By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Gaming Discussion - What lessons did Nintendo learn this gen you think?

Low end hardware is not good.

Trying to fool your customers believing the console will sell a lot all over again only because it has Wii on it's name is not good.

Strange controllers like the gamepad aren't good.



Around the Network
zorg1000 said:
Soundwave said:

I don't think so. I think their main problem is that their two bread and butter audiences outside of their core fanbase -- kids and casuals are being taken away from Nintendo in droves by Apple/Android devices. 

A traditional game handheld will probably never sell 80+ million any more, who knows 3DS might very well be the last one that can even breach the 70 million barrier. 

Doesn't matter how cheap the device is, when people already have another device in their pocket that basically scratches their portable gaming itch already (on top of doing 100 other things), the need for a dedicated portable kinda flies out the window. That and the whole $1/free games vs. $40 games kinda seals the deal. 

The GBA really would've sold like 100+ million too had it not been cut short, but its yearly shipments prior to the DS releasing were more on pace for a system that finishes in the 100 million range. The amount of systems they were selling yearly in the GBA + GCN era is likely something they simply can't replicate in the modern market (forget Wii/DS obviously). 

U honestly don't believe that 3DS/Wii U could have sold modestly better in the same time frame if they launched at $100 cheaper each and had more/better advertising?

By the end of this fiscal year, 3DS will be at roughly 52 million shipped with Wii U roughly around 10 million. In the same time frame, GBA was around 65 million and GC around 15 million. So it's 62 million vs 80 million, maybe they wouldn't have matched GBA/GC but if 3DS/Wii U launched at lower price points with increased advertising efforts than it may be more like 70 million at this point.


Well the 3DS did get a pretty massive price cut early on. 

With the Wii U, I think people simply don't want one. It's not all that complicated. Nintendo's concept of a family friendly console primarily driven by their sugary sweet mascots without the third party support just doesn't resonate even with kids anymore. And they lost the entire casual/fad Wii crowd to Apple so that became a dead end for them. Just like people wouldn't buy a GameCube even at $99.99. 

Nintendo has an audience problem moreso than a price problem in other words. 



RolStoppable said:
curl-6 said:

Unfortunately, I fear they will learn little.

1. They'll still use withered technology.

2. They'll still refuse to listen to the demands of the Western market.

3. They'll still fail to tap into the crucial dudebro demographic.

As a result, they still won't sell all that great. I'd love to be wrong, but I'm convinced they are too deep in denial to get with the program.

1. Don't you realize that the vast majority of Nintendo's losses this generation came from not doing that? Neither the 3DS or Wii U were designed with that mindset, hence why both have excessively expensive components that have significantly impacted Nintendo's bottom line.

2. Yes, it looks like they won't go third party.

3. This would only be a negative thing if they tried to do it again, because trying it would negatively impact their systems' designs and therefore drastically lower their sales potential.

What we already know that Nintendo has learned is that they can't trust third parties, hence why they are going to prioritize an increase in output of first party software. When third parties complained that Nintendo software is too dominant, Nintendo tried to give more focus to third party software. The result was that their hardware didn't sell and subsequently third party software didn't sell, making the situation worse than it ever was before. Nintendo was left with struggling systems while third parties simply abandoned the ship and didn't look back. The nutcase approach to solve Nintendo's problems would be to reach out to third parties and listen to their demands, but thankfully it doesn't look like Nintendo is going to do that. Instead they are going to put things in place to grow their installed base as quickly and consistently as possible which subsequently will attract third parties because sales are really the only language that's going to matter. You don't get anywhere by appealing to goodwill, and paying off third parties is not a healthy and sustainable approach in the long term.

1. And yet Sony was able to make PS4 relatively up-to-date power wise without breaking the bank. Heck, even Nintendo has done so in the past with SNES, N64, GCN.

2. They might be left with no choice eventually, if they keep letting their userbase decline.

3. The dudebro demographic are the lifeblood of today's console market, as seen in PS4's explosive sales. If you don't sell to them, your sales will be limited.



1. Don't assume non-gamers who bought into a fad will buy your next console offering that has de-emphasised the fad they bought into.
2. Don't rely on an already popular existing tech (touchscreen tablet) as the next fad / gimmick item that increases the price of the console as the main hardware selling point of your console.
3. Don't be more on par spec -wise with lastgen Sony/MS consoles than with predicted the spec ballpark for nextgen Sony/MS. That will only work if you have a super-popular gimmick like Wiimote.
4. Your 1st party library will only sell so many consoles. You actually do need the major 3rd party franchises to be on board, and your version of those franchises needs to be up to spec with the MS/Sony versions.
5. You can't rely on primarily recycling old franchises. You need to create a whole new franchise that gets people as excited as Mario or Mario or Pokemon or Mario



“The fundamental cause of the trouble is that in the modern world the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt.” - Bertrand Russell

"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, the world will know peace."

Jimi Hendrix

 

curl-6 said:
RolStoppable said:

1. Don't you realize that the vast majority of Nintendo's losses this generation came from not doing that? Neither the 3DS or Wii U were designed with that mindset, hence why both have excessively expensive components that have significantly impacted Nintendo's bottom line.

2. Yes, it looks like they won't go third party.

3. This would only be a negative thing if they tried to do it again, because trying it would negatively impact their systems' designs and therefore drastically lower their sales potential.

