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Forums - Microsoft Discussion - Is the Xbox One a failure?

 

Is XB1 a failure?

Yes! 615 40.51%
 
No! 711 46.84%
 
Gimme dem numbers! 68 4.48%
 
I pity Wii U :( 121 7.97%
 
Total:1,515
DanneSandin said:
IFireflyl said:
DanneSandin said:

But what constitutes a success/failure then? Should it not be about the profits the company made? Or do we disregard those and focus solely on the sales?

 

Success: the accomplishment of an aim or purpose; the attainment of popularity or profit

Failure: lack of success; the omission of expected or required action

By these definitions the Xbox One is not a failure. A failure is a lack of success. The Xbox One has experienced much success, just not what the PS4 experienced.

Read this article.

Well, it would seem as if it has attained popularity, even increasing it. But I don't know how profitable it is. So, why are so many people voting "Yes" in the poll?


Because people are biased. I am not saying this to be insulting. The facts support that the console is not failing. Anyone who says otherwise is saying so because they are biased, or because they are misinformed/using outdated information.

@jennryan3190: That is eactly why I voted No. I actually own an Xbox One, but I think it's a horrible console (for me personally anyway).



 

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IFireflyl said:

Those thread examples you gave were all opinion based threads. The success or failure of the Xbox One is not opinion. There are actual facts that prove that it is, or is not, a success/failure. 

For someone who likes to preach about "the facts" you seem to ignore them.  Almost everything revolving the Xbox One has been a failure from a business perspective.  Those are the facts.  I don't usually quote myself but since you’re a fact man, I want you to be able to see the facts.

Original Policy: Failed (reversed)
Original Pricing: Failed
Free games bundled at original price: Failed
Kinect-less model achieving price parity: Failed
Maintain or Gain Market Share US/UK: Failed
Gain Market Share outside of US/UK: Failed
Xbox Entertainment: Failed
Maximize Xbox Live profits: Failed (forced to give free games eating into profits to compete)
Ability to keep apps behind paywall to maximize subscribers: Failed (Force to compete)
Hardware designs from a performance perspective: Failed (PS4 is more powerful)
Hardware designs from a financial perspective: Failed (While it was true before the release. The cost of DDR3 has constantly gone up, and is going up to the point where Microsoft is rumored to have some major R&D design changes to DDR4, which is costly) 

If you’re going to preach about the facts, than you shouldn't be reading a fantasy articles on fool.com.  There is no way investors are cheering about how much money the Xbox One is bleeding, especially after being assured they would be profitable from day one unlike previous consoles.  That is a fantasy.  That is why investors want to spin off or sell the Xbox division. The Xbox One has been nothing but constant steps back from where they were the previous generation.



IFireflyl said:


Because people are biased. I am not saying this to be insulting. The facts support that the console is not failing. Anyone who says otherwise is saying so because they are biased, or because they are misinformed/using outdated information.

 

But why then, don't we see as much bias in the PS3 or 3DS threads? Should that show up as well? It's not quite 50/50 in this thread between yes and no, but it's a hell of a lot closer than in the other two threads.



I'm on Twitter @DanneSandin!

Furthermore, I think VGChartz should add a "Like"-button.

XBox One launch was a failure. The console itself it not a failure.



Failure is a question of expectations, which in turn is a tricky question due to the change of leadership at Microsoft. Ballmer clearly had more passion for Xbox than Nadella, but i think that, originally conceived, the X1 was designed to be the center of a Microsoft multimedia push that has since come undone for reasons partially related to the X1 (the resounding rejection of Microsoft's original DRM scheme, which was a critical part of their larger strategy and why they invested so much PR capital in trying to defend it before surrendering), and since come undone partly due to the regime transition which casts a weather eye on all of the side businesses.

Short story, under Nadella, i think victory over the competitors has become the success condition. They need to win, or Microsoft will quit, because even if it is profitable, the money spent on Xbox could be better spent elsewhere in more relevant sectors.

Or, if Nadella simply doesn't give a fuck about the Xbox division (meaning he'll leave it alone as long as it's bringing in money, but not put focus on it as part of the corporate strategy) than mere profitability could be the success condition: as long as the X1 as a whole turns a handy profit, then it's a success.

So it all depends on the win condition, as it were, which is very hard to tell.

Wii U is the only clear failure amongst the consoles, but Nintendo's kind of behind the 8-ball on that. Coming off of a winning generation, you need another win of equal or greater magnitude or you're a failure by default. Not that Wii U's struggles have not been quite a spectacle...



Monster Hunter: pissing me off since 2010.

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Microsoft themselves said the OG Xbox was a Failure because it failed to turn profit... Then Microsoft turned profit from the X360 so they labeled it a success... Microsoft is still throwing away money selling X1s so cheap... I know they are making it up a bit from Xbox Live and it's X360 users but still... I know if they are breaking even, assuming every new X1 and X360 owner purchases Xbox Live... So by Microsoft's past history perspective the X1 is currently failing.

