By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Sony Discussion - Ratchet and Clank PS4 analysis (DigitalFoundry)

CGI-Quality said:
spemanig said:
The game should be running at 60fps. No excuse.

The game would still look great at 60fps, especially if they just lowered the resolution to 720p so they could keep most of the effects and visuals any. But of course Insomniac wants to pretend that the PS4 is a powerhouse when it isn't by slapping a meaningless 1080 number onto it. They'd rather have a game that played worse and looked virtually the same than have a game that looked a smudge blurrier, but played the way a game is supposed to.

This just comes off as a little "eh"... All I can say is without any proof, it's probably best not to take the conversation somewhere it shouldn't go.

Proof of what?

And I don't understand. The topic is about a tech analysis of R&C for PS4 in which the decision to make the game run at 30fps instead of 60fps was discussed. I wasn't taking the conversation in any direction it wasn't already set up to be in by the video itself and the content discussed within it, unless you mean the comment about the PS4 not being a powerhouse, in which case the proof is explicitely in the fact that it can't run this game at an appropriate framerate at 1080p when there is tech available today, regardless of how much exponencially more expensive they would be, that could do it easily.

I don't think I was being particularly harsh on the platform, as I didn't call it weak or underpowered, just that it couldn't run the game an appropriate framerate while pushing hardware-intensive graphics at a 1080p resolution, which is a fact. It can't. Which isn't an issue because it's a console and is meant to be affordable and accessible, not some benchmark machine. It's not meant or designed to push high intensive graphics and, like I said, it can still output absolutely excellent looking and visually impressive games at a playable framerate, including the game I'm criticising, by just lowering the resolution from 1080p to 720p and toning down some of the visuals a bit.

So I don't mean to be a rebel, but how exactly was that post taking the conversation somewhere it shouldn't go? Was I going off topic? Was I being unfair with my criticism? Should I not be criticizing that decision at all? Was I being inappropriately harsh on the game, the developer, or the platform in any way what-so-ever? Was I leading it in a direction where those concerns might become a reality?



Around the Network
Mr Puggsly said:
Skratchy said:
Oh no! How will we ever play a game at 30fps?! Lol.

Well its a series people were accustomed to play at 60 fps, so the frame drop sucks. I mean people wouldn't be happy if the next God of War was gonna be locked at 30 fps.

I haven't played the series much so I'm not complaining personally.

There hasn't been a 60fps R&C game in7 years. I think people will be fine.



Teeqoz said:
They have been very open about it being 30 fps, so that isn't news. The last R&C was also 30 fps. Personally I don't mind, I loved the last one, didn't give a fuck about it being 30 fps (at that time, I didn't know, and I didn't notice either). Sunset Overdrive (Insomniac Games' last game) was also 30 fps.

Looking at that video, the 30 fps was rock solid. The only thing was some very *very* sligt frame-pacing issues in some very short moments of gameplay. Calling it "occasional dipping" is overstating it grossly.

it is really rare and it is probably getting patched asap.



Lawlight said:
Mr Puggsly said:

Well its a series people were accustomed to play at 60 fps, so the frame drop sucks. I mean people wouldn't be happy if the next God of War was gonna be locked at 30 fps.

I haven't played the series much so I'm not complaining personally.

There hasn't been a 60fps R&C game in7 years. I think people will be fine.

I was just trying to work out how to say the same thing. How are people accustomed to playing a game at 60fps that they haven't played in 10 years.

And also I only found out JUST NOW that R&C was 60fps. I had no idea and didn't care.



Paatar said:

R&C -smooth 30 FPS for the most parts, subtle dipping, no one gives a shit
Star Fox Zero - smooth 60FPS for most parts on TWO screens with some dipping down to 50FPS and sometimes even a whole 40!!! Omg so bad lets riot and tell Nintendo to get their shit together

More proof of Nintendo getting hate because it's Nintendo.

Frame dipping at 60fps is far more noticeable than at 30fps. That's why I much prefer a stable 30fps than a dipping 60fps.

And I can only look at one screen at a time so I don't need two screens lol



Around the Network
Paatar said:

R&C -smooth 30 FPS for the most parts, subtle dipping, no one gives a shit
Star Fox Zero - smooth 60FPS for most parts on TWO screens with some dipping down to 50FPS and sometimes even a whole 40!!! Omg so bad lets riot and tell Nintendo to get their shit together

More proof of Nintendo getting hate because it's Nintendo.

Considering everybody except Andrew from GameXplain has said that the controls are the problem in Star Fox, literally nobody except the most hardcore of apologists wants two screen Star Fox aiming. And this is coming from somebody who is usually a stout Nintendo guy. 

 

Let's not make an issue out of something that isn't one, especially if you're going to ignore the big problems with your very argument. 



You should check out my YouTube channel, The Golden Bolt!  I review all types of video games, both classic and modern, and I also give short flyover reviews of the free games each month on PlayStation Plus to tell you if they're worth downloading.  After all, the games may be free, but your time is valuable!

