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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Resolution doesn't sell games, says Far Cry 4 dev - 1080p debate is a "weird echo chamber"

Ka-pi96 said:
I like him, he speaks the truth!

Resolution really means shite all as long as the actual game is good.


What's irritating me is people who act like we can't have both. Why can't I have a game that graphically is the best we've ever seen and at the same time very fun to play?

Then he gives example of how people play retro games so that means we can't like high end graphics. Sorry but just cause some people play those pixelated games doesn't mean we all do. At the same time just cause we complain about 1080p doesn't mean it's all we care about. The fact is games are fun and have been fun for a long time I can't remember the last time I've had an issue finding fun games to play. So since the gaming industry clearly has it together when it comes to making fun games I worry about other things like wanting better graphics.



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I feel 1080p is important, simply because it's a standard. It's like the luxuries we demand in a modern society.

Could you lower the resolution to improve performance? Yes, you could. Could you build a house without windows to make the house cheaper? Yes, you could. Is either a necessary compromise? No, they aren't in my opinion.

1080p televisions became ubiquitous several years ago. I find it disconcerting that brand-new systems in 2013 are struggling to meet that standard set many years before they came out. These consoles could've had very powerful hardware, but both Sony and Microsoft played it way too safe this time around.



"Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience."

-Samuel Clemens

DD_Bwest said:
its getting easier and easier to avoid buying ubisoft games


Way ahead of you. Wasn't even planning on buying this game.



vivster said:
As an isolated case it's a non-starter. Nobody would give a shit. But if you, as a mainstream consumer, get told from all sides and all the time that most multiplats run better on PS4 it will affect your decision. Even if it was just a pixel difference. Better is better and that's what consumers will read and hear.

Pretty much. It doesn't really matter if the difference is 720p vs 1080p, or 1070p vs 1080p. All the average consumer will understand is that A > B. Tell them that frequently enough and it will influence what they buy.

Regardless, it's sad to see how many people allow their opinions to be crushed into black and whites, simply because they feel the need to vilify the opinion that counters their own. It may surprise some people to learn that it's possible to believe resolution is important without believing it's the most important thing in the world. A preference is not an absolute.



MoHasanie said:

1080p or not 1080p isn't an "interesting question", according to Far Cry 4 creative director Alex Hutchinson, who spoke to OXM at length about the commercial efficacy of rad graphics at a preview event earlier this month.

"It's certainly not something I care about in a game," Hutchinson told me, after confirming a target resolution and frame rate of 1080p and 30 frames a second for the Xbox One and PS4 versions of the game. "It feels weird to me that people are cool about playing a sort of retro pixel game, and yet the resolution somehow matters. It's like: is it fun, is it interesting, is it new, is it fresh, are there interesting questions?

"With the 4K TVs and things - somebody was telling me that with a 4K TV, to even see it, your living room has to be big enough to sit like 12 feet from the screen. I don't know the exact numbers, but it starts to get a little crazy. I'm just in it for the experience, I'll play a SNES game if it's cool."

Hutchinson feels that consumer enthusiasm for high-end visuals is waning - echoing Crytek's Nicolas Schulz, who opined in early October that it's getting "difficult to really wow people" with flashy graphics.

"Exactly," said Hutchinson, when I brought this up. "And also I think it's a bad axis. We should not be in a business that sells itself - we are, a little bit, but that sells itself on the flavour of like, gadgetry and technology. I think that's a bad sign.

"If our thing is 'woo, the same exact thing you had before, at twice the resolution, instead of a new thing'... A new spin or an evolution, I think is much more interesting."

So when, assuming it ever happens, will players cease to obsess over fidelity? "I think they already have secretly. Think about how things used to be - it used to be the graphics on the back of a box that sold a game. And even since the Xbox 360 and the PS3, that sort of era, like early 2000, I feel like 99% of the time it's gone away.

"It's a rare question for you to ask now about resolution or something," Hutchinson went on. "It's [only brought up] because of the disparity, the idea that one version is being held back. I don't think that has sold consoles for a while now.

"I think experiences have been selling them, and that's your challenge, if you don't have a new cool experience, or a social experience - like Call of Duty sells consoles, even though art-wise, it's not exactly... like Call of Duty to Crytek's games, one sells a metric s**t-ton and the other doesn't."

Is this really a fair assessment, though, in light of the frenzy over screenshot comparisons in the run-up to Xbox One's launch? "Well, I think that's more people trying for a story. It's the same challenge we had all across the business, where five per cent of the audience is online commenting, and 95 per cent are just buying them or not buying them. We create these weird echo chambers for those issues, and sometimes I wonder, I don't think this is real."

http://www.totalxbox.com/82240/resolution-doesnt-sell-games-says-far-cry-4-dev-1080p-debate-is-a-weird-echo-chamber/


Well Hutchinson is an idiot. With VR on the verge of being released graphics are going to be vital, and with major engine devs such as Epic pushing better graphics he is just making more excuses for poor graphics from new consoles.