Tell you the truth I think they are purposely throwing money away for a chance to further dent Nintendo down (since losing millions is like losing pocket change in a sofa to them). Nintendo is vulnerable at the moment, and they feel any loss more than Microsoft would (X1 price cut really chopped Wii U's little legs they had left). Business wise I feel Microsoft is a giant hand thats shoving Nintendo's face down a toliet desperately trying to drown it, so it can be reborn again and create games for them (HAHAHA!)!



Mr Khan said:
Failure is a question of expectations, which in turn is a tricky question due to the change of leadership at Microsoft. Ballmer clearly had more passion for Xbox than Nadella, but i think that, originally conceived, the X1 was designed to be the center of a Microsoft multimedia push that has since come undone for reasons partially related to the X1 (the resounding rejection of Microsoft's original DRM scheme, which was a critical part of their larger strategy and why they invested so much PR capital in trying to defend it before surrendering), and since come undone partly due to the regime transition which casts a weather eye on all of the side businesses.

Short story, under Nadella, i think victory over the competitors has become the success condition. They need to win, or Microsoft will quit, because even if it is profitable, the money spent on Xbox could be better spent elsewhere in more relevant sectors.

Or, if Nadella simply doesn't give a fuck about the Xbox division (meaning he'll leave it alone as long as it's bringing in money, but not put focus on it as part of the corporate strategy) than mere profitability could be the success condition: as long as the X1 as a whole turns a handy profit, then it's a success.

So it all depends on the win condition, as it were, which is very hard to tell.

Wii U is the only clear failure amongst the consoles, but Nintendo's kind of behind the 8-ball on that. Coming off of a winning generation, you need another win of equal or greater magnitude or you're a failure by default. Not that Wii U's struggles have not been quite a spectacle...

Very well thought out post!



I'm on Twitter @DanneSandin!

Furthermore, I think VGChartz should add a "Like"-button.

Protendo said:
IFireflyl said:

Those thread examples you gave were all opinion based threads. The success or failure of the Xbox One is not opinion. There are actual facts that prove that it is, or is not, a success/failure. 

For someone who likes to preach about "the facts" you seem to ignore them.  Almost everything revolving the Xbox One has been a failure from a business perspective.  Those are the facts.  I don't usually quote myself but since you’re a fact man, I want you to be able to see the facts.

Original Policy: Failed (reversed)
Original Pricing: Failed
Free games bundled at original price: Failed
Kinect-less model achieving price parity: Failed
Maintain or Gain Market Share US/UK: Failed
Gain Market Share outside of US/UK: Failed
Xbox Entertainment: Failed
Maximize Xbox Live profits: Failed (forced to give free games eating into profits to compete)
Ability to keep apps behind paywall to maximize subscribers: Failed (Force to compete)
Hardware designs from a performance perspective: Failed (PS4 is more powerful)
Hardware designs from a financial perspective: Failed (While it was true before the release. The cost of DDR3 has constantly gone up, and is going up to the point where Microsoft is rumored to have some major R&D design changes to DDR4, which is costly) 

If you’re going to preach about the facts, than you shouldn't be reading a fantasy articles on fool.com.  There is no way investors are cheering about how much money the Xbox One is bleeding, especially after being assured they would be profitable from day one unlike previous consoles.  That is a fantasy.  That is why investors want to spin off or sell the Xbox division. The Xbox One has been nothing but constant steps back from where they were the previous generation.


Here is the empirical evidence (my number of consoles sold is rounded down, not up):

The Xbox 360 sold 7,984,000 consoles from November 2005 through December 2006.

The Xbox One sold 10,750,000 consoles from November 2013 through December 2014.

The Xbox 360 cost approximately $470 to make when it first came out. The Xbox One costs about $470 to make with the Kinect, and about $395 to make without the Kinect.

The Xbox 360 launched with a $400 prices tag. The Xbox One launched with a $500 price tag. The price tag on the Xbox One dropped to $400 in June of 2014. It dropped to $350 in November of 2014.

From November 2013 (launch) through May 2014 (the last month before the Kinect was removed) the Xbox one sold 4,419,000 consoles. Based on the cost to make the console, and the number sold, Microsoft made $132,570,000 in profit. Then June through October, let's assume every console sold was a non-Kinect. Approximately $395 to make with a $400 price tag, so lets just say Microsoft did not make or lose money in this time. They sold 6,583,000 consoles during this period. Then we look at November and December of 2014. They lowered the cost to $350. They sold 4,167,000 consoles for a loss of $187,515,000. So they gained $132,570,000 before the first price cut and Kinect removal, and then they lost $187,515,000 after that. So a total loss of $54,945,000

From November 2005 (launch) through December 2006 the Xbox 360 did not have any price cuts. It lost $70 per console sold, and it sold 7,984,000 consoles. This is a total loss of $558,880,000.

The Xbox 360 is a success. This is a fact. The Xbox One has lost almost $55 million through the first full year after its launch. The Xbox 360 lost almost $559 million in that same window after its launch. The Xbox One sold more consoles through the first full year after its launch, and it lost less money. There is no way anyone can say that this is not a success.