Paatar said:

R&C -smooth 30 FPS for the most parts, subtle dipping, no one gives a shit
Star Fox Zero - smooth 60FPS for most parts on TWO screens with some dipping down to 50FPS and sometimes even a whole 40!!! Omg so bad lets riot and tell Nintendo to get their shit together

More proof of Nintendo getting hate because it's Nintendo.

Not sure if serious.  The frame-rate drops between the two games aren't even comparable, Star Fox's drops are way more frequent and way higher.



spemanig said:
The game should be running at 60fps. No excuse.

The game would still look great at 60fps, especially if they just lowered the resolution to 720p so they could keep most of the effects and visuals any. But of course Insomniac wants to pretend that the PS4 is a powerhouse when it isn't by slapping a meaningless 1080 number onto it. They'd rather have a game that played worse and looked virtually the same than have a game that looked a smudge blurrier, but played the way a game is supposed to.

I don't think they would go with 60fps, no matter how much GPU juice you give them, they would still go with 30fps and better visuals (game looks great, but let's be realistic, that's not Pixar level, let alone ILM with Rango). It's simply design decision, just like, let's say, Zelda@30fps is design decision.



I REALLY liked that Tools Of Destruction and A Crack In Time looked as good as they did, and also ran at 60fps. I remember Insomniac stating that all future R&C games, starting with Into The Nexus (which I have yet to play), would be at 30fps, and being crestfallen at the news. It won't influence my purchase at all, but I still lament the loss of 60fps glory the first 2 PS3 games had.



- "If you have the heart of a true winner, you can always get more pissed off than some other asshole."

CGI-Quality said:
spemanig said:

Proof of what?

And I don't understand. The topic is about a tech analysis of R&C for PS4 in which the decision to make the game run at 30fps instead of 60fps was discussed. I wasn't taking the conversation in any direction it wasn't already set up to be in by the video itself and the content discussed within it, unless you mean the comment about the PS4 not being a powerhouse, in which case the proof is explicitely in the fact that it can't run this game at an appropriate framerate at 1080p when there is tech available today, regardless of how much exponencially more expensive they would be, that could do it easily.

I don't think I was being particularly harsh on the platform, as I didn't call it weak or underpowered, just that it couldn't run the game an appropriate framerate while pushing hardware-intensive graphics at a 1080p resolution, which is a fact. It can't. Which isn't an issue because it's a console and is meant to be affordable and accessible, not some benchmark machine. It's not meant or designed to push high intensive graphics and, like I said, it can still output absolutely excellent looking and visually impressive games at a playable framerate, including the game I'm criticising, by just lowering the resolution from 1080p to 720p and toning down some of the visuals a bit.

So I don't mean to be a rebel, but how exactly was that post taking the conversation somewhere it shouldn't go? Was I going off topic? Was I being unfair with my criticism? Should I not be criticizing that decision at all? Was I being inappropriately harsh on the game, the developer, or the platform in any way what-so-ever? Was I leading it in a direction where those concerns might become a reality?

To put it simply - yes. For example, you suggested that the company was trying to make the PS4 sound like something it isn't by making the game 30fps and pushing more on screen (an assumption for which I don't get the origin). Never mind that this was a universal decision they made for the future of all their games at the back half of last gen. I'm not giving any opinions, just letting you know why your comment can (and may have) turned this into a slug fest (that being one of the reasons).

Also, it was reported, so I'm just getting you caught up.

The origin of that assumption precisely is the decision Insomniac (and too many developers) made to make their games run at 30fps. The reason that decision was made was specifically to cut gameplay corners as a way to achieve a visual fidelity they couldn't achieve on the platform they're working with without doing so because they make games on consoles, platforms not designed or priced to push high resolution intensive graphics at an acceptable framerate. That's a creative decision I take issue with, and a creative decision that was brought up, discussed, and even slightly criticized in the video that makes up the topic of this thread. I mentioned the PS4 specifically and only because this is a PS4 exclusive game, so there would be no reason for me to bring up other platforms. I've made similar comments about Sunset Overdrive, as well as any game on a console that isn't attempting to push boundries that directly effect gameplay in a positive way as an alibi for not running a game at 60fps. This is a sentiment I've echoed on countless occasions about many games for every single gaming platform.

I mention this in case you or anyone else feels that my statement had anything to do with the specific platform its on (it didn't), rather than the more general propensity for console developers exactly like Insomniac to make these kinds of decisions to make a game play objectively worse just to try and make their game compete visually with PC hardware that is deliberately designed and priced to outclass them, something I feel I shouldn't need to have to explain or defend because I wasn't being inflamatory anyway.

Needless to say, I feel the report was completely unwarrented. That being said, I do appreciate you catching me up. I didn't even think about that post after I posted it until you quoted me - that's how harmless I thought it was - which is why I wanted some clarification on the matter.