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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Nintendo/Iwata's Bias Against The West

Purple said:
Soundwave said:
To further illustrate my point, lets look at Western-developed Nintendo games (published or secured through some type of direct deal) from the N64 vs. the Wii U and Wii.
We'll leave the GameCube out because there may be some debate as to how much of GCN's Western support came from games greenlit prior to Iwata's presidency (ie: Eternal Darkness, Wave Race: Blue Storm, and NBA Courtside 2002).

N64 (1996-end of 1999)

Killer Instinct Gold
Star Wars: Shadows of the Empire
GoldenEye
Diddy Kong Racing
Tetrisphere
Banjo-Kazooie
NBA Courtside starring Kobe Bryant
NBA Courtside '98
Star Wars: Rogue Squadron
Jet Force Gemini
Ken Griffey Jr. MLB Slugfest
Cruis’n’ USA
Pilotwings 64
Waiale Country Club Golf
Command & Conquer
Jet Force Gemini
Donkey Kong 64
Blast Corps
Star Wars Episode I Racer

Wii U (2012-end of 2015 projected)

Donkey Kong Country: Tropical Freeze
LEGO City Undercover

Wii (2006-end of 2009)

Excitetruck
Excitebots
Punch-Out!
Metroid Prime 3: Corruption


The N64 has triple (18) the number of Nintendo games from Western devs as the Wii and Wii U combined.

To be fair, we don't know exactly what Iwata has planned for the next five years though.

I think he has enough sense to realise Nintendo has to get out of hardware as soon as possible and forging relations with new studios doesn't make so much sense when you're looking to move away from being a platform holder.

I don't see any inclination that Nintendo is looking to get out of hardware. Not any time soon anyway. 



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Purple said:
Soundwave said:
To further illustrate my point, lets look at Western-developed Nintendo games (published or secured through some type of direct deal) from the N64 vs. the Wii U and Wii.
We'll leave the GameCube out because there may be some debate as to how much of GCN's Western support came from games greenlit prior to Iwata's presidency (ie: Eternal Darkness, Wave Race: Blue Storm, and NBA Courtside 2002).

N64 (1996-end of 1999)

Killer Instinct Gold
Star Wars: Shadows of the Empire
GoldenEye
Diddy Kong Racing
Tetrisphere
Banjo-Kazooie
NBA Courtside starring Kobe Bryant
NBA Courtside '98
Star Wars: Rogue Squadron
Jet Force Gemini
Ken Griffey Jr. MLB Slugfest
Cruis’n’ USA
Pilotwings 64
Waiale Country Club Golf
Command & Conquer
Jet Force Gemini
Donkey Kong 64
Blast Corps
Star Wars Episode I Racer

Wii U (2012-end of 2015 projected)

Donkey Kong Country: Tropical Freeze
LEGO City Undercover

Wii (2006-end of 2009)

Excitetruck
Excitebots
Punch-Out!
Metroid Prime 3: Corruption


The N64 has triple (18) the number of Nintendo games from Western devs as the Wii and Wii U combined.

To be fair, we don't know exactly what Iwata has planned for the next five years though.

I think he has enough sense to realise Nintendo has to get out of hardware as soon as possible and forging relations with new studios doesn't make so much sense when you're looking to move away from being a platform holder.


next five years? look at the WIi list. its pathetic why would we have any reason to believe that the WIi U will be better?



Zod95 said:
Smear-Gel said:
Zod95 said:

If that's the case, then it's all fine by me. I couldn't care less about the details.

The only thing I could criticize is the importance you and many people are giving to such details, which I believe is being more destructive than constructive (once there is no consensus between you and Soundwave). So I have a suggestion for you: create that amazing OP you wanted to see and post it here for us to read. Instead of just criticizing the OP, losing focus from the main message and engaging into small "fights" that are not worth the time (at least in my opinion), you would be emphasizing the main points with an enhanced and fact-proven article (with all the correct details backed up by sources). That would be outstanding :) Could you do that?

If you want people to focus on the message instead of the details, leave out the details. You cant  expect people to see something they beleive is skewed or wrong, and simply ignore it. And since the main point being true in the OP is supposedly because the reasoning in the OP, it would make sense to talk about them.

 

EDIT:

 

You cant tell other people they aren't allowed to find the details important just because you dont.

If they see something wrong and put it right they are not ignoring it, are they? I just think it's much better to be constructive and improve what is faulty but has potential than to waste it and be stuck on a negative and destructive position.

To me, people that criticize the details of a good message is most probably because they are not comfortable with that message and want to destroy it (or at least cloud it).

Regarding the importance of the details, that's just my opinion (see the underlined).


When a "good" message takes it's foundation in details that are literally completely wrong, then most of the time it's silly to ignore the details.

If I said the PS4 is selling well, then said it was because of hype and sony fanboys only, my main point is true, right? So no-one can have issue with my details and say so?

But that's fact. The PS4 is selling well.

