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Forums - Gaming Discussion - A major part of the digital/physical debate that people forget

Burek on 25 August 2014
archer9234 said:
Burek said:
There is a thread on here about 92% ofcPC games being sold digitally. I understand why most people here cling to physical copies, your explanations are valid, but I also believe that you are in an ever shrinking minority.
Digital console games are growing, and toward the end of this generation, in some 5 years from now, most console gamers will move on to the digital, same as they moved on with music, films and series.

Sure, some of you will still insist on buying a disc, but they will slowly become a niche market, probably existing only as collector editions and more expensive than digital download (same as vynil as someone brought it up).

People on gaming forums are not representative of a majority, but are a tiny minority of gamers and console owners. Most gamers find games disposable in the same manner as Netflix movies or Spotify music - download, play, delete, move on...

If it exists, then I wouldn't care if it's niche. I pay the higher price to use what I want. And eveyrone that wants digital goes on. Problem for either side, no.

Exactly, that's what I say... I have nothing against people buying discs, all best to them... I just have no need to do it, I find it cumbersome and an unnecessary expense... 



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archer9234 on 25 August 2014
Burek said:
archer9234 said:
Burek said:
There is a thread on here about 92% ofcPC games being sold digitally. I understand why most people here cling to physical copies, your explanations are valid, but I also believe that you are in an ever shrinking minority.
Digital console games are growing, and toward the end of this generation, in some 5 years from now, most console gamers will move on to the digital, same as they moved on with music, films and series.

Sure, some of you will still insist on buying a disc, but they will slowly become a niche market, probably existing only as collector editions and more expensive than digital download (same as vynil as someone brought it up).

People on gaming forums are not representative of a majority, but are a tiny minority of gamers and console owners. Most gamers find games disposable in the same manner as Netflix movies or Spotify music - download, play, delete, move on...

If it exists, then I wouldn't care if it's niche. I pay the higher price to use what I want. And eveyrone that wants digital goes on. Problem for either side, no.

Exactly, that's what I say... I have nothing against people buying discs, all best to them... I just have no need to do it, I find it cumbersome and an unnecessary expense... 

That's great. The problem is when people who are digital only people whine and moan at people like me. I don't do it. But I don't like hearing nonsense arguments on how my way is stupid.



archer9234 on 25 August 2014
VanceIX said:
archer9234 said:
VanceIX said:
Intrinsic said:
i am digital only so far this gen, but what you are saying though technically correct, isn't entirely true.

key difference is in change of ownership. by law nothing stops you from selling your physical games or buying used physical games.

this is practically impossible with digital games. being that with digital while you own the license to the game, you lack the means to transfer that license to anyone you want. Now if we had a way to sell or transfer our digital licenses at any price we wanted.. then yeah, there really would be no difference owning the two.

A simple fic for this would be for sony/ms/nintendo to have a fixed license transfer fee, say $10 so anyone can transfer ownership of their digital games. So whatever you add to that $10 goes into your account. eg. you sell a game you own for $20, they take $10 and you get credited $10.

Change in ownership, yes, you are correct. In terms of legal ownership of the game itself, no one has that. That is the point I'm making. Some people believe owning the physical disc means you own the game itself, while owning a digital copy means it's only licensed to you. No, either way it is licensed to you. That's my point.


I never belived that. What I own with the disc is protection of issues that can happen in the future. I keep my consoles. And replay my games all the time. Will I be able to play my copy of a digital game 20 years from now or not? On the same hardware. And not being rebought over and over again. That is the reason people care about phsycial. If that answer becomes a no. Then the only other alternative is the hack the old system and pirate the game. The act of owning the property (not the games IP) is better, to me, then a file. Regardless of the tecnicality of the law. It's the loss of personal control, in every aspect, over said items that people want.

No ones refuting that we don't own the IP of the game. Games for Windows Live is a perfect example of things I don't want to deal with. It failed. But my games like Just Cause 2, Super Street Fighter 4 AE, and GTA IV can all be screwed because of this problem. Luckly Steam exsists to save people. If they didn't, or they failed at some point too, I'd have to pirate my non functional games. But again, I don't want to rely on things I can't control.

You can still play games from Steam that came out over a decade ago, and I doubt that'll change any time soon. Ditto for iTunes. I've never lost a purchase on Google Play or Amazon Kindle either.

So yes, there is a very, very good chance that your purchases will be secure. Not only that, but you can put that purchase on multiple consoles.

True. But again, I don't give my trust fully to any company.



VanceIX on 25 August 2014
archer9234 said:
VanceIX said:

You can still play games from Steam that came out over a decade ago, and I doubt that'll change any time soon. Ditto for iTunes. I've never lost a purchase on Google Play or Amazon Kindle either.

So yes, there is a very, very good chance that your purchases will be secure. Not only that, but you can put that purchase on multiple consoles.

True. But again, I don't give my trust fully to any company.

And that's completely fine. Everyone has different preferences



                                                                                                               You're Gonna Carry That Weight.

Xbox One - PS4 - Wii U - PC

Zkuq on 25 August 2014

In practice you own most physical copies and no one cares about the so-called 'licenses'. End of story. With digital, it's totally different.



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VanceIX on 25 August 2014
Zkuq said:
In practice you own most physical copies and no one cares about the so-called 'licenses'. End of story. With digital, it's totally different.

