to me WII U is nothing. ps4 is the only one.

i am not richt to spend 300 euro in a secondary console.

For the mainstream the PS4 is obviously the primary console. They will never touch Wii U. But nonetheless for some sophisticated gamer the Wii U could be the primary or secondary console.

Why count Wild? Because of the graphics? Length? Cost? Hype? Where is the cut-off with Indie games? Do we count stuff like Resogun and Shovel Knight, which are $20 games on par with a $70 retail game? Don't hate Project Guard, Pikmin at first looked stupid to me, and I ended up loving it. It still has the budget to release Retail, so obviously Nintendo must have a reason to publish it.

All those images showed was that Wild, a PS4 Arcade game, has better graphics.....no reason to count it...

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You can't say this doesn't count because Nintendo doesn't release any arcade/indie games because that's not true. Here are 13 WiiU indie exclusives

8-Bit Boy
A Hat in Time (PC/WiiU)
Anima
Another Castle
Art Acadamy
Mario vs. Donkey Kong
Project Y2K
Pushmo World
Shantae and the Pirates Curse