What we already know that Nintendo has learned is that they can't trust third parties, hence why they are going to prioritize an increase in output of first party software. When third parties complained that Nintendo software is too dominant, Nintendo tried to give more focus to third party software. The result was that their hardware didn't sell and subsequently third party software didn't sell, making the situation worse than it ever was before. Nintendo was left with struggling systems while third parties simply abandoned the ship and didn't look back. The nutcase approach to solve Nintendo's problems would be to reach out to third parties and listen to their demands, but thankfully it doesn't look like Nintendo is going to do that. Instead they are going to put things in place to grow their installed base as quickly and consistently as possible which subsequently will attract third parties because sales are really the only language that's going to matter. You don't get anywhere by appealing to goodwill, and paying off third parties is not a healthy and sustainable approach in the long term.

1. And yet Sony was able to make PS4 relatively up-to-date power wise without breaking the bank. Heck, even Nintendo has done so in the past with SNES, N64, GCN.

2. They might be left with no choice eventually, if they keep letting their userbase decline.

3. The dudebro demographic are the lifeblood of today's console market, as seen in PS4's explosive sales. If you don't sell to them, your sales will be limited.


Unfortunately yeah I think this is the truth. 

The console market is a very different place today than it was say in the 90s. It's almost 100% dominated by Western consumers and devs. 



Around the Network
RolStoppable said:
curl-6 said:

1. And yet Sony was able to make PS4 relatively up-to-date power wise without breaking the bank. Heck, even Nintendo has done so in the past with SNES, N64, GCN.

2. They might be left with no choice eventually, if they keep letting their userbase decline.

3. The dudebro demographic are the lifeblood of today's console market, as seen in PS4's explosive sales. If you don't sell to them, your sales will be limited.

1. Doesn't change that you've been wrong on that point. Someone can't still do something if they stopped doing said something.

2. How's that even an answer? Have you forgotten what your initial point was?

3. And if you do try to sell to them, there is not necessarily success, as seen in the Xbox One's continued struggles. Now factor in that Nintendo wouldn't just be going up against PlayStation, but also Xbox. Nevermind that the suggestion that dudebros would consider a Nintendo console as a possible option is simply laughable. But leaving that bias against Nintendo aside, people don't switch brands if they are satisfied. Therefore successfully catering to dudebros would require that both Sony and Microsoft mess up really badly. Any strategy that relies on someone else's failures to work is like playing the lottery because absolutely everything has to go your way.

1. Wii U and 3DS are withered technology.

2. Appealing to a Western audience could save them from  being forced to go third party.

3. Xbox One's sales are fine, much better than Wii U's. Once you remove the dudebros, there isn't enough of an audience left for a home console to do better than Gamecube numbers.



RolStoppable said:
curl-6 said:

1. And yet Sony was able to make PS4 relatively up-to-date power wise without breaking the bank. Heck, even Nintendo has done so in the past with SNES, N64, GCN.

2. They might be left with no choice eventually, if they keep letting their userbase decline.

3. The dudebro demographic are the lifeblood of today's console market, as seen in PS4's explosive sales. If you don't sell to them, your sales will be limited.

1. Doesn't change that you've been wrong on that point. Someone can't still do something if they stopped doing said something.

2. How's that even an answer? Have you forgotten what your initial point was?

3. And if you do try to sell to them, there is not necessarily success, as seen in the Xbox One's continued struggles. Now factor in that Nintendo wouldn't just be going up against PlayStation, but also Xbox. Nevermind that the suggestion that dudebros would consider a Nintendo console as a possible option is simply laughable. But leaving that bias against Nintendo aside, people don't switch brands if they are satisfied. Therefore successfully catering to dudebros would require that both Sony and Microsoft mess up really badly. Any strategy that relies on someone else's failures to work is like playing the lottery because absolutely everything has to go your way.


While I don't think the XBox One is doing terribly, I actually agree with that third point, lol. 

Sony hasn't given Nintendo much to capitalize on, unlike Nintendo they simply don't make a lot of mistakes. The big mistake they've made in 20 years in the business was the $600 PS3 (which really was forced onto them as an effort to push the Blu-Ray movie format). Aside from that on the console front, they've given Nintendo virtually nothing to take advantage of. 

I guess the PS2 was a bit hard to program for, but Sony played the rest of that gen perfectly so much so that they basically won the cycle before Nintendo/MS could even mobilize. So developers had no choice but to develop primarily for the PS2. 

Throw MS into the mix and everything becomes too crowded. If MS wasn't in the industry then Nintendo would have some leeway to work back into the center of the console business, but as it is right now, it's just too hard. It's a tough industry. 



Have big first party games at launch.
Focus on attracting the core Nintendo gamers.
Be ready with your marketing, OS and software.
Don't pick stupid names.
Mix new IPs and old.
Don't hope or expect third parties to bail you out.
Exclusives are what matters. Don't waste time publishing lots of third party ports of old games.
Don't let a new system look slower than last gen.



jmorris724 said:
Locknuts said:
If Nintendo learned anything, they'd be fixing it right now. We're not seeing any signs of it though.


pretty much. ms was smart enough to sell kinect seperately, but ninty's not smart enough to sell the tablet seperately. if not for the giant tablet controller, the thing would be $250 or less and flying off shelves. 

Amazon: Nintendo Skylanders SWAP Force Bundle - Nintendo Wii U    Price:  $249.99 

http://www.amazon.com/Nintendo-Skylanders-SWAP-Force-Bundle-u/dp/B00GD962OA/ref=lp_3075116011_1_4?s=videogames&ie=UTF8&qid=1423531234&sr=1-4

Where is the flying off shelves?



That gimmicks are an unreliable source of success, and that when the gimmick fails you need third party.



dd if = /dev/brain | tail -f | grep games | nc -lnvvp 80

Hey Listen!

https://archive.org/details/kohina_radio_music_collection