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Forums - Nintendo - What if Nintendo Doesn't Comeback?

 

Can Nintendo Dominate

It will Beat the Xbox One 161 32.66%
 
It will Beat X1 and PS4 59 11.97%
 
It will beat PS4 but not ... 53 10.75%
 
See Results 220 44.62%
 
Total:493
bdbdbd on 12 January 2016
naruball said:
bdbdbd said:

It has the best exclusives. If they're not that good, the competition naturally has it worse. Who cares about reviews anyways these days, outside of PR. Sony did not manage to sell PS3 for 599. The situation for PS3 was pretty much the same Wii U is facing at the moment: the games started coming years after the release, although PS3 had lots of 3rd party games, while Wii U isn't.

 

I don't think that's the case. I was under the impression that the ps3 struggled until the slim model but then read that it did well from the getgo, outselling xb360 consistently every year until Kinect took off. Sony has such a strong brand in home consoles, it can convince the consumers to buy its consoles even at a high price and with limited first party games. Ninty cannot. Hence the wii being the only exception since the n64 says. But sure. Let's wait until the next ninty console is released and see how it does.

As for Ninty ips being stale, I agree with you (been playing pokemon Y the last couple of weeks) and it's stale as hell. Same music, same story (oooh, it's time fire causing trouble), many same moves, yet the games still sell amazingly well and move hardware.

If you (as in anyone) spend most of your time on Ninty forums or around Ninty fans expressing their excitement over Zelda, you get the impression that the wrold can't wait for the new Zelda game. The reality may be a bit different, i.e. the hardcore fans being very local and the masses being indifferent to the game.

PS3 did like shit. The worldwide sales of PS3 was pretty equal to PS2 in Japan. 360 did even worse. The hardware had constant revamps to cheaper models while cutting the price and taking losses as much as you can handle. SCE didn't go belly-up for fun.

Even if it is stale, Pokemon keeps exploring the Pokemon content deeper and it expands the Pokemon universe every new generation, so it's actually doing much better than NSMB.

That's true about Zelda. It is praised to heavens by Zelda fans, but nobody else seem to like the games anymore than the handful of people in the internet. Let's face it: the last four main Zelda games (non-remakes) have been pretty much shit. I bought Skyward Sword thinking it would return back to oldschool Zelda after Aonuma hinted it would, but the hell it didn't; it was the even worse than Twilight Princess that had you play tutorial for half of the game. Hyrule Warriors is a much better game, there you actually can kill enemies. Lots of them.



Ei Kiinasti.

Eikä Japanisti.

Vaan pannaan jalalla koreasti.

 

Nintendo games sell only on Nintendo system.

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oniyide on 12 January 2016
naruball said:
wombat123 said:

Yup.  Marketing was just one of the things that went wrong with the Wii U.  This entire gen (3DS/Wii U) was a case of Nintendo falling because of their hubris -- especially with the Wii U.  They just expected people to buy a weak console with an expensive gimmick along with no advertising or games based solely on the 'Wii' brand.  They were so confident in the 'Wii' name selling it that it almost looked like they just sent the console out there to die.  If anything can be salvaged from this gen, Nintendo probably learned a large lesson in humility and hopefully won't make the same mistakes with the NX.

Interestingly enough, that's not the reaction we got here on vgc. The wiiu won most polls that asked users which console they are planning on buying or which console will win the console race. They said that a 3d Mario game will do the trick. If not, definitely a 2d Mario. You just wait for Mario Kart, etc. Then people started blaming marketing and will do again, if NX fails.

I couldn't disagree more. The wiiu was destined to fail and anyone who was not a fan could see it. Mario Kart wii didn't seel 30m+ because of its insane popularity. It was a big franchise but a whole lot of its sales came from the installbase. Ninty IPs sell consoles, just not as many as Ninty or its fans would like to. I see no way Ninty can win a home console generation unless the come up with something innovative/a gimmick. As much as people try to deny it, Ninty/Sony/MS IPs are not enough for a console to become successful. Plus since the xb360 gneration, people are less likely to lose their achievements/trophies and move to a new system. I don't see how Ninty can make a comeback no matter what. Games like Splatoon are not enough and wiiu hardware sales clearly show that.

