Forums - Music Discussion - Is "heavy metal, like" designed as a platform for singers who aren't exactly..."good"?

Is heavy metal designed as a platform for singers who aren't exactly..."good"?

Yes. 25 14.97%
 
No. 126 75.45%
 
See results. 16 9.58%
 
Total:167
Baryonyx said:
ps4tw said:

" they basically work on a new album every year and they have 20 min long songs" 

Neither of those things show talent, as talent is quality, not quantity. Same goes for the rest of your comment talking about "crowds" - absolutely unrelated to talent. You can have zero fans, or a million, but neither are indicative of talent.

I think the sign of a talented artist is when they show a healthy palate of variety and unquestionable skill in a genre that is challenging. Having listened quickly to some Dream Theater, it's nothing special and certainly a far cry from being special; it sounds like it could be used as backing music to Flash Gordon. Now if we look at someone who is unquestionably gifted at music composition, Hans Zimmer, then the mile wide chasm between him and Dream Theater is clear. That's not to say both can't be enjoyed, but lets not confuse talent and mediocrity. 

Wow, just wow.  Do you play a instrument? Do you have any clue about notes and key-signatures at all?
You basically compared a set piece of difficult set-pieces with over 130 time signature changes, not only do you have to play the correct notes, the timing is key. Hanz zimmer is good, but his music isn't even challenging at all, it's basically the same key-signature through-out the entire song, which are the simplest signature to follow, 4/4... It's hillarious that you can't comprehend Notes and signatures.. 
You simply don't have a damn clue, you better go educate yourself on music-theory.. It would be okay if you simply aren't interested in Progressive music such as Rush, Dream theater, Emerson, lake and palmer which creates music completely different then any other musician out there, it requires a brain that can follow a melody that stretches far beyond a simple 4/4 beat, but to downgrade the entire genre down to Flash-gordon? which is a 4/4 beat, with a few power-chords and a Guitar with Phaser-effect pedal only proves that you have no clue about what you are talking about.. the only reason why you brought Zimmer, are simply because you are a movies fan.

Fuck my life, that i constantly have to take shit like this. Go listen to Dream theater- Dance of eternity, perhaps LIVE and then you can come back to me, perhaps you actually know where you fucked up. Also, the entire thing is an insult to Zimmer as well, You basically compared his life-work with Flash-gordon, Zimmer is a great musician in his own right, except that he is famous for being a copy-cat who uses the same chord-progression, same for 4 notes from a lot of other famous movie-composer's, because using what people are familiare with, is instant succsess. It's weird a pro such as yourself didn't know this.. Dream theater in comparison is atleast original with their chord-progression, they even change the entire beat up with unique key-signature changes, which i bet, if you was good at counting beat, wouldn't be able to follow, unless if you aren't really consentrating, if you actually did like the dream theater music, the struggle to pay attention to the change of beat, notes, chord progression wouldn't have been degraded down to flash gordon, simply because they share one similarity, to make it sound majestic and tight.  Pirates of caribbean theme is a faster version of gladiator, which again was taken from Mars, even a lot of the part's in pirates of caribbean is also a pure rip off from titanic.. the list is endless, check it yourself if there are any doubt's. So it's challenging to rip other composer's off with 4/4 melodies? Hahahaha! You made my day sir

Your entire comment was so dumb, i actually consider it stealth-trolling cuz why else would you say such ignorant shit? I can't think of anything else then a provotion. Well, trolling and gaming goes hand in hand these days.

Yep I play an instrument and to think music just boils down to time signature shows how little you understand. That's like saying all that matters with a car is the BHP. It's hilarious that you reduce music to one element of it. Actually, it's just pretty desperate, and would make an album like "If It'd Were You, We'd Never Leave" an awes inspiring masterpiece, which it isn't.

So instead of attempting to be patronising, go listen to music outside of your tiny field of view. Also claiming one of the greatest composers of all time is merely good  and the music isn't challenging is absurd - what piece are you talking about? How on earth would you know if a piece is difficult to play or not unless you are versed in playing every instrument found in an orchestra, and more? You don't, showing your comment is little more than defensive BS. The fact that your reply is so emotive shows you clearly have more vested in this than "is it good or not?". 

Oh Zimmer is now not original?  Please tell me where the scores of Interstellar, Black Hawk Down and Galdiator merge. Or are you just spouting the same ignorant nonsense that some bunwearing, moustache waxing hipster, or pretentious greasy haired metal-head used as an argument as to why their band is the best in the world and it's normal to walk around as a living billboard for metal? Also you do realise that the similarity between Mars and Gladitor are almost certainly not accidental due to Mars being THE ROMAN GOD OF WAR. Yeah, see the similarity to the film now?

Great, you're the kind of kid that comes across a different opinion, throws a tantrum and then passively aggressively asserts the other person must be "trolling" because they're "too stupid to say that deliberatly"! Original. Or, how about you talk about this like a mature adult and stop acting like a toddler whose dropped their ice cream on the sidewalk



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ps4tw said:
Baryonyx said:

Wow, just wow.  Do you play a instrument? Do you have any clue about notes and key-signatures at all?
You basically compared a set piece of difficult set-pieces with over 130 time signature changes, not only do you have to play the correct notes, the timing is key. Hanz zimmer is good, but his music isn't even challenging at all, it's basically the same key-signature through-out the entire song, which are the simplest signature to follow, 4/4... It's hillarious that you can't comprehend Notes and signatures.. 
You simply don't have a damn clue, you better go educate yourself on music-theory.. It would be okay if you simply aren't interested in Progressive music such as Rush, Dream theater, Emerson, lake and palmer which creates music completely different then any other musician out there, it requires a brain that can follow a melody that stretches far beyond a simple 4/4 beat, but to downgrade the entire genre down to Flash-gordon? which is a 4/4 beat, with a few power-chords and a Guitar with Phaser-effect pedal only proves that you have no clue about what you are talking about.. the only reason why you brought Zimmer, are simply because you are a movies fan.

Fuck my life, that i constantly have to take shit like this. Go listen to Dream theater- Dance of eternity, perhaps LIVE and then you can come back to me, perhaps you actually know where you fucked up. Also, the entire thing is an insult to Zimmer as well, You basically compared his life-work with Flash-gordon, Zimmer is a great musician in his own right, except that he is famous for being a copy-cat who uses the same chord-progression, same for 4 notes from a lot of other famous movie-composer's, because using what people are familiare with, is instant succsess. It's weird a pro such as yourself didn't know this.. Dream theater in comparison is atleast original with their chord-progression, they even change the entire beat up with unique key-signature changes, which i bet, if you was good at counting beat, wouldn't be able to follow, unless if you aren't really consentrating, if you actually did like the dream theater music, the struggle to pay attention to the change of beat, notes, chord progression wouldn't have been degraded down to flash gordon, simply because they share one similarity, to make it sound majestic and tight.  Pirates of caribbean theme is a faster version of gladiator, which again was taken from Mars, even a lot of the part's in pirates of caribbean is also a pure rip off from titanic.. the list is endless, check it yourself if there are any doubt's. So it's challenging to rip other composer's off with 4/4 melodies? Hahahaha! You made my day sir

Your entire comment was so dumb, i actually consider it stealth-trolling cuz why else would you say such ignorant shit? I can't think of anything else then a provotion. Well, trolling and gaming goes hand in hand these days.

Yep I play an instrument and to think music just boils down to time signature shows how little you understand. That's like saying all that matters with a car is the BHP. It's hilarious that you reduce music to one element of it. Actually, it's just pretty desperate, and would make an album like "If It'd Were You, We'd Never Leave" an awes inspiring masterpiece, which it isn't.

So instead of attempting to be patronising, go listen to music outside of your tiny field of view. Also claiming one of the greatest composers of all time is merely good  and the music isn't challenging is absurd - what piece are you talking about? How on earth would you know if a piece is difficult to play or not unless you are versed in playing every instrument found in an orchestra, and more? You don't, showing your comment is little more than defensive BS. The fact that your reply is so emotive shows you clearly have more vested in this than "is it good or not?". 

Oh Zimmer is now not original?  Please tell me where the scores of Interstellar, Black Hawk Down and Galdiator merge. Or are you just spouting the same ignorant nonsense that some bunwearing, moustache waxing hipster, or pretentious greasy haired metal-head used as an argument as to why their band is the best in the world and it's normal to walk around as a living billboard for metal? Also you do realise that the similarity between Mars and Gladitor are almost certainly not accidental due to Mars being THE ROMAN GOD OF WAR. Yeah, see the similarity to the film now?

Great, you're the kind of kid that comes across a different opinion, throws a tantrum and then passively aggressively asserts the other person must be "trolling" because they're "too stupid to say that deliberatly"! Original. Or, how about you talk about this like a mature adult and stop acting like a toddler whose dropped their ice cream on the sidewalk

I knew you would say something stupid like that, music is subjective but the work behind a song is still very appearant, i gave a opinion or a option to what you recommended me to do, what you did was to bash it by comparing it to *Flash gordon* just to devalue a band, which are in fact insanely talented and and prefer the musical art of progressive music. I play everything from funk, punk, blues, jazz, metal, classical and kra/alternative rock, i also love writing melodies which got different key-signatures to make the melody a bit more interesting, so you can keep on trolling as much as you want, devalue and bash whatever you want to further your own agenda. What you brought me, was a copy-cat and just because it's two similare movies, doesn't give any musician the right or the priviledge to copy music from the other movie, it's like you prefer this stale-corporate world where creativity and progress are being traded in for *Playing it safe, make movies and songs that people already are familiare with or else we we lose potential profit in the budget* It's a fair respons from me after that retarded attempt you made to bash and insult me, which you still tries to do, so i have no guilt to continue myself. 

Copy/past is not a creative form of art, unless if it's influences, but there are still a limit to how much of a song you can take influences from before it becxomes a dirty-cheap ass copy to be as lazy as you can possible be, instead of actually working for it.. I am pretty sure Movie-musicians are using old samples as well.. since they basically use the same old sound effect's in all of the hollywood movies. 

You better cut back on your arrogance, If musicians can make music from different forms of key-signatures, if it's 3/3 or 7/2, they can do it.. 
If you don't like it, it's your choice but that still doesn't give you the right to be a complete douche about it.

 

User was banned for this and two other posts in here ~ CGI-Quality 



 

PSN: Opticstrike90
Steam: opticstrike90

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PSN: Opticstrike90
Steam: opticstrike90

Baryonyx said:
ps4tw said:

Yep I play an instrument and to think music just boils down to time signature shows how little you understand. That's like saying all that matters with a car is the BHP. It's hilarious that you reduce music to one element of it. Actually, it's just pretty desperate, and would make an album like "If It'd Were You, We'd Never Leave" an awes inspiring masterpiece, which it isn't.

So instead of attempting to be patronising, go listen to music outside of your tiny field of view. Also claiming one of the greatest composers of all time is merely good  and the music isn't challenging is absurd - what piece are you talking about? How on earth would you know if a piece is difficult to play or not unless you are versed in playing every instrument found in an orchestra, and more? You don't, showing your comment is little more than defensive BS. The fact that your reply is so emotive shows you clearly have more vested in this than "is it good or not?". 

Oh Zimmer is now not original?  Please tell me where the scores of Interstellar, Black Hawk Down and Galdiator merge. Or are you just spouting the same ignorant nonsense that some bunwearing, moustache waxing hipster, or pretentious greasy haired metal-head used as an argument as to why their band is the best in the world and it's normal to walk around as a living billboard for metal? Also you do realise that the similarity between Mars and Gladitor are almost certainly not accidental due to Mars being THE ROMAN GOD OF WAR. Yeah, see the similarity to the film now?

Great, you're the kind of kid that comes across a different opinion, throws a tantrum and then passively aggressively asserts the other person must be "trolling" because they're "too stupid to say that deliberatly"! Original. Or, how about you talk about this like a mature adult and stop acting like a toddler whose dropped their ice cream on the sidewalk

I knew you would say something stupid like that, music is subjective but the work behind a song is still very appearant, i gave a opinion or a option to what you recommended me to do, what you did was to bash it by comparing it to *Flash gordon* just to devalue a band, which are in fact insanely talented and and prefer the musical art of progressive music. I play everything from funk, punk, blues, jazz, metal, classical and kra/alternative rock, i also love writing melodies which got different key-signatures to make the melody a bit more interesting, so you can keep on trolling as much as you want, devalue and bash whatever you want to further your own agenda. What you brought me, was a copy-cat and just because it's two similare movies, doesn't give any musician the right or the priviledge to copy music from the other movie, it's like you prefer this stale-corporate world where creativity and progress are being traded in for *Playing it safe, make movies and songs that people already are familiare with or else we we lose potential profit in the budget* It's a fair respons from me after that retarded attempt you made to bash and insult me, which you still tries to do, so i have no guilt to continue myself. 

Copy/past is not a creative form of art, unless if it's influences, but there are still a limit to how much of a song you can take influences from before it becxomes a dirty-cheap ass copy to be as lazy as you can possible be, instead of actually working for it.. I am pretty sure Movie-musicians are using old samples as well.. since they basically use the same old sound effect's in all of the hollywood movies. 

You better cut back on your arrogance, If musicians can make music from different forms of key-signatures, if it's 3/3 or 7/2, they can do it.. 
If you don't like it, it's your choice but that still doesn't give you the right to be a complete douche about it.  It's funny how you spinned the entire situation into making me the aggressor when you started it. I told you, a conversation like this is a big waste of time, and i said: No matter what i bring to the table it won't matter.. Yet you had the nerve and indecency to compare it with flash gordon.. You behave like a damn sociopath, it's all about you and your damn emotions, well, that is okay.. But still.. You behave inappropriate and i don't appriciate how you can hide a insult behind a question (which is basically how trolling started back in the 4chan days) and then pin it all on me. Please, let this sorry ass thread die already.. It's all about dissing a form of music that you don't understand, which then there are no point in even discussing it.. Music isn't set in stone, there are no rules in what music people should like, and there are absolutely no reason for a person to speak ill about something they don't understand either, they are only proving to the world that they indeed doesn't understand it.. Waste of fucking time

Okay let me break down your response as clearly you've a problem with what I've said:

1)I mention that there is more to music than the key signature. Your reply is to insult me. 

2) I demonstrate how Hans Zimmer is original. You ignore this, and go on to insult me. 

3) You've been there aggressive party in this conversation and go on to claim I'm a sociopath. That is a masterpiece of armchair psychology and deflecting at its finest. 

 

Just because Dream Thearte don't use a standard key signature doesn't mean they don't sound like the soundtrack to Flash Gordon. It's awful music, paint by numbers if you will with a pretentious veneer over it to cover this obvious fact up. 



It's more of a different vocal quality than "bad" singing. I would say as singers, they're probably less skillful than most other genres, but there still is a special type of talent that it takes to be good at that type of singing.