https://amigobulls.com/stocks/SNE/balance-sheet/quarterly

My apologies. Look at the bottom line. They are over 160 billion dollars in debt. That far outreaches any profit or assets they have. So, i guess there is no argument about whether it's Sony or Nintendo who are in a better state financially.

Indeed. There's never been an argument there. 

Of course it matters because it's the same group of fans. If you're opening up to fans on a different brand that's what we're talking about. 

You know what? Let's check those examples cause I'm not sure you did:

FF12 PS2 exclusive = 6 million. FF13 PS3 = 5.34 million. 360 = 2.17 million. Growth.
MGS 4 = PS3 6 million. MGS 5 = PS4 3.46 million XB1 = 0.93 million. The game sold less on original platform and overall. Franchise is weaker, nothing to do with being multiplat. Xb1 version still sold almost a million copies, (Remember 2015)
Titanfall, See above
Tomb Raider was never an exclusive franchise.
Crash Bandicoot Warped, PS2 = 7.13 million.  Wrath of Cortex, PS2 = 5.42 million, Xbox = 1.23 million, GC = 0.59 Million. Only just did better than previous, I'm not sure it would worth it and may be your first legit example in your list. 
Spyro Year of the Dragon, PS2 = 3.71 million, Spyro Enter the Dragonfly. PS2 = 1.97 million, Gamecube = 0.71 million. 2.68 mil total, See Titanfall.
Tekken 5 PS2 = 3.87 million. Tekken 6 PS3 = 2.75 million, Xbox 360 = 1.3 million. Those are bad numbers, Tekken only outsold the previous due to it being a million seller on 360 meaning going multiplat benefitted them, oops. 

Check your own examples man. But we can go with Crash. It sold over a million on Xbox, definitely covering costs of development. GC version underperformed, wasn't worth it. So out of your 7 examples. half of one counted. 

Yeah I agree with that we still don't know how well the switch is going to do. But Adding 200 million more units to that would significantly increase the sales because nintendo franchises have always been popular, with everyone. Uncharted 4 trailers have the same amount of views as Zelda trailers even though the PS4's user base is way bigger, which means people outside of nintendo's console base are interested in Nintendo games. It's the hardware. 

Come on man, the only popular 2D platformers/Kart racers that sell for FULL retail price are Nintendo franchises. These games that sold 30 million not too long ago on the Wii that sold 100 million units. It wouldn't be all of a sudden. People want to play these games. People wanted to play these games last generation on Wii U. What people didn't want to do was Buy a Wii U. Which is shown even more so due to how well switch is selling. People are buying switches because they want nintendo games. This isn't a new thing, and now that the undesirable Wii U hardware is out of the way more people are buying switches because of nintendo games. Because millions and millions of people want to play nintendo games. They didn't sell more software you can count on Wii U just because of casuals. 

What I'm arguing is that there's millions and millions of more people who either can't afford/jusity buying another box or simply don't want switch hardware *raises hand* but would be interested in playing Nintendo games. You didn't see my first comment but I stated my reason for wanting them to go 3rd party is completely selfish because I want their games. But I would jump off of a cliff if they went third party and didn't sell significantly more, and if you disagree then fair, but every point you've made so far either isn't part of this conversation or just plainly and provably wrong like your 7 examples you cited of games that failed when going multiplat, as if that's the reason they did badly, which most didn't. 

It never ceases to amaze me how every time someone makes a thread like this, they always seem to act as if it's an original idea. "Certain" fans have been clamoring for such for many years, because they don't want to have to buy Nintendo consoles.

IMO, Nintendo having their own consoles is good for the industry, always has been. The minute they go third party, that goes away, along with most of their innovation, and most of their IPs. Because I guarantee, if they went third party, all they would produce from then on out would basically be Mario, Zelda and Pokemon games. Maybe the occasional Mario Kart of Smash Bros.


No thanks.

Well that was actually my original point. This whole thread is about Nintendo going 3rd party. My point was that if any company was to go 3rd party it would be Sony, due to their poor financial state.

I don't think that Nintendo should go 3rd party (not yet) but it would be amazing that they make a special Nintendo service that sells their older games on PC and phones similar to Steam. The switch won't fail because it's a handheld with couch gaming in mind and it's potentially the 3DS successor.

How in the hell are the 14 million people who bought Wii U, the 60 million who bought NES, the 100 million who bought Wii, the 80 million who bought GBA, the 155 million who bought DS, etc.the same group of fans as one another? that doesnt make any sense.

