yeeeaahhhh...I've always been hesitant but the last week or two culminating in Brock coming back once again ensures I won't be watching WWE anymore. 

They keep fluctuating, too. They keep pushing me away with shit like this only to, over time, slowly win me back by kicking certain people to the curb and actually respecting their wrestlers....then they do it again. 

Fool me once, shame on you. fool me twice, shame on me. Fool me a dozen times over 30 years...well, maybe it's time to let it go.

I feel some context is warranted here. 

As far as I know, Brock Lesnar has not been accused of rape. 

In the Janel Grant lawsuit Vince allegedly said that Brock Lesnar could have sex with Janel Grant as I guess a sort of signing bonus for his new contract. Brock Lesnar was put in contact with her, he asked for explicit videos of her, including one of her urinating, and the two planned to meet up, but that never happened.

I don't doubt that conversation happened. But, I seriously doubt that Brock actually considered having sex with her when signing a contract. He's making more than enough to be able to buy prostitutes. And, he didn't actually meet with her ever, so it seems they weren't that serious about it. But, if it was, then that is something along the lines of solicitation of prostitution which honestly I don't object to. 

I don't want to play the "it's not rape if..." game, but I will say to rape someone you have to be within a mile of them. Not saying his behavior wasn't super gross, but not enough to cross the line for me. If it is for you, then that's your call. If I thought putting him on TV was going to enable him to abuse people then I might feel differently, but I don't see reason to believe that's the case.

That being said, there are plenty of genuine reasons to not watch WWE. The Trump stuff key among them, especially as Linda McMahon is currently dismantling the education system. But, I do not think it logically follows that supporting them is support for Trump. I don't think eating Chick Fil A is supporting homophobia, or watching Harry Potter is supporting transphobia or listening to Elvis music is an endorsement of pedophilia. Likewise I don't think watching Pedro Pascal makes you a trans ally, eating at Wendy's means you are pro-adoption, etc etc. 

People are human, and humans are complicated. That is why things like abusive relationships and addictions happen. Because we can't just shut off the part of the brain that loves someone or that really likes something. WWE was largely the reason I had the friends I had when I was younger. And when I was going through some rough times, there were some months I felt like I didn't have anything to look forward to, and having a Royal Rumble or something to look forward to was kind of important. So, it's kind of hard to just stop. I would guess that most of us have something in our lives that we engage in but feel a bit gross about. And really not looking to get into silly wrestling tribalism, but since you mentioned it, AEW or other promotions just aren't going to scratch that itch for me. 

So to answer the question as to how people support this shit, the answer for some of us is simply that we're human. And part of being human is sometimes giving into desires when you know you probably shouldn't. And I don't really feel bad about being human.

Not looking to argue about it, but since I was indirectly called a pedophilia and nazi sympathizer, I did feel the need to respond. I would suggest that its better for this topic to be for people talking about wrestling, not making judgments of other people's character based on what wrestling shows they like. 

Just because someone says "BOO" that doesn't mean there's a ghost.

I'm not trying to make light or downplay the Janel Grant allegations. They are absolutely disgusting and appalling, and they need to be taken with the utmost seriousness.

But in the United States, if you are charged with a crime, you are innocent until proven guilty. And last time I checked, Brock Lesnar was never charged with anything. Nor does any record of him and Miss Grant meeting exist.

And what I'm about to say is going to REALLY piss off some people... But Miss Grant also bears some responsibility for what happened to her, assuming they did happen.

If they did happen, Vince McMahon and John Lauranitis are the scum of the Earth, and they should be locked away and force them to watch as the keys are melted until they're nothing but ash and cinders. But Miss Grant chose to stay and continue to put up with it for the sake of getting a paycheck when she could have quit immediately, gotten another job elsewhere - I'm sure she's qualified to have earned another respectable position at another company with a much healthier culture, and THEN reported them and pressed criminal charges against McMahon, Lauranitis, and all the parties responsible.
She also chose to sign an NDA and accept payouts to keep quiet about what was happening, and it was only until Vince stopped paying her that she came forth with the allegations. THAT'S why this is all out in the opening. Not because of what happened to her, but because she stopped getting the money to remain quiet about it. Which is not that far off from prostitution if you ask me.

