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Forums - General Discussion - I don't see how humans can lose to zombies.

Ka-pi96 said:
Intrinsic said:
chocoloco said:

Guns are more readily available to the public while explosives are mostly controlled by the military. 

 

Imagine Europe trying to survive this thing with no guns. They would be dead a lot faster.

Well fine, but doesn't anyone have trucks? Tractors? You know, those heavy duty vehicles we all avoid. Those should make for some really good mow them down machinery. Like literally just drive right through thousands ofthem. Then reverse over them for good measure.

The trucks/tractors wouldn't survive that. I'm sure you've seen the damage hitting a deer can do to a vehicle, so just think of trying to not only hit but then drive over hundreds or even thousands of people. You would probably get body parts stuck in parts of the vehicle and it just wouldn't survive. Then once it breaks down whoever was driving it is screwed.


A bulldozer can mow down huge rocks and tons of dirt. Surely it can withstand a few thousand bodies.



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I'm very much in love with zombi movies, and have seen a lot of them, but clearly, that's the weakness of the genre. It's hard to believe we would lose. Just a wall is enough to stop them.

"Dawn of the Dead" explore indecisiveness and individualism as the main factor for failure. People arguing endlessly, people protecting their family, cops fleeing, slow reaction. It's quite realistic. I mean, so much of the current problems could be solved if the politics just did something. Most movies are just about "let's shoot them all". But when do you decide to kill your own people when you don't know if there is a cure, if it's temporary. When someone get the highly contagious and dangerous ebola, do we just kill him and burn him, or do we make tremendous effort to cure him ? If New Yord felt in a matter of days, would we just nuke the place ?
"The Dead" is quite good to make a defeat believable in Africa. Spare resources (to be used locally), bad infrastructures, nowhere to get a refuge.



bugrimmar said:
Carl2291 said:
Depends on your definition of "zombie" and how the entire thing kicks off.

What are the ground rules here?


Any definition from any movie/book/story. Based on the facts of human technology, we just can't lose, assuming we don't ALL turn into zombies.

Watch 28 days/weeks later pl0x



The One and Only

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Ka-pi96 said:

The trucks/tractors wouldn't survive that. I'm sure you've seen the damage hitting a deer can do to a vehicle, so just think of trying to not only hit but then drive over hundreds or even thousands of people. You would probably get body parts stuck in parts of the vehicle and it just wouldn't survive. Then once it breaks down whoever was driving it is screwed.

Nope, you are not thinking about it the right way. You don't have to run them down. I said "MOW" them down. Think driving slow at 15M/hr. Slow enough to even be handing out flyers.

And that point you made about stupid humans running into a zombie infested building after a dog? I can PROMISE you. That shit only hapens in the movies. You would be surprised how effective a human beings fight/flight response is.



Ninsect said:
bugrimmar said:
Carl2291 said:
Depends on your definition of "zombie" and how the entire thing kicks off.

What are the ground rules here?


Any definition from any movie/book/story. Based on the facts of human technology, we just can't lose, assuming we don't ALL turn into zombies.



Watch 28 days/weeks later pl0x

I did, and the plot simply didn't make sense. Where were the tanks? Where were the helicopters? Where were the jets? Where were the freaking bombs and explosives?

In order to make zombies look dangerous, we have to strip down what humans have and just give them guns. Come on now, again, how can even a million zombies break through one M1 Abrams tank?



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We wouldn't. A bunch of a tanks + air support would wipe out a hoarde of stupid zombies in about 15 minutes. From that point on you just have to contain the disease from spreading.



Zombies would be fairly easy to wipe out. Lets consider

1.) They are slow moving

2.) They are dumber than a dog

3.) They can be easily baited/lured into an area.

4.) Humans are smarter, faster, and have access to guns, bombs, grenades, and the ability to communicate/organize.

This wouldn't even be a fair fight. 



bugrimmar said:

I did, and the plot simply didn't make sense. Where were the tanks? Where were the helicopters? Where were the jets? Where were the freaking bombs and explosives?

In order to make zombies look dangerous, we have to strip down what humans have and just give them guns. Come on now, again, how can even a million zombies break through one M1 Abrams tank?

ikr??? Just watch any news network and see how quickly the riot gear and machinery or national guard comes up whenever there is any kinda civil unrest. Yest somehow thee things all fall apart during a zombie apocalypse. 

Just look at what human beings do to eachother for random shit lik eoil or having diffeent beliefs.. now imagine what we would do to zombies for being dead and not wanting to stay dead and wanting to make us dead too or worse? have us for dinner. It wouldn't be funny at all.



Zombies would win cause they will not be tied down by emotions.. Besides fear of a large flesh eating group running towards you could you shoot your mother if she was infected? Ah.. You spended a second thinking about it and now its too late.. You are already dead..



