Watching for the second time. It's better the second time.

Holy crap. I have to watch it now.

How is being brutally tortured and beaten (to death) "respectful"?

Let's imagine for a brief moment, what if Jason Todd wasn't a boy, but girl. "Violence against Women". The End.

If it's unbearable to watch, outright vicious even for 18+ standard, then gender shouldn't play a role. However, it obviously does.

You wrote it yourself:

What about your best pal? Not embarrased to show him?

Sry, but you're just being sexist here. At least from my point of view. I'm one of those rare individuals who'd like to see men and women equally treated. You're just patronizing, like the way you decided for your girlfriend how to feel about this animated movie.

It follows the source material for the character. It doesn't add scenes which further shows him being an inept character in the universe before they show the killing, and in fact the focus of the movie is his resurrection and his ability to go toe to toe with the bat, NOT his death. It shows PLENTY of respect to Jason Todd. Have you seen that movie?

As for the second part, I never said I would want to show it to anyone, I merely mentioned the two people I live with. THis is your own leap of logic.

Under the Red Hood definitively strays from the source material--way more than the Killing Joke did. I guess the problem you have is that you like the way one strays more than the other.

The closest DCU films to the comics have been Dark Knight Returns pt 1&2, Batman Year One, and The Killing Joke. The rest take a lot of liberties, some good and some bad. At least, with Under The Red Hood, the same guy that penned the comic penned the screenplay (Judd Winning). Maybe that's why it seemed better to you.

"Denial" is not a river in Egypt    Sounds like you don t like the term - like I said call them ( or call yourself if it fits) whatever you want -  Beta male seems like an agreeable name for such a condition - I m sure there are less flattering terms s for it 

i think it is a learned condition myself ( in most examples ) but more study may be needed

What I'm thinking happened: Batman TAS was basically a weekday afternoon show. And Beyond was a more important weekened series. Plus, they probably restricted them to keeping things more self contained, per episodes. Or it was because of the limited episodes per season. Batman S1 ran for 65 episodes. They had a lot of room to set things up. With 13, only on weekends. Probably blocked them from doing things more naturally. We could't get a fleshed out ending, for Beyond. Intill Justice League Unlimited.

UTRH definitely cut out what it didn't need to tell the story and changed some things up, but the beginning of The Killing Joke doesn't even seem to know the character it is trying to portray (at least in Barbara Gordon's case). Tough to say which actually stayed closer to the source material, though after roughly a third of the movie in The Killing Joke is pretty much dead on.

I didn't know Judd Winning penned the screenplay, but yeah, it seems to get the comics and the characters it represents perfectly. None seem so insanely out of character for no good reason.

I want to argue with you but I can't since UTRH and Flashpoint are my two favorite DC films.

You win this time....

It wasn't that.  I actually liked Beyond.  Bruce isn't nearly the ass that they were trying to portray in the rebound episodes.  They made it seem like he was in Beyond, but you only get that when Barbera's talking about him.  But in the rebound episode, they just went overboard.  As good as Old Wounds was, it didn't make sense.  Dick has worked enough with Bruce to know he was bluffing when he was threatening that guy.  Timm and maybe even Dini put this thing in their heads that Bruce is this super asshole and no one wants to work with him.  It's like Superman understood Batman better than Dick or Barbera.  Think about that for a second.  Even with the fling with Batgirl and Batman.  They only talked about it in Beyond, and in a way you can get away with it there.  Then they made that crap Mystery of the Batwoman, which luckily, Barbera wasn't in for more than a minute.  But what bugs me is that, I was watching the extras for Batman TAS and they were going on about "Batman/Batgirl" and how there was all these moments with them, and blah blah blah.  I was like ... "No there wasn't".  They literally put stuff in their heads that wasn't there.  Dick and Barbera interacted way more than Batman and Barbara in that regards.  So they literally made stuff up.  Did they have plans for that as they were making the epsiodes?  Maybe. It could be as you said.  But even the assifying of Batman to the extent that they tried to portray (Then renege on it).  It's like "Batman's an asshole!" then throughout the series "Well, he really isn't, but we want to make it look like he was!"  Like you can't have something planned, not do it, then pretend you did.  They NEVER wrote Batman like that in the original series.  Then to try to force it later on, something wasn't right and I don't think it was because of the WB switch.  Even running 3 shows at a time when Beyond came.  Batman/Superman was put on the back burner by that point.