This. I figured they were screwed when the pad was limited to one person. To be fair most of the people that were swearing up and down about how well Wii U would do arent even around anymore, better to leave than eat crow like an adult i guess. Even then i never imagined it would be THIS bad.





oniyide on 12 January 2016
bdbdbd said:
naruball said:

I don't think that's the case. I was under the impression that the ps3 struggled until the slim model but then read that it did well from the getgo, outselling xb360 consistently every year until Kinect took off. Sony has such a strong brand in home consoles, it can convince the consumers to buy its consoles even at a high price and with limited first party games. Ninty cannot. Hence the wii being the only exception since the n64 says. But sure. Let's wait until the next ninty console is released and see how it does.

As for Ninty ips being stale, I agree with you (been playing pokemon Y the last couple of weeks) and it's stale as hell. Same music, same story (oooh, it's time fire causing trouble), many same moves, yet the games still sell amazingly well and move hardware.

If you (as in anyone) spend most of your time on Ninty forums or around Ninty fans expressing their excitement over Zelda, you get the impression that the wrold can't wait for the new Zelda game. The reality may be a bit different, i.e. the hardcore fans being very local and the masses being indifferent to the game.

PS3 did like shit. The worldwide sales of PS3 was pretty equal to PS2 in Japan. 360 did even worse. The hardware had constant revamps to cheaper models while cutting the price and taking losses as much as you can handle. SCE didn't go belly-up for fun.

Even if it is stale, Pokemon keeps exploring the Pokemon content deeper and it expands the Pokemon universe every new generation, so it's actually doing much better than NSMB.

That's true about Zelda. It is praised to heavens by Zelda fans, but nobody else seem to like the games anymore than the handful of people in the internet. Let's face it: the last four main Zelda games (non-remakes) have been pretty much shit. I bought Skyward Sword thinking it would return back to oldschool Zelda after Aonuma hinted it would, but the hell it didn't; it was the even worse than Twilight Princess that had you play tutorial for half of the game. Hyrule Warriors is a much better game, there you actually can kill enemies. Lots of them.

 

actually the pS3 was doing better at that price than Wii U was doing at its initial price



bdbdbd on 12 January 2016
oniyide said:
bdbdbd said:

PS3 did like shit. The worldwide sales of PS3 was pretty equal to PS2 in Japan. 360 did even worse. The hardware had constant revamps to cheaper models while cutting the price and taking losses as much as you can handle. SCE didn't go belly-up for fun.

Even if it is stale, Pokemon keeps exploring the Pokemon content deeper and it expands the Pokemon universe every new generation, so it's actually doing much better than NSMB.

That's true about Zelda. It is praised to heavens by Zelda fans, but nobody else seem to like the games anymore than the handful of people in the internet. Let's face it: the last four main Zelda games (non-remakes) have been pretty much shit. I bought Skyward Sword thinking it would return back to oldschool Zelda after Aonuma hinted it would, but the hell it didn't; it was the even worse than Twilight Princess that had you play tutorial for half of the game. Hyrule Warriors is a much better game, there you actually can kill enemies. Lots of them.

 

actually the pS3 was doing better at that price than Wii U was doing at its initial price

I know. Wii U is doing/have done so bad it's beyond belief.





Ei Kiinasti.

Eikä Japanisti.

Vaan pannaan jalalla koreasti.

 

Nintendo games sell only on Nintendo system.

curl-6 on 12 January 2016
naruball said:
If NX fails, we can blame marketing. And then we should hype the next Ninty console.

If NX fails, there won't be a next Ninty console.



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naruball on 12 January 2016
curl-6 said:
naruball said:
If NX fails, we can blame marketing. And then we should hype the next Ninty console.

If NX fails, there won't be a next Ninty console.

Think outside the box, Curl. Even if Ninty has no plans to release a console after NX, we can create threads speculating what it will be and how well it will do if it changes this or that. This can be marketing. That can be the price. We can have countless threads titled "My NS(omething) theory". I'm hyped already. 





naruball on 12 January 2016
RolStoppable said:

Isn't the following the proper answer?

If NX succeeds, we can blame a gimmick and call it an anomaly.

Excellent point as usual, Rol. You really have a knack for analysing data.





curl-6 on 12 January 2016
RolStoppable said:

Isn't the following the proper answer?

