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Forums - Nintendo - Nintendo what do you want? Outdated hardware? or 3rd Party games? CANT have both!

MTZehvor on 07 August 2016
oniyide said:
MTZehvor said:

Wii missed games largely because it was a nightmare to develop for. Developers would have to redesign control schemes around an entirely new controller, and that was often simply not worth it with the install base.

I never said that a Nintendo console has never missed a game due to lack of power. What I said is that, if the install base is big enough, they will get the vast majority of games, even if said games have to be scaled back as a result. Power only really factors in when a developer is iffy on bringing it to a console and they would need to spend a significant amount of time scaling things back to get them to work, as was the case with Project Cars. 

The biggest factor, by far, is how many people will buy the game. If a developer isn't relying on a console producer to publish the game, then there's very little they'll pass up on a console if they feel the sales are there, even if it needs to be significantly scaled back. This is the reason why the 360 and PS3 kept getting multiplats for a year plus after the release of the PS4 and XBO.

Sure, but why ignore the fact that the Wii was a whole gen behind PS360? There were games like GTA4/5, Fallout etc that wouldnt be possible on the system different control scheme or not. Hell I would imagine the controller is the least pain in the ass in this scenario.

Wii missed a bunch of games due to lack of power and it had a big enough install base.

True, it also kept getting multiplats cause people were still buying those games on the system something that couldnt be said for Wii u.

Fallout wouldn't have been too much trouble to get on the Wii, considering how segmented it is and how many loading points there are. Wii could do that just fine by turning the graphics and render distance down. GTA would be a bit more trouble, and some features would probably have to be scrapped (possibly aerial transport altogether), but it could be done. People forget that the Wii had the biggest open world of the 7th gen in Xenoblade, and the Wii U has an open world bigger than the worlds of Fallout 4, Skyrim, and Witcher 3 combined in Xenoblade X. Both the Wii and the Wii U were capable of some pretty incredible stuff, but it require a bit more effort to make full use of the system's capabilities, which was an extra bit of effort that devs weren't willing to go to if few people were going to buy their game to begin with.



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zorg1000 on 07 August 2016
oniyide said:
zorg1000 said:

Ok so we can agree that its solid/strong support, not amazing and certainly not bad.

A similar level of support from indies and kid/family friendly games and if they can get the level of western support that Wii U had initially would give them a pretty well rounded and strong level of support.

I dont think I said it had bad support, just not the support that some people swore by, maybe its just me but some people were making it seem like it was getting Sony home console level of support

Indies importance is a bit overstated, there are some good games, but those games are also available on just about anything else. Im not saying it would be bad for Ninty to have them. Im just saying that its not that special when you can play said games on a device you most likely already have. Not a big selling point IMHO. Western 3rds are worse as those games sell better on PS4 Xboxone PC well enough.

I know your not saying it has bad support, im just talking about the people who act like NX will have bad support based on Wii U without taking 3DS into consideration.

Youre correct that indie support alone is not hugely important but having a varied and well rounded library is important. Full Nintendo support+solid Japanese support+solid indie support+solid kid/family support+hopefully solid western support (along the lines of Wii U in its first year) would give NX an overall well rounded and strong software lineup.



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

oniyide on 07 August 2016
MTZehvor said:
oniyide said:

Sure, but why ignore the fact that the Wii was a whole gen behind PS360? There were games like GTA4/5, Fallout etc that wouldnt be possible on the system different control scheme or not. Hell I would imagine the controller is the least pain in the ass in this scenario.

Wii missed a bunch of games due to lack of power and it had a big enough install base.

True, it also kept getting multiplats cause people were still buying those games on the system something that couldnt be said for Wii u.

