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Forums - Gaming - Fans cheer ‘smooth’ Smash Bros. Wii U online experience while Microsoft and Sony games struggle - Anyone finding this to be true?

Mnementh said:
Barkley said:

Well lets be honest here, they're very different experiences. Smash Bros surely doesn't require as much server power as something like DriveClub or MCC.

What? Do you know what you're talking about? There is no need for much server power in most online games, it is about data-transfer between all parties. Not much data is transferred for all of these games. A racer only needs all the info on current position and momentum of cars transferred, a shooter again current position, weaponry and shoots fired, a fighter needs again position and moves executed. That is all not much of data. Everything else is rendered on the client from these data. The server doesn't prerender something or so. More importantly though, for all three genres you need quick reactions, so latency is very important. That doesn't change, despite how much data is transferred. This is key to smooth gameplay. Latency is impacted mainly through the following: network latency (how long takes the data from player A to player B) and netcode latency (how fast can the game decode the data). That seems to be well enough for Smash, if people experience smooth gameplay. I can't judge, Smash isn't out here yet in europe.


Urm yes I know all this. The difference being that Smash is a 4 player multiplayer game, Driveclub and MCC have more players in a match not to mention i'm sure they store all sorts of statistics for every player on the server. Driveclub presumably has a ton of social features.

(Incase you haven't noticed I haven't played any of these three games)

But you're also not entirely correct and are simplifying it a bit far. For example a shooter doesn't just need the position, weapon and where they shoot. It also needs to know what character model/cosmetics they are using. There models animation is synchronized and ofcourse there's killcams aswell so it sends data for where your opponent was looking etc. 

Netcode is a lot more complicated then you've posted there.



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It is not fair to compare, you don't have to pay to play online for WiiU.

Anyway Nintendo deserves respect for it...



Jizz_Beard_thePirate said:

Well... I am not trying to say that it is a technical feat but rather this is how games should launch. Smash Bros online isn't like the zomfg innovative online that every game should follow but out of the Big IPs that did get released this year out of the Big 3, Nintendo games seems to be the only ones that work properly both online and offline for all their games. And it isn't just Smash, when MK8 launched and it sold 1 million + in first week, the online had no issues either apart from some people having really bad internet connections which is of course, an issue with Peer-to-Peer.

And at the end of the day, Yes, FH2 and SO does have solid online features and so do some Sony games, but you are also paying yearly for those features so you expect that kind of service from Microsoft and Sony for every game, specially if its first/second party, yet for MCC and DC, that has been not the case which is ashame.

Once MS and Sony get their things together, MCC and DC will probably provide a much better online experience than SSB or MK8 will but the issue is that in terms of game launches, Nintendo still managed to have all their games work perfectly when it comes to online and they did it for free which is the key thing imo. People shouldnt have to wait 2-4 weeks to be able to experience the full game (specially if you are paying for the online service) and for Nintendo games, they didn't have to!


I see your point, but thats the fault of some game develeopers not Sony or Microsoft. It also doesnt reflect the whole environment. because far more online games work just fine PSN or Live.



I predict that the Wii U will sell a total of 18 million units in its lifetime. 

The NX will be a 900p machine

I'd say the over all numbers using ninty servers compared to Sony and MS is very low. Not surprised this work considering that fact plus it's a fighter.



Something that I love about Nintendo is their dedication to high quality.



I know... my English sucks.

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Barkley said:
Mnementh said:
Barkley said:

Well lets be honest here, they're very different experiences. Smash Bros surely doesn't require as much server power as something like DriveClub or MCC.

What? Do you know what you're talking about? There is no need for much server power in most online games, it is about data-transfer between all parties. Not much data is transferred for all of these games. A racer only needs all the info on current position and momentum of cars transferred, a shooter again current position, weaponry and shoots fired, a fighter needs again position and moves executed. That is all not much of data. Everything else is rendered on the client from these data. The server doesn't prerender something or so. More importantly though, for all three genres you need quick reactions, so latency is very important. That doesn't change, despite how much data is transferred. This is key to smooth gameplay. Latency is impacted mainly through the following: network latency (how long takes the data from player A to player B) and netcode latency (how fast can the game decode the data). That seems to be well enough for Smash, if people experience smooth gameplay. I can't judge, Smash isn't out here yet in europe.