FFX-8.0m, FFX2-5.3m, FFXII-6.0m, FFXIII-7.5m, FFXIII2-3.4m, no notable growth by going multiplatform.

MGS-6.0m, MGS2-6.0m, MGS3-4.2m, MGS4-6.0m, MGSV-5.4m, no notable growth by going multiplatform

Titanfall-3.8m, Titanfall 2-2.5m, no notable growth by going multiplatform

Tekken Tag-4.0m, Tekken 4-3.4m, Tekken 5-3.8m, Tekken 6-4.4m, no notable growth by going multiplatform

Crash-6.8m, Crash 2-7.6m, Crash 3-7.1m, Crash 4-7.2m, no notable growth by going multiplatform

Spyro-5.0m, Spyro 2-3.5m, Spyro 3-3.7m, Spyro 4-2.7m, no notable growth by going multiplatform

All of these examples are valid, you can make all the excuses you want, being on multiple platforms does not gaurantee that a franchise will see notable growth. I never said going multiplatform is the reason they declined or remained stagnant, i was showing you that releasing on more platforms in and of itself does not gaurantee more sales.

Nintendo being the only one who has successful games in those genres doesnt negate what i said. if there was a strong desire for those genres on PS/XB than you would see 3rd parties release those type of games on PS/XB.

You are basically agreeing with me in your 2nd to last paragraph, a successful Nintendo console means that Nintendo franchises will be able to sell to their full potential and on top of that they make profit from hardware, accessories & royalties (along with not having to pay royalties).

No they are not  To see if there is growth you look at the last exclusive game to see where the franchise was at and the sales after going multiplatform. There are no excuses you're getting ridiculous, I literally couldn't have been more clear. 

It does because no one can get away with making them and selling them for that price. Also they aren't as good. Can you find a single full retail price kart racer that has the scores Mario kart does? 

Yes I do agree with that if switch does Wii Numbers. I feel the insane profits made from hardware wouldn't be worth giving up when they're selling 20-30 million units on their games. But is that really going to happen on the switch? I highly doubt it but we'll find out. 

I dont agree with that, looking at a franchises history is more relevant than just its most recent entry. Regardless, going by your method, none of those games had notable growth.

Both of the Sonic Racing games and LBP Karting got good reviews (not as good as MK) and none of them sold that well. My point is, if there was demand for AAA 2D platformers or arcade style racers on PS/XB than you would see developers making these type of games on those platforms but there isnt strong demand so they dont get made.

It doesnt have to be Wii levels. It could be 3DS level sales, 60-70 million hardware with multiple 10+ million sellers and dozens of multimillion selling games. I dont think you realize that most Nintendo IP didnt see large growth by being on Wii. The only 20+ million selling franchises were the Wii Series, Mario Kart & 2D Mario, everything else was under 13 million. Simply taking away the Wii Series puts 1st party sales not much ahead of 3DS 1st party sales.

Yes and practically all of these games have a downward trend. Comparing the sales to a franchise at the peak of its exclusive history to when they went multiplatform is ridiculous. You compare the most recent entry which is a snapshot of the IP's interest. ALL of the games you demonstrated had good growth or an extra million in sales from the other console justifies a port from a financial standpoint. It doesn't cost $60 million to port and ship an extra version. Especially as games are a lot more expensive elsewhere in the world (yaya for $80 games in the UK) Or the series was dying and sold less on the original console as well. 

LBP Karting got a 73 meta, both sonics got 77 and 82 a far far far cry from the 94 Mario Kart 8 on switch is getting. Mario Kart wii 'only' got an 82 but because mario kart is a massive franchise with decades of history it stil sold 35 million units. 28 million more than MK 8. Did those 28 million people die or were grandmas and people that only play mobile? No. Most of these people play PS4's and XBox and steam and had wii as a second console, they'd still buy it if they were interested in the Hardware. And even then you're sitll comparing apples to oranges. Project Cars not doing amazing on PS4 doesn't mean there isn't a market for sim racers, everyone's waiting for/wants to buy GT7. Titanfall doing poorly on PS4 Doesn't mean people don't want to play shooters COD still sells millions. And if you say COD is massive and doesn't count, Mario Kart is arguably bigger. 

60-70 million would be amazing for Nintendo and would definitely mean they don't have to go 3rd party I agree.