The reason the WiiU doesn't get third party support is because it's hardware is too different from the other consoles and PC as well. It's got nothing to do with Nintendo "not treating 3rd parties with respect", whatever that means.
zorg1000 said:
I know u were talking about people who have bought multiple version of 3DS but then again what makes u think Nintendo won't release multiple versions of NX handhelds? We will still get revisions and plenty of special editions. MK7+8 shipments are a little over 16 million right now and both are still selling. MK7 released in 2011 yet still shipped 1.8 million so far this fiscal year. When all is said and done it could be 20 million for MK7+8, in which case 16-17 million wouldn't be unlikely if they were a single title on both platforms. Look at it this way, let's assume that each Mario Kart unit is sold at full price Mario Kart 7-$40×13,000,000 units=$520,000,000 revenue Mario Kart 8-$60×7,000,000 units=$420,000,000 revenue Mario Kart 7+8=$940,000,000 revenue+MK8 DLC=roughly $1 billion revenue Mario Kart NX-$60×15,000,000 units=900,000,000 revenue+DLC=roughly $1 billion revenue See how they can still make the same amount of money by selling 5 million less units and are likely making more profit by developing and advertising one game instead of 2 seperate games while still able to go ahead and make a new game 2-3 years later? |
I think you're bringing up VERY interesting point, although you don't adress it at all; what price point will the NX games have?! If they are part portible and part stationary... What price should they have? Will Nintendo sell certain games at $60 and optimize them for the home console and others for $40 optimize for portability?
Try that calculation but have MK NX at $40: 15m x 40 = 600,000,000 + 100,000,000 in DLC.... in this case they're making 30% less...
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DanneSandin said:
Maybe they are, but they're there none the less. So far I've pointed out two of them. Not sure if there are more actually ^^ Let's compare CoD3 and CoD:WAW; CoD3 came out in 2006 and did 2.23m and WAW came out in 2008 (two years and a lot of Wii's later) and sold 1.93m. Instead of the franchise GROWING with the Wii it's actually shrinking... 2m copies of a game is not bad at all, but "mature" 3rd party games sold a lot better on the HD twins, making these numbers SEEM bad. And let's remember that many of these games had to be build from the grounds up for the Wii since they simply couldn't port over the HD versions. That's time, money and energy coupled with the FACT that the Wii verisons never sold as well as on the HD twins. And as I already proved (and which you chose to ignore in this reply), it wasn't the QUALITY of these 3rd party efforts that hindered them from selling on the Wii. Just to make this evem more clear: Star Wars: The Force Unleashed is the 5th best selling "Mature" 3rd party game on Wii (not counting Sonic: Unleashed) and sold 1.84m with a Metscore of 71. The game sold less than on either the PS3 or X360, even though Wii had a bigger instal base. Now compare that to Red Steel 2 that was released afterwards, with a higher metascore and instal base, but still only managed to sell 600k. This paint a pretty clear picture that "mature" (3rd party) games didn't really find a good hold on the Wii, and that situation only got worse as the year went by and more and more Wii's got sold. So let's hear these "BS reasons" 3rd parties have for not supporting Nintendo consoles. |
modern warfare 3 skipped wii, wich caused a decline, but the games still sold a lot. you should also remember that cod on wii was inferior in technical aspects, even though it controlled better than ps360 versions. I keep my word that it sold greatly and nintendo fans simply didn't keep buying it year after year (because that's not a logical thing when the product is basically the same).
third parties had nothing to complain about their software sales on wii, at least not any more than they could complain on other consoles.
| Barkley said: The reason the WiiU doesn't get third party support is because it's hardware is too different from the other consoles and PC as well. It's got nothing to do with Nintendo "not treating 3rd parties with respect", whatever that means. |
The hardware isn't "too different", it's just another myth. all 3 are gpu focused machines that share the same modern dev tools.
| Barkley said: The reason the WiiU doesn't get third party support is because it's hardware is too different from the other consoles and PC as well. It's got nothing to do with Nintendo "not treating 3rd parties with respect", whatever that means. |
I'd argue that it is not as black or white as that. The cost of porting may not be covered by the abysmal sales, sure, but Nintendo's relationship with 3rd party developers is a very big part of this. Miyamoto gave many 3rd party developers an ultimatum: develop for the WiiU alone or not at all. Nintendo has a very holier-than-thou attitude when it comes to 3rd party developers.
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Materia-Blade said:
"Let Nintendo treat the 3rd parties with respect and see what happens." I've seen what happens: gamecube, wii and wii u support. the handhelds only got support because nintendo had near monopoly in the area. |
They did NOT treat 3rd parties with respect during GC era!
At GDC 2000, most software houses were already well into production with PlayStation 2 and Xbox titles, but very few developers had signed up to create games for Nintendo’s Dolphin. According to various sites, Dolphin was the butt of jokes at GDC, and one major respected developer told IGN, “We’ll develop for Dolphin in five years when Nintendo finally releases some information on it”. Another developer said, “Nintendo is making the same old mistakes, it’s not giving us any incentive to bother with Dolphin”.