Is that really the message we'd want our daughters, sisters, nieces, etc. to take from this? "There's some real sickos out there who want to do awful, disgusting, and vomit-inducing things to you. But if you're getting paid for it, then it's no problem! It's only until they STOP paying you when they go too far!"

Bottom line: If you cheer for Brock Lesnar and his return, that doesn't make you a sick pervert or rapist. Much like how cheering for Chris Benoit or enjoying his matches doesn't make you a murderer apologist. Or cheering for Hulk Hogan and marking out every time Hulkamania ran wild doesn't make you a racist. Or cheering for The Undertaker and rolling your eyes to the back of your head doesn't make you a MAGA/Trump supporter. Or cheering for CM Punk doesn't make you an atheist or liberal. Or listening to gangsta rap doesn't make you a thug, thief, or drug addict.

If we removed everyone from wrestling who has done some scummy things in their past, there'd be no wrestling business left. Even some of the people in today's locker rooms have some skeletons in their closet that they don't ever want to come out. That's just how it is.
But much like @JWeinComm said, that's what makes these people human.
Social media has fallen in love with the idea of being perfect. Of having no flaws whatsoever and that everything is black and white - That's not how it works in the real world. There are a LOT of shades of gray/grey. And we all have our own faults, bad tendencies, and demons that we have to keep in check in order to try and be the best person we can be. Some are just better at it than others, and some are WORSE at it than others. And boy are people gonna make mistakes, but to make mistakes is what makes us human.

Nah, that's all bullshit. You have other options and better options. Supporting them is enabling their shitty practices and behaviors.

I was actually liking the Cena heel turn...at least he played heel against Punk and Orton at least before he turned face again....

Lol. Nothing says I have a reasonable and well thought out position like shoving your fingers in your ears, refusing to acknowledge any counterpoints, and repeating yourself. For someone who hates Maga you sure do love their rhetorical style.

I really don't see what other promotions have to do with it. The alternative to watching WWE is not watching another promotion, it's not watching WWE. You don't have to watch any promotion, and you could watch more than one. It's not mutually exclusive, so repeatedly bringing up "other promotions" is kind of sus.

But since you want to talk about other options, lets talk about them. Makes sense to start with the second biggest, so I guess its time to talk about AEW. Which I assume is to you one of the better options. And before I'm accused of being anti-AEW, please recall, I'm not the one who brought them up. I tried to limit the discussion purely to WWE, but *shrug*. 

On the Trump side Shad Kahn is bankrolling the thing and donated at least a million to Trump to my knowledge. If we want to play the guilt by association game there you go. And at least some of the money is going to Chris Jericho, who has contributed to the nazi pedophile, and whose wife marched on the capital. So, is giving money to AEW, part of which will go to Jericho, supporting that? 

By the way, we don't actually know who exactly is profiting of AEW. Tony Khan has refused to name the owners of AEW, even going so far as to demand they be redacted in the issue between AEW, CM Punk, and Ryan Nemeth. For some reason Tony Khan doesn't want us to know. It's possible the answer may tarnish the image of AEW. It looks like the judge isn't buying his argument that he can't, so we may find out in the near future. If we find out one of the investors is a Maga person, I trust you will immediately stop watching AEW.

And on the sexual abuse side, lets see who they put on TV. 

Here we have not one, but two sexual predators sharing an AEW ring.Mike Tyson was not only accused of, but convicted of rape.

But actually, I find the allegations against Jericho far more concerning in this context. Jericho was accused of luring Kylie Rae into a hotel room under false pretenses to pressure her into sex. When she reported this to Tony Khan, she then was asked, allegedly, to sign an NDA and was out the door days later. Neither Tony Khan nor Jericho has denied this, and have refused to address the issue when asked directely, which lends credence to the theory that there is an NDA involved. At least Tony Khan was smart enough to pay the money he was obligated to pay to keep the victim quiet. Jericho has seemingly faced zero consequences.

That I think is more serious because Jericho was actually preying on the people his job would put him in direct contact with, and AEW allows him to remain in that position. If we take the allegations as true, which you seem to think we should for Brock, then they are not just ignoring deviant behavior, they are actively putting their female talent target in the direct line of fire of someone who is known to prey on their female talent. 