Fallout wouldn't have been too much trouble to get on the Wii, considering how segmented it is and how many loading points there are. Wii could do that just fine by turning the graphics and render distance down. GTA would be a bit more trouble, and some features would probably have to be scrapped (possibly aerial transport altogether), but it could be done. People forget that the Wii had the biggest open world of the 7th gen in Xenoblade, and the Wii U has an open world bigger than the worlds of Fallout 4, Skyrim, and Witcher 3 combined in Xenoblade X. Both the Wii and the Wii U were capable of some pretty incredible stuff, but it require a bit more effort to make full use of the system's capabilities, which was an extra bit of effort that devs weren't willing to go to if few people were going to buy their game to begin with.

thats not how that works. Wii couldnt even run COD games properly but they could run Fallout? Wii doesnt even have the ram to run the game period. Its not a matter of scaling things down, sometimes the system is just too weak. Xenoblade looked likd crap a little worse than FF12 and it was a large world with nothing in it. Those games you mentioned have detail upon detail.



oniyide on 07 August 2016
zorg1000 said:
oniyide said:

I dont think I said it had bad support, just not the support that some people swore by, maybe its just me but some people were making it seem like it was getting Sony home console level of support

Indies importance is a bit overstated, there are some good games, but those games are also available on just about anything else. Im not saying it would be bad for Ninty to have them. Im just saying that its not that special when you can play said games on a device you most likely already have. Not a big selling point IMHO. Western 3rds are worse as those games sell better on PS4 Xboxone PC well enough.

I know your not saying it has bad support, im just talking about the people who act like NX will have bad support based on Wii U without taking 3DS into consideration.

Youre correct that indie support alone is not hugely important but having a varied and well rounded library is important. Full Nintendo support+solid Japanese support+solid indie support+solid kid/family support+hopefully solid western support (along the lines of Wii U in its first year) would give NX an overall well rounded and strong software lineup.

Even if taking GTA into consideration its still missing a lot of games. Its not like 3ds made up for not having the Witcher, Dragon Age, Fallout, Madden, Fifa, etc. Having a bunch of niche Japanese games and some spinoffs is not a replacement for most. Its not about the amount of games but the KIND of games. The system can have all the Etrian Odysseys all it wants but if its missing the GTAs, CODS of the world alot of people wont care.



zorg1000 on 07 August 2016
oniyide said:
zorg1000 said:

I know your not saying it has bad support, im just talking about the people who act like NX will have bad support based on Wii U without taking 3DS into consideration.

Youre correct that indie support alone is not hugely important but having a varied and well rounded library is important. Full Nintendo support+solid Japanese support+solid indie support+solid kid/family support+hopefully solid western support (along the lines of Wii U in its first year) would give NX an overall well rounded and strong software lineup.

Even if taking GTA into consideration its still missing a lot of games. Its not like 3ds made up for not having the Witcher, Dragon Age, Fallout, Madden, Fifa, etc. Having a bunch of niche Japanese games and some spinoffs is not a replacement for most. Its not about the amount of games but the KIND of games. The system can have all the Etrian Odysseys all it wants but if its missing the GTAs, CODS of the world alot of people wont care.

It seems like you completely skipped 2/3 of my post. Like I said, combining the 3DS & Wii U support gives solid Japanese, indie & kid/family support and if they can get similar western support as Wii U in its first year than that would give Nintendo a very well rounded library.

Such a device would have Mario, Pokemon, Monster Hunter, Zelda, Metroid, Call of Duty, Shin Megami Tensei, Fire Emblem, Minecraft, Madden, FIFA, NBA 2K, Etrain Odyssey, Yokai Watch, Terraria, Steamworld, Shantae, Sonic, Dragon Quest, Runbow, Affordable Space Adventures, Kirby, Donkey Kong, Need for Speed, Kingdom Hearts, Resident Evil, Tekken, Street Fighter, Assassin's Creed, Rayman, Just Dance, Skylanders, Lego, Guitar Hero, Dragon Ball, One Piece, Don't Starve, Year Walk, Yoshi, Smash Bros, Bravely Default, Professor Layton, Ace Attorney, Freedom Planet, Xeodrifter, Animal Crossing, Splatoon, Deus Ex, Ninja Gaiden, Sniper Elite, Watch Dogs, Tomodachi, Dead or Alive, Xenoblade, Mass Effect, Rhythm Heaven, Style Savvy, Hatsume Miku, Senren Kagura, Legend of Legacy, Pushmo, Gunman Clive, Shovel Knight, Nintendogs, Theatrythm, Splinter Cell, Batman, Mighty Switch Force, Gaucamelee, Fast Racing Neo, Art of Balance, Nano Assault, Fossil Fighters, Little Battlers, Digimon, etc.