At the same event, Bill Gates called for mass developer support to drive the Xbox, and Microsoft was aggressively pursuing third party developers by delivering development kits to as many studios as possible. Technical director Jim Merrick admitted to IGN that it did not yet have a formal development program in place. He suggested that potential Dolphin developers could prepare for Nintendo’s future system by creating prototypes of their games on the highest performance PC that can be configured
In the December 2000 issue of Next Gen Magazine, approximately 7 months after GDC, Hiroshi Imanishi said they are not approaching third parties to make games for GameCube. Instead, they expect third parties to come to them once the GameCube starts growing their install base.
CNN reported that Nintendo was charging a much higher licensing fee for GameCube ($11) while Microsoft and Sony charged ($7 – $9). This fell in line with a report from IGN that Microsoft was charging $8 (and possibly lower) licensing fee standard. One major publisher admitted to IGN that Microsoft had been very accommodating when it comes to fees.
Technical director Jim Merrick said, “We are now and will be in a shortage condition for development kits for a long time to come. But going to low-cost disc-based media is breaking down some of the economic barriers that publishers felt toward the cartridge-based business. So we have a lot of interest. And we’re not going to be able to satisfy the demand for development kits. In fact, probably six months after the Gamecube launches we’ll still be in a shortage of development kits. We just can’t produce them fast enough.”
Read these quotes from this article: http://www.dromble.com/2014/01/07/dolphin-tale-story-of-gamecube/
Does that sound like Nintendo treated developers with RESPECT?! NO! Nintendo have always treated 3rd parties with a certain amount of... disdain.
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zorg1000 said:
Nintendo doesn't care if the same people buy multiple versions of their hardware, they just care that the hardware is selling. How many Wii U owners have a 3DS, 100%? 50%? 25%? Who knows, but at the same time, as long as each device isn't overpriced and have some exclusive features than Nintendo can probably get their dedicated fans to buy both a handheld and console. Nintendo doesn't really have a problem selling software, here are some reasonable estimates for their big franchises this generation. Mario Kart-20 million (MK7-13m, MK8-7m) Pokémon X/Y-15 million, Pokemon OR/AS-10+ million 2D Mario-17 million (NSMB2-11m, NSMBU-6m) 3D Mario-17 million (3D Land-12m, 3D World-5m) Smash Bros-15 million (3DS-9m, Wii U-6m) Obviously since there is an overlap between 3DS & Wii U owners, the total amount isn't necessarily how much a single title would sell if on both devices, so Mario Kart NX might sell 16-17 million instead of 20m but that can be cancelled out by the reduction in development costs by not having to make 2 seperate games and by having a large userbase to sell DLC to. Then u have to consider certain games would have an increase of on both. Tropical Freeze, for example is just over 1 million and might leg it out to 1.5-2m, if it had the 3DS userbase to sell to as well than it would likely be a 5 million seller. Animal Crossing on 3DS is like 8.5 million and Luigi's Mansion about 4 million, if they were also on Wii U than they would be 10 million and 5 million sellers by now. |
You are underestimating mario kart 8 sales and overestimating what a single mario kart would sell on the imaginary NX. And what game could they develop with the extra time that is capable of filling that multimillion gap?
Materia-Blade said:
The hardware isn't "too different", it's just another myth. all 3 are gpu focused machines that share the same modern dev tools. |
No it IS too different. WiiU does not have an x86 architecture cpu. XBO, PS4 and PC do. XBO and PS4 both have 8gb of ram while WiiU has 2gb of ram. XBO and PS4 both have very similair gpu's, the PS4's being a bit more powerful. GPU TFLOPS: PS4: 1.84, XBO:1.31, WiiU: 0.352
The difference between the WiiU and XBO/PS4 compared to the difference between the PS4 and XBO is a lot and the greater the difference the more work is required to port a game between systems. If developers want to develop next-gen title it will be with 8gb of ram in mind, downgrading these titles so they can run with only 2gb of ram would require a lot of effort, the other alternative would be holding games back and developing them with 2gb of ram in mind.
WiiU is too different and would require changes when games are developed with the other next-gen systems in mind.
If all you have to say about them not being too different is that they are "gpu focused machines" I don't think this is the discussion for you.
ReimTime said:
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Link?
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Materia-Blade said:
modern warfare 3 skipped wii, wich caused a decline, but the games still sold a lot. you should also remember that cod on wii was inferior in technical aspects, even though it controlled better than ps360 versions. I keep my word that it sold greatly and nintendo fans simply didn't keep buying it year after year (because that's not a logical thing when the product is basically the same). third parties had nothing to complain about their software sales on wii, at least not any more than they could complain on other consoles. |
Why don't you go a head and adress the other 3rd party games I mentioned then? How could Ubisoft be happy with Red Steel 2 selling 600k? Or No More Heroes? Truth is, mature 3rd party games on Wii didn't do all that well, especially if you compare it with how well they did on PS360
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