Not really. I don't feel that I only own a liscence with my digital games. I can play them offline and just like I do a physical game. 

People exaggerate the difficulties of going digital. It's almost the exact same thing. With consoles like the Xbox One, you can even store all your games on an external drive and take them to a friend's house to play. Maybe it'll be the same for the PS4 soon as well.



                                                                                                               You're Gonna Carry That Weight.

Xbox One - PS4 - Wii U - PC

burninmylight on 25 August 2014
Mikeanheath said:
burninmylight said:
Mikeanheath said:
 

I think the issue is different with music and games, as music files can be played on all kinds of devices. Certain games are created for a platform and once that platform is gone you might not get to play that game again unless they port it to the console you're using now. I have tons of digital games on ps3, take specifically Super Stardust HD. I can't play that on my ps4. The cool thing about old consoles before all the digital stuff started happening. I can take my old Nintendo, Genesis, Playstation, etc and still play those games today. If for whatever reason one of the systems eventually breaks down I should be able to find another one online and I still have my games collection to play. If you're all digital once your system dies of old age, it's over. Eventually my ps3 is gonna die, and who knows how long Sony will have these games to download.

Another thing with digital is we end up having to pay for the same game over and over again as a new platform comes out. All the old games on Nintendo/Sony platforms on their online store. We might have bought these games years ago, but play them again on a new console(without backwards compatability) we have to buy them again even though we have them on physical disc/cartridge.


You can play your downloaded Wii Games on your Wii U just fine. Same thing with DSi:3DS. Games that you bought for Wii that get released for the Wii U VC require a small upgrade fee, but you can otherwise skip it and continue to play your games in Wii mode. I can't speak for the other consoles.

I don't see why you think this is only a digital problem. Can you take PS360 discs and play them on the PS4/X1? Or a disc from any console and play it on another console two generations later?

That's what I'm getting at, with going only digital. My ps3 games I have on disc should last my whole life time. I should always be able to find a ps3 should my system fail, and it will eventually, my fat 60gig did. If I were all digital, who knows how long Sony will have those games online to download. Not to mention the time it would take to download everything again, should it be possible to get it all.


I always assumed you can make backups of your games on other HDDs on PS3, but correct me if I'm wrong. I know you can swap HDDs.



VanceIX on 25 August 2014
Shadow1980 said:
VanceIX said:

Once again, read any EULA before saying that the game isn't licensed to you, and that you own it.

 

Are you trying to test my patience? Just because they say in the back of the manual that it's "licensed, not sold," doesn't make it so. It doesn't trump the law of the United States of America, which states quite clearly that I own my discs. Nobody has the authority to deprive me of the right to use them. Unless you can cite some part of U.S. law saying otherwise, then you don't have a leg to stand on in this argument. Saying "read the EULA" over and over doesn't make you any more right the first than the first time you said it.

The law clearly states your ability to sell and lend such copies. It does not say that you have direct ownership over the copyrighted content on the disc. The content on the disc, however, is liscenced to you by the company, and I'm sure that the courts would take their side on this. 

There is a narrow scope of actions available to games on disc. Even courts disagree on what people are allowed to do with licensed content. It is not nearly as clear cut as you make it out to be. Laws are very vague, as of now corporations will continue to "license" games out instead of selling them. There is a big distinction.



                                                                                                               You're Gonna Carry That Weight.

Xbox One - PS4 - Wii U - PC

Mikeanheath on 25 August 2014
burninmylight said:
Mikeanheath said:
burninmylight said:
Mikeanheath said:
 

That's what I'm getting at, with going only digital. My ps3 games I have on disc should last my whole life time. I should always be able to find a ps3 should my system fail, and it will eventually, my fat 60gig did. If I were all digital, who knows how long Sony will have those games online to download. Not to mention the time it would take to download everything again, should it be possible to get it all.


I always assumed you can make backups of your games on other HDDs on PS3, but correct me if I'm wrong. I know you can swap HDDs.

As long as you restore to the same ps3. There are games and specifically lots of DLC that is copy protected that won't restore to a new ps3. You often have to download them again.

Stuff like you mentioned about Donkey Kong Country games being taken off is a whole other issue. Somethin similar happened with the Crash Bandicoot games being able to play them on ps vita. One day they were in the store and I transfered them to the vita and then at some point they took them off and now people that didn't get them at the time can't play them on vita. The Donkey Kong Country games are classics on snes, the fact that they took them off of the store sucks.



Zkuq on 25 August 2014
VanceIX said:
Zkuq said:
In practice you own most physical copies and no one cares about the so-called 'licenses'. End of story. With digital, it's totally different.

Not really. I don't feel that I only own a liscence with my digital games. I can play them offline and just like I do a physical game. 

People exaggerate the difficulties of going digital. It's almost the exact same thing. With consoles like the Xbox One, you can even store all your games on an external drive and take them to a friend's house to play. Maybe it'll be the same for the PS4 soon as well.

You can now, but can you ten years from now? Yeah, you don't know that. With physical games, you do: You can. Point is, in the end it's not up to you whether you can play those games, it's up to someone else and that someone else isn't a person, let alone a person you know. If that someone decides the service offering those games isn't worth taking care of anymore, they have every right to take it down, along with your access to the games you've paid for. And it's not just time: In some cases, it might be enough for you to just say something that someone doesn't like and bam, no more access to games!