This is a thread that states an opinion, and sets out to prove it with examples. That arent right. How can having issue with the very things used to PROVE the basis be "silly nitpicking" at all?

 

Zod95 said:

To me, people that criticize the details of a good message is most probably because they are not comfortable with that message and want to destroy it (or at least cloud it).

To return the favour, I'd say dismissing issues with an argument as "nitpicking" happens with people who dont want to come to terms with thier view just not actually being right. I'm not saying that's the case here, just responding specifically to that.



Soundwave said:

I don't see any inclination that Nintendo is looking to get out of hardware. Not any time soon anyway. 

I'd argue the fact he hasn't invested in any western studios is a bit of an indication he has no intention on supporting a future console with exclsuively first party software. And we all know what kind of third party support the next console will receive.



Purple said:
Soundwave said:

I don't see any inclination that Nintendo is looking to get out of hardware. Not any time soon anyway. 

I'd argue the fact he hasn't invested in any western studios is a bit of an indication he has no intention on supporting a future console with exclsuively first party software. And we all know what kind of third party support the next console will receive.


I don't think they will have the traditional discreet console + handheld next gen. It will be primarily a handheld (tablet-like probably) platform, with a home TV variant that allows games to be played on the TV as well (think Vita + Vita TV, only with 100% of Nintendo's software backing + some decent Japanese 3rd party support). 

Maaaaaybe such a platform could get support from the likes of EA, because if they only effectively have to make "one" version of Madden/FIFA/Star Wars and then can sell the game on both the Nintendo handheld and home device ... there's probably some appeal to them in that. Possibly. 



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Purple said:
Soundwave said:

I don't see any inclination that Nintendo is looking to get out of hardware. Not any time soon anyway. 

I'd argue the fact he hasn't invested in any western studios is a bit of an indication he has no intention on supporting a future console with exclsuively first party software. And we all know what kind of third party support the next console will receive.

You could've  said that during the GC era, or the Wii era. Given that Nintendo are still pouring money into hardware development, I'd suggest they're sticking in hardware. It would be a disaster if they did leave.



It`s amazing how many games Rare put out in 3-4 years.

Wii is missing:
Mario Strikers from NLG, in 2007
Battalion Wars 2 from Kuju, in 2007

Truth is, that list, although lacking some calendar years, does show that Nintendo had more western-made games than it has now. Even during the Wii days things weren`t improving when they really should have.
For the home console market, i think the only western studio is Retro and NST.



I'm sorry Soundwave but your entire concept is bogus.

Flip the script around. How many western developers are rushing in to work with Japanese publishers?

As development got harder and more expensive, working with language and time barriers, unstable foreign exchange rates, logistics nightmares, etc....it's simply more feasible and economically fruitful to work with devs/pubs that aren't 12,000 miles away.

Just another dig.



The rEVOLution is not being televised

Viper1 said:
I'm sorry Soundwave but your entire concept is bogus.

Flip the script around. How many western developers are rushing in to work with Japanese publishers?

As development got harder and more expensive, working with language and time barriers, unstable foreign exchange rates, logistics nightmares, etc....it's simply more feasible and economically fruitful to work with devs/pubs that aren't 12,000 miles away.

Just another dig.


I'd venture a guess and say if 80%+ of the gaming market was in Japan, that Western devs would swallow their pride and start financing more Japanese titles. 

The proof though as they say really is in the pudding. Has this strategy of more Japanese titles yielded any real success for Nintendo? I'd say no. 

They haven't had a break out 2nd party hit since (guess when) the 1990s really. The Japanese 2nd party games they make don't even sell that well in Japan to begin with. Endless Ocean is probably the most successful one topping 1 million worldwide on a 100 million userbase of the Wii. 

The biggest hit is Donkey Kong Country Returns which is obviously a sequel to DKC from that 90s era. 

Games like GoldenEye, DKC, Killer Instinct, NBA Courtside, Ken Griffey Jr. MLB, Banjo-Kazooie, Star Wars Rogue Squadron, etc. all legitimately were hit games and helped the N64 and SNES. 

Zangeki No Rengliev, The Last Story, Line Attack Heroes, The Wonderful 101, Pandora's Tower, etc. not so much for the Wii/Wii U. I hate to say it but Devil's Third and Bayonetta 2 are likely to bomb (in part because to sell games like those you need to appeal to action gaming consumers in the West ... where Nintendo has no foothold whatsoever). 

I mean even small projects, the Western indie game scene is booming, maybe Nintendo could've found something like Minecraft or Plants Vs. Zombies first ... but would've required actual investment and outreach on their part, something they completely missed the boat on. 



To be fair, on the matter of deals, i`m not sure there aren`t more western deals because Iwata doesn`t want to.
If i`m not mistaken, Nintendo never had that many deals with western developers, even during the N64/GC days.

Maybe it`s easier for Nintendo to secure deals in it`s homeland.