A well-rounded lineup.



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

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Kai_Mao on 07 August 2016

All I would like is someone from third party to release ports that don't feel like hand me downs or not something like just Mass Effect 3 instead of the whole damn trilogy....



oniyide on 08 August 2016
zorg1000 said:
oniyide said:

Even if taking GTA into consideration its still missing a lot of games. Its not like 3ds made up for not having the Witcher, Dragon Age, Fallout, Madden, Fifa, etc. Having a bunch of niche Japanese games and some spinoffs is not a replacement for most. Its not about the amount of games but the KIND of games. The system can have all the Etrian Odysseys all it wants but if its missing the GTAs, CODS of the world alot of people wont care.

It seems like you completely skipped 2/3 of my post. Like I said, combining the 3DS & Wii U support gives solid Japanese, indie & kid/family support and if they can get similar western support as Wii U in its first year than that would give Nintendo a very well rounded library.

Such a device would have Mario, Pokemon, Monster Hunter, Zelda, Metroid, Call of Duty, Shin Megami Tensei, Fire Emblem, Minecraft, Madden, FIFA, NBA 2K, Etrain Odyssey, Yokai Watch, Terraria, Steamworld, Shantae, Sonic, Dragon Quest, Runbow, Affordable Space Adventures, Kirby, Donkey Kong, Need for Speed, Kingdom Hearts, Resident Evil, Tekken, Street Fighter, Assassin's Creed, Rayman, Just Dance, Skylanders, Lego, Guitar Hero, Dragon Ball, One Piece, Don't Starve, Year Walk, Yoshi, Smash Bros, Bravely Default, Professor Layton, Ace Attorney, Freedom Planet, Xeodrifter, Animal Crossing, Splatoon, Deus Ex, Ninja Gaiden, Sniper Elite, Watch Dogs, Tomodachi, Dead or Alive, Xenoblade, Mass Effect, Rhythm Heaven, Style Savvy, Hatsume Miku, Senren Kagura, Legend of Legacy, Pushmo, Gunman Clive, Shovel Knight, Nintendogs, Theatrythm, Splinter Cell, Batman, Mighty Switch Force, Gaucamelee, Fast Racing Neo, Art of Balance, Nano Assault, Fossil Fighters, Little Battlers, Digimon, etc.

A well-rounded lineup.

Didnt ignore it, I just dont think its gonna happen or really matter that much imho. As I said most of those indie games will be available for other systems that people already have, same with western 3rd parties if they even support them and i mean beyond the first year. Japanese games they'll get em but outisde of Japan most people dont care. I get that you believe it will have a well rounded library but we are on a gaming forum so you're preaching to the choir. I'm more concerned about the people who arent that deep into it, I just dont think they are gonna care that much. I think GC had a well rounded library and we see how that turned out.



Culipechi on 08 August 2016
Paperboy_J said:

I'm glad Nintendo doesn't kiss third party developers' asses. This is THEIR system, not third parties'. They're going to make it the way THEY want it, not some other companies who aren't even affiliated with them. And, well, I respect that.

 



Never on 08 August 2016

What they really want is third party exclusives like what the 3ds has, and with a similar install base the nx should get them. Of course those exclusives were mainly japanese.



daredevil.shark on 08 August 2016

There is an important thing people are forgetting. What do they mean by third party? Western or Japnese?
People who are enthusiastic about Nintendo acknowledges that NX won't be getting EA, Take two (GTA, Mafia etc) or others made game. So most of the western third party will ignore NX.
In one thing everyone agrees that Nintendo will get decent third party games. But cream of those will be missing. Form software won't be releasing their game in NX as well as many others. And in semi dead Handheld area they have monopoly and this is diminishing as developers are getting attracted to smartphones more.
So my question is what is Nintendos demographic? Western market or home Japanese market. Because I don't see it doing well given the circumstances.