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shikamaru317 said:
Ka-pi96 said:
I like him, he speaks the truth!

Resolution really means shite all as long as the actual game is good.

Yeah, I agree with him too. We've reached a sad point as gamers, where a game's graphics matter more than the story, gameplay, sound design, etc.


We haven't reached that time your simply twisting things you've read. When someone wants better graphics or complains about graphics your automatically assuming that it means more then story,gameplay,sound,etc. I can guarantee very few people if any have ever said this.



shikamaru317 said:
Ka-pi96 said:
I like him, he speaks the truth!

Resolution really means shite all as long as the actual game is good.

Yeah, I agree with him too. We've reached a sad point as gamers, where a game's graphics matter more than the story, gameplay, sound design, etc.

I don't think that's the case at all, nor do i expect any but a tiny minority believe graphics to be more important than gameplay (though i could believe a larger number favoring it over story and sound, depends on the game style).

It's been the same for decades, and i see no reason it would be any other way. We rarely get the chance to play a game prior to release (with exception to the occasional demo). We get few details on the story, outside of themes and the premise. We only get samples of the music that appear in clips and trailers. So what does that leave us? Graphics and art direction. That's the only thing we ourselves get to truly judge in the months leading up to a games release. Naturally, that becomes the key point of discussion.

Once a game is out, the topic expands to other areas, providing it has other things of merit to provide (outside of intentionally limited topics like "which games looks best?").



daredevil.shark said:

2. With game developers GPU manufacturers are also to blame. I know many people who updraged with GTX 780Ti and some SLI it. Now with GTX 970 / GTX 980 have made them obsolete. This is normal. But they are really fraustrated. Because this is happening too frequently in last few years. Nvidia / AMD have gone too greedy.

Actually, GPU cycles are now as frequent as before, or even slower. If we look at AMD:

  • R9 290/290X_ October 2013
  • HD 7970_ Jan 2012
  • HD 6970_ Dec 2010
  • HD 5870_ Sep 2009
  • HD 4870_ Sep 2008

As you see, there's usually 12 months between each release, with the 390/390 being actually late (thanks to the 20nm problems). And everybody knows that only a very minority of gamers upgrade their GPU with every new release, most wait a couple of gens or more to make the jump, which is the more sensible think to do.

 

OT: I have to agree that what matters is the game, not the resolution. But when we are comparing the same game across the various versions of it, resolution and fps are among the things that reviewers and users will look for to see which version is better.

So no, resolution doesn't matter when deciding if a game is fun or boring, good or bad; but it does matter when it comes to decide which version is the best and, if given the option to choose, which version of the game is worth buying.



Please excuse my bad English.

Currently gaming on a PC with an i5-4670k@stock (for now), 16Gb RAM 1600 MHz and a GTX 1070

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Aerys 2 hours ago
He is not wrong, there is so much more than just resolution to choose one version or an other, there is framerate, lightning, assets, effects, tearing or not, clipping, additionnal features, ..

i dont see why you cant have those things and 1080p,the powers there on the ps4... everything they're saying now is damage control after they basically admitted they were going with parity.



JEMC said:
daredevil.shark said:

2. With game developers GPU manufacturers are also to blame. I know many people who updraged with GTX 780Ti and some SLI it. Now with GTX 970 / GTX 980 have made them obsolete. This is normal. But they are really fraustrated. Because this is happening too frequently in last few years. Nvidia / AMD have gone too greedy.

Actually, GPU cycles are now as frequent as before, or even slower. If we look at AMD:

  • R9 290/290X_ October 2013
  • HD 7970_ Jan 2012
  • HD 6970_ Dec 2010
  • HD 5870_ Sep 2009
  • HD 4870_ Sep 2008

As you see, there's usually 12 months between each release, with the 390/390 being actually late (thanks to the 20nm problems). And everybody knows that only a very minority of gamers upgrade their GPU with every new release, most wait a couple of gens or more to make the jump, which is the more sensible think to do.

It's also worth noting that, not only are the cycles slower, but the graphical leap with end generation is also less.

In the past, you could get a card as powerful as the last-gen's flagship, for half the price. Now, you'll be lucky to get a 10% or 20% framerate boost over a card of the same price from a year ago.

It seems like we're reaching a plateau in graphics performance.



"Never argue with stupid people. They will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience."

-Samuel Clemens