Urm yes I know all this. The difference being that Smash is a 4 player multiplayer game, Driveclub and MCC have more players in a match not to mention i'm sure they store all sorts of statistics for every player on the server. Driveclub presumably has a ton of social features.

(Incase you haven't noticed I haven't played any of these three games)

But you're also not entirely correct and are simplifying it a bit far. For example a shooter doesn't just need the position, weapon and where they shoot. It also needs to know what character model/cosmetics they are using. There models animation is synchronized and ofcourse there's killcams aswell so it sends data for where your opponent was looking etc.

Netcode is a lot more complicated then you've posted there.

Isn't Smash 8 player? There was something in the last direct. Maybe 8 player is only local, but that would be just stupid. Also I remember something said about online comparing stuff, although Sakurai didn't like classical leaderboards - still it takes statistics. Anyways, the data isn't much for any of these games, despite the number of players or statistics. If you have Teamspeak while gaming it transfer 1000-10000 times as much data. And that works too and also is very dependant on lag. If a game doesn't run smooth online, it is probably because of bad netcode or too much load.

Yes, I simplified a bit, but the character-models (or car models) are transferred before the match once, as you don't switch character/car mid-fight or mid-race. The direction you look is another vector, like position or momentum. That are just three numbers. Again, teamspeak is transferring a lot more data. And I don't downplay the stuff - it is not much data transferred for any of these genres, but it is incredibly hard to program smooth synchronisation between the clients right. Still I don't understand why you brought in server power in your initial post, as rendering and netcode is done in the clients.



3DS-FC: 4511-1768-7903 (Mii-Name: Mnementh), Nintendo-Network-ID: Mnementh, Switch: SW-7706-3819-9381 (Mnementh)

my greatest games: 2017, 2018, 2019, 2020, 2021, 2022, 2023, 2024, 2025 

10 years greatest game event!

bets: [GTA6]

Different set of standards, I'm sure. With that said, I've been playing Bayonetta 2 and Black Ops II online lately and the experience has been quite pleasant.



SubiyaCryolite said:
Jizz_Beard_thePirate said:

Well... I am not trying to say that it is a technical feat but rather this is how games should launch. Smash Bros online isn't like the zomfg innovative online that every game should follow but out of the Big IPs that did get released this year out of the Big 3, Nintendo games seems to be the only ones that work properly both online and offline for all their games. And it isn't just Smash, when MK8 launched and it sold 1 million + in first week, the online had no issues either apart from some people having really bad internet connections which is of course, an issue with Peer-to-Peer.

And at the end of the day, Yes, FH2 and SO does have solid online features and so do some Sony games, but you are also paying yearly for those features so you expect that kind of service from Microsoft and Sony for every game, specially if its first/second party, yet for MCC and DC, that has been not the case which is ashame.

Once MS and Sony get their things together, MCC and DC will probably provide a much better online experience than SSB or MK8 will but the issue is that in terms of game launches, Nintendo still managed to have all their games work perfectly when it comes to online and they did it for free which is the key thing imo. People shouldnt have to wait 2-4 weeks to be able to experience the full game (specially if you are paying for the online service) and for Nintendo games, they didn't have to!


I see your point, but thats the fault of some game develeopers not Sony or Microsoft. It also doesnt reflect the whole environment. because far more online games work just fine PSN or Live.

Well, that is true but both of those game developers have been making games for the respective publisher for a while so its not like they didn't have loads of experience with them and online so its like eh. And yes, it does not reflect the whole environment but it shouldnt even happen to first party/second party games... I mean come on, people are paying for the service yet they have to wait for 2-4 weeks for the game's online features to be up and running? Specially since these are big games for the holiday season



                  

PC Specs: CPU: 7800X3D || GPU: Strix 4090 || RAM: 32GB DDR5 6000 || Main SSD: WD 2TB SN850

I haven't tested online yet but that's good to hear, my worry was influenced by my overall poor experience with the 3DS online.