 

Face the future.. Gamecenter ID: nikkom_nl (oh no he didn't!!) 

Ka-pi96 said:
bugrimmar said:
Ka-pi96 said:
1. Brain beating brawn is no where near 99% of the time. Oh, and lets not forget there are a LOT of really stupid humans out there as well (the ones that would run into a zombie infested building after a dog come to mind). And of course the numbers advantage. That's a really huge one, the zombie numbers would keep going up, they are easily replaceable. A human dies and it would take years for another one to be born and grow old enough to fight zombies.

2. This really depends how fast it spreads. If it isn't that fast then yeah it could be contained and eradicated. If it spreads fast though, especially internationally then it's a pretty big problem. Besides even if weapons like that were used it would still wipe out a lot of things, so you could still say a zombie apocalypse happened and destroyed a large part of the world.

3/4. Sure vehicles would be a big advantage to start with. But fuel and ammo are finite resources. Once they go then that advantage goes with them. If the zombie outbreak spreads fast enough then it could seriously affect the supply lines and mean those reserves don't last that long. Then all of a sudden the priority becomes saving the fuel rather than using it all in all out war against the zombies.

There are also other factors to consider. Firstly there is the element of surprise. You compared zombies to a horde of savages, but if a horde of savages were to attack it would be known about beforehand and preperations would be made. Zombies would be a complete surprise, no one would be ready. Most cities don't have tanks or jets just sitting around and would most likely be unable to cope with just the police force.

1. Not 99%, then 95%? Can you give me a historical example of a technologically lesser civilization beating a more advanced one in a war?

2. I'm not really talking abot containment. I'm talking about the ability to just destroy huge zombie populations at a touch of a button without the need for fighting men at all. Think about drones armed with huge bombs and missiles.

3/4. There's more fuel and ammo available on the earth now to eradicate every human on the face of the earth 10 times over. Why would these resources all of a sudden disappear? On one battleship alone, there are hundreds of thousands of high impact shells that could mow down an entire city full of zombies already.

I understand that people aren't prepared, but I'm assuming in this instance that the zombies have come out already, and the remaining humans are prepared to fight. In an engagement like that, there's simply no way the humans can lose.

1. Let's see... Huns, Mongols, Italo-Ethiopian War and the Vietnamese war to name just a few. Although the country that wins a war is often also the larger of the two countries. So it isn't just technology.

2. If it isn't contained those kind of weapons wouldn't really work though. How would wiping out an area and all the zombies in it be useful if there was also zombies everywhere else. If you are just going to bomb everywhere on the planet then yeah... that could arguably be called a loss for humanity.

3/4 it's not that they would disappear, more that you would need a way to actually get them to the places you need them, which could be difficult depending on how big the zombie outbreak is.

It wouldn't just be one big battle at the end though. The remaining humans would have to slowly and carefully take back parts of the world. Some countries really wouldn't stand a chance so you could have large swathes of land with nothing but zombies. Even when taking land back you'd have to be very careful about it, any mistakes could end up with a lot more deaths.

1. Huns and Mongols had superior military technology and tactics. If you study both civilizations (I did, part of my thesis in history), they weren't mindless savages. On the contrary, they had very sophisticated strategies they used that the other countries couldn't counter and both are being studied in various military academies around the world.

For instance, the Hunnic or Mongol bow had far greater range than any other bows around that time. The strength was produced by the double recurve design as well as the materials used. Also, their superior horsemanship allowed them to outmaneuver their clumsy opponents (i.e., European Knights who only knew how to charge forward).

In the (first) Italo-Ethiopian war, the Ethiopians were financed and armed by other Western powers such as Russia (to add, Ethiopia eventually became colonized by Italy, so the superior tech won in the end). Aside from that, they were fighting on home soil. Similar with the Vietnamese, home soil was crucial in their victory.

In a zombie vs. human war, who has home soil? Obviously humans, who are defending their homes and families, and have a much greater motivation to win.

2. Zombies are mindless, so they can easily be drawn and cornered into an area where they can be wiped out. Unmanned drones and robots can be used for this simple purpose.. draw them into one area, then bomb the heck out of them. Would the zombies know what's coming? No way.

3/4. The US government has a massive stockpile of ammunition. Are you going to assume that the outbreak will start WITHIN the military? If that's the case, then you win. However, even my local gun store around the corner has hundreds of grenades and thousands of bullets on sale. I don't think humans would ever have a hard time securing weapons.

I'm not talking about one big battle either. It's simple mechanics.. just like the way the US made Iraq fall to their knees in less than a week. Bombing, air strikes, raids, etc. will take their toll without a single casualty. There's really too much power behind the military now to be threatened by a bunch of wild animals.