Facts.



 

DanneSandin said:



XB1 is constantly outselling its predecessor, the X360, but can't compete with PS4. Does that mean it's a success or a failure?


I take offence with this statement, in the end it sold more than its predecessor, but until October all reasonable expectations was that both console's first year would be more or less equal... now after price drops and a few bundles + in store gift cards people bought in the XB1, which is something the XB360 did not have to do as far as I remember.

http://www.vgchartz.com/article/252864/xbox-one-vs-xbox-360vgchartz-gap-chartsdecember-2014-update/

Now for the current situation, it depends what Sony does in the next few months, if they lower the price of the PS4 and by how much, if their exclusives meet their respective hype levels... etc. obviously MS won't be sitting on their hands either, but given that Sony is the market leader, this is their thurf and they will basically decide how relevant the MS console is, depending how agressive they are.... This or Nintendo could surprise everyone with a new console that has decent specs and good arrangements for the thirdparty devs, this could be disruptive for everyone.



IFireflyl said:
Protendo said:
IFireflyl said:

Those thread examples you gave were all opinion based threads. The success or failure of the Xbox One is not opinion. There are actual facts that prove that it is, or is not, a success/failure. 

For someone who likes to preach about "the facts" you seem to ignore them.  Almost everything revolving the Xbox One has been a failure from a business perspective.  Those are the facts.  I don't usually quote myself but since you’re a fact man, I want you to be able to see the facts.

Original Policy: Failed (reversed)
Original Pricing: Failed
Free games bundled at original price: Failed
Kinect-less model achieving price parity: Failed
Maintain or Gain Market Share US/UK: Failed
Gain Market Share outside of US/UK: Failed
Xbox Entertainment: Failed
Maximize Xbox Live profits: Failed (forced to give free games eating into profits to compete)
Ability to keep apps behind paywall to maximize subscribers: Failed (Force to compete)
Hardware designs from a performance perspective: Failed (PS4 is more powerful)
Hardware designs from a financial perspective: Failed (While it was true before the release. The cost of DDR3 has constantly gone up, and is going up to the point where Microsoft is rumored to have some major R&D design changes to DDR4, which is costly) 

If you’re going to preach about the facts, than you shouldn't be reading a fantasy articles on fool.com.  There is no way investors are cheering about how much money the Xbox One is bleeding, especially after being assured they would be profitable from day one unlike previous consoles.  That is a fantasy.  That is why investors want to spin off or sell the Xbox division. The Xbox One has been nothing but constant steps back from where they were the previous generation.


Here is the empirical evidence (my number of consoles sold is rounded down, not up):

The Xbox 360 sold 7,984,000 consoles from November 2005 through December 2006.

The Xbox One sold 10,750,000 consoles from November 2013 through December 2014.

The Xbox 360 cost approximately $470 to make when it first came out. The Xbox One costs about $470 to make with the Kinect, and about $395 to make without the Kinect.

The Xbox 360 launched with a $400 prices tag. The Xbox One launched with a $500 price tag. The price tag on the Xbox One dropped to $400 in June of 2014. It dropped to $350 in November of 2014.

From November 2013 (launch) through May 2014 (the last month before the Kinect was removed) the Xbox one sold 4,419,000 consoles. Based on the cost to make the console, and the number sold, Microsoft made $132,570,000 in profit. Then June through October, let's assume every console sold was a non-Kinect. Approximately $395 to make with a $400 price tag, so lets just say Microsoft did not make or lose money in this time. They sold 6,583,000 consoles during this period. Then we look at November and December of 2014. They lowered the cost to $350. They sold 4,167,000 consoles for a loss of $187,515,000. So they gained $132,570,000 before the first price cut and Kinect removal, and then they lost $187,515,000 after that. So a total loss of $54,945,000

From November 2005 (launch) through December 2006 the Xbox 360 did not have any price cuts. It lost $70 per console sold, and it sold 7,984,000 consoles. This is a total loss of $558,880,000.

The Xbox 360 is a success. This is a fact. The Xbox One has lost almost $55 million through the first full year after its launch. The Xbox 360 lost almost $559 million in that same window after its launch. The Xbox One sold more consoles through the first full year after its launch, and it lost less money. There is no way anyone can say that this is not a success.

Facts.

The Xbox 360 suffered from heavy supply constraints.  The Xbox One has an abudant supply.  The Xbox One has been selling less if you subtract the launch week from both consoles, meaning the Xbox One is selling lower now to a still supply constraint Xbox 360.

The Xbox One had to be 350 with 50 gift card and 3 free games to beet the PS4.  The PS4 had a deal part of that time which just included 2 games.  The current pricing stradegy are signs of an unhealth product, and wouldn't be implemented for a healthy product.  

That being said, the Xbox One is a great console to own from a gamers perspective.  Just because it's failing on it's own merits does not make it a flop.  PSV is a flop.  That being said even flops can manage to be great consoles to own as a gamer.