with a 720p LED screen, and there's never a major issue. It just looks worse, which I never objected to. As for fonts, Nintendo will just use big fonts then. Problem solved. No eye bleeding. And again, of course the Switch is powerful enough.

Have you actually every tried it yourself? Ever?

Use VR on a 720 screen and tell me it's an enjoyable experience. I dare you

In the absence of first hand experience, I've read plenty of second hand experience saying it's fine. Your word is no better than theirs.



spemanig said:
setsunatenshi said:

Have you actually every tried it yourself? Ever?

Use VR on a 720 screen and tell me it's an enjoyable experience. I dare you

In the absence of first hand experience, I've read plenty of second hand experience saying it's fine. Your word is no better than theirs.

If that's your best argument, then I guess you don't really have anything to add to this debate. I'm far from the only person in this same thread pointing out how undoable VR is in a 720p.

I have personal experience with different types of VR solutions and enough technical knowledge to understand why the Switch as actually underpowered to do modern VR gaming.

But I guess nowadays reality is multiple choice and what feels real is more important than what is real.



setsunatenshi said:
spemanig said:

In the absence of first hand experience, I've read plenty of second hand experience saying it's fine. Your word is no better than theirs.

If that's your best argument, then I guess you don't really have anything to add to this debate. I'm far from the only person in this same thread pointing out how undoable VR is in a 720p.

I have personal experience with different types of VR solutions and enough technical knowledge to understand why the Switch as actually underpowered to do modern VR gaming.

But I guess nowadays reality is multiple choice and what feels real is more important than what is real.

So what's "real" is that you're the sole authority on VR? Right. It doesn't matter that you have personal experience. You're not the only person with that experience. Other people have had it too, and they've been fine with 720p 60fps. Doesn't matter if they are present in this thread. It's well documented. Your personal experience doesn't supercede theirs.

As for "technical knowledge," don't be absurd. VR isn't some magical computational anomaly. It's just a split screen. Like I said, there are phones far weaker than the Switch that do VR gaming just fine. Games are designed around the specifications of their hardware. That's how it's always been. If someone wants to make a VR game for the Switch, they just have to account for its power and target 720p/60fps with a split screen. That's how you've gotten split screen multiplayer since the SNES. VR doesn't need to look realistic to be immersive.



spemanig said:
setsunatenshi said:

Have you actually every tried it yourself? Ever?

Use VR on a 720 screen and tell me it's an enjoyable experience. I dare you

In the absence of first hand experience, I've read plenty of second hand experience saying it's fine. Your word is no better than theirs.

Just so we're clear, you're saying you've never tried it but you're convinced it would be accepted en masse by millions of people. But even assuming that a Switch VR would be fine for you, you still have to justify how you can know it would be fine for others.

Meanwhile many who have tried PSVR say that their VR experience isn't fine with a higher resolution and a higher framerate than you could ever expect on a Switch. They say they get motion sickness. They say they get eye fatigue very easily. For others it is just barely tolerable for half hour intervals. In fact most people i know that have tried the PSVR find it very difficult to use it for more than an hour at a time because to be quite frank, the technology at the pricepoint just isn't there yet. Add in games that are more vibrant and cartoony, and the fatigue becomes even more of an issue. The fact that games like Job Simulator are broken down into half hour chunks is not a coincidence. It's to make the game more digestable in smaller chunks. Now here you are advocating for worse technology at a cheaper price and expecting the same results, when that just isn't realistic.



potato_hamster said:
spemanig said:

In the absence of first hand experience, I've read plenty of second hand experience saying it's fine. Your word is no better than theirs.

Just so we're clear, you're saying you've never tried it but you're convinced it would be accepted en masse by millions of people. But even assuming that a Switch VR would be fine for you, you still have to justify how you can know it would be fine for others.

Meanwhile many who have tried PSVR say that their VR experience isn't fine with a higher resolution and a higher framerate than you could ever expect on a Switch. They say they get motion sickness. They say they get eye fatigue very easily. For others it is just barely tolerable for half hour intervals. In fact most people i know that have tried the PSVR find it very difficult to use it for more than an hour at a time because to be quite frank, the technology at the pricepoint just isn't there yet. Add in games that are more vibrant and cartoony, and the fatigue becomes even more of an issue. The fact that games like Job Simulator are broken down into half hour chunks is not a coincidence. It's to make the game more digestable in smaller chunks. Now here you are advocating for worse technology at a cheaper price and expecting the same results, when that just isn't realistic.

Well arent we onto the age of alternate reality lately?