Oh and as a bonus, three of the people in the ring (Jericho, Tyson, and Swagger) are confirmed MAGA. 

They also decided to put another upstanding citizen, Ric Flair, on TV. 

Then we have Sammy getting a slap on the wrist for talking about how much he would enjoy raping Sasha Banks. 

Darby Allin has been accused of rape (or I believed it was termed nonconcensual sexual acts) and conduct which in my mind is far more serious than what Brock is accused of. Yet he looks poised to be AEW champion in the near future.

So, do you support all of these things? Will you stop watching AEW? Or is there some room for nuance when it's something you like?  I tried to be more cordial in my first post, but this outrage does seem very selective. Combined with the not so subtle, "watch AEW instead" pitch, it makes this seem kind of disingenuous. Like the moral outrage over an incredibly serious situation is really just an excuse to engage in fanboy tribalism which, if true, would be very very sad. 

To be clear, I am not suggesting that there is anything wrong with enjoying AEW. Just pointing out that, if we accept your line of reasoning, there most certainly would be. If we are applying the standards consistently, AEW and WWE are both out. TNA too (Enzo Amore/Tessa Blanchard). My guess is that every other promotion would be too. 

So, if you want to judge people for wanting to watch a wrestling show, fine. But, if you want to stay on that high horse, you should probably provide your most recent credit card statement. Also a list of all media you've consumed for the past year. We can do a moral audit and see what kind of stuff you support. ^_^

I liked the idea. But the thing kind of fell apart quickly. The only benefit Cena actually got out of the turn was that a rapper came very slowly to the ring to sort of mess with Cody. It would have been better of him to not turn until wrestlemania from a kayfabe perspective.

Bigger problem was just that people didn't want to boo John Cena on his last run. I think they did the right things to try and get that to happen; having intentionally boring matches, lame entrance, beating up more popular characters, but people just wanted to see Cena be Cena. I think the idea of Cena being a heel for his last run is something that was better on paper than in practice.

They probably should have started bailing out much sooner than they did, but I think they realized that if they tried to book Cena vs Rhodes as a heel vs face match at Summerslam, the crowd would absolutely turn on Cody. Not in a good way like "Cody is our top heel" way, but the way they hated Roman before the tribal chief gimmick.

I think Cody managed to come out of this in relatively ok shape, which I think why they had to do the turn. 

At the end of the day though, there's like 5 hours of TV per week to film. Sometimes you take a swing and you miss. It's better than trying to force fans to go with something that clearly isn't working. 

I don't think responsibility is the right word here. That implies she in some sense deserved what allegedly happened, and she does absolutely did not. 

It's oversimplifying to say she could have just up and left. There are unfortunately many ways to manipulate people that some abusers know all too well. People wind up in abusive relationships and cults all of the time. 

Could they have avoided it? In the liberatarian sense of free will, yes. Nothing physically compelled her to say yes to anything. Would you or I have done differently in her situation? I think that's a more complex question. Naturally I think "no way I would do that" but otherwise rational people get caught in these kinds of situations so who knows.

It's really the same thing in both cases. As humans our feelings are not always based in logic, and sometimes we can feel completely conflicting emotions about the same person or thing. So, assuming that someone approves of everything their partner in a relationship does is not a safe assumption. Assuming everyone approves of everything the producer of every product they consume does is downright batshit.

I saw that Matt Mernard signed an extension with AEW til 2030.

My first thought was "why would they sign him to such a ridiculously long extension"?

My second thought was "oh wait 2030 is just 5 years away",

I'll just go contemplate my mortality.

The problem is it was a dumb idea to begin with. There wasn't any substance for the heel turn, considering all the accomplishments in and out of the ring for cena.  But considering they were 4 months into it, they should have just finished it properly. But instead he supposedly switches back to babyface, without a proper explanation as to why.  Are we supposed to believe that  a cheap shot beating and being put through a table, is supposed to be a wake up call and suddenly cena forgot everything he said and done prior? Its justs all to silly and immersion breaking. Part of me thinks he's still trolling and a heel. I can't take anything he says seriously.