If NX succeeds, we can blame a gimmick and call it an anomaly.

Pretty much.

"NX was a fluke."

"NX only sold because of x reason, which means it doesn't count."

The fact that it's 2016 and revisionists are still trying to pretend the Wii didn't beat the PS3 and 360 is telling.



foxtail on 12 January 2016
bdbdbd said:
Kai_Mao said:
Chazore said:

Then what would you call above Wii U numbers but nowhere near X1/PS4 numbers?, again that feels like a big rock and a hard place scenario and still sounds like it's bad either way. I mean just say they did better or slightly better than WIi U numbers, how long will it take before we have the same discussions where Nintendo might go 3rd party or might be doomed because either way we're forcing this on Nintendo for simply not toppling the other two and now we have their own current system thrown into the mix. I strongly feel that from all this there is simply no winning for Nintendo at all because even if they had slightly better numbers than Wii U we'll still find some area to complain about how bad it is that they are doing even despite them not doing Wii U numbers, damned if they are and damned if they don't. We talked about their catch 22 situation a year and a half ago and I feel we'll be right back to talking about that with the NX in terms of sales and support.

This.

It's like as if NX will be Nintendo's last chance at home console making. Sure they're not profiting like in the Wii/DS days, but they haven't lost as much as we make them out to be. What if NX sells only 20 million but gains a profit? Or a $200 million loss per year? As mentioned, we could all be senior citizens by the time Nintendo is in any position to file bankruptcy if they lose about $250 million per year starting at 2012. As of now, we don't know how much they'll spend on NX in terms of hardware.

They don't necessarily have to win 1st, but to earn profit. I mean, they did it throughout almost all of their 30+ years in the game industry with exception of 2-4 years, which says a lot considering they've been in third place for home consoles for 3 of the last 4 generations. Now with all their newest ventures outside of traditional gaming, who knows where this will go.

 

Look guys, you can live in a fantasy land all you want, but in the real world there are people called shareholders, who own the company and who's money Nintendo is spending. If Nintendo is unable to pay dividents and shareholders are unhappy, it's game over for Kimishima and someone else replaces him (and does what it needs to in order to retain high profitability). One of the biggest reasons for NX was not only the platform to save costs, but also the continuation of profits. I think Yamauchi accepted the ups and downs of new hardware release as being a part of the business, but the new shareholders may want a continuation, and a platform for multiple devices for the foreseeable future provides just that.

Sony was unable to pay dividends in FY 2014 for the first time in 50 years and it wasn't game over for Kazuo Hirai.  

Besides, the majority of Nintendo shares are held by large banks who are not as fickle as the individual investors who are looking short term.  Nintendo has been a publicly listed company since 1962, and that's more than a decade before Microsoft existed.  Nintendo was also founded over a 126 years ago in 1889 as a card manufacturing company and has had to reinvent themselves many times over the years but has always found success in entertainment and games.  They also just recently moved into a new building and have merged their hardware and software divisions for better efficiency and productivity.  Nintendo knows there is a lot of strength in their IPs and creativity and and won't give up on those things anytime soon.  Nintendo wants profits too and hardware is still part of that equation.

New Nintendo Divisions Below:

  Establishment of the Entertainment Planning & Development Division
We will integrate personnel who are involved in the development of software for Nintendo platforms and smart devices in addition to work associated with effective utilization of character IP, and in order to create a structure that operates efficiently and rapidly, the Entertainment Analysis & Development Division and the Software Planning & Development Division will be consolidated into the newly established Entertainment Planning & Development Division.
  Establishment of the Platform Technology Development Division
We will integrate personnel responsible for the technology development essential for Nintendo’s hardware formation such as hardware, OS, development environment and network, and in order to create a structure in which we can more broadly and efficiently conduct technology development necessary for new products and services, the Integrated Research & Development Division and the System Development Division will be consolidated into the newly established Platform Technology Development Division.
  Establishment of the Business Development Division
We will newly establish the Business Development Division, a division with the aim of refining the business model for the dedicated video game system business, and creating and making profitable the smart device business and the new business that utilizes character IP.


naruball on 12 January 2016
RolStoppable said:

Indeed I have. That's why curl sided with me instead of playing along with you.

Yup. That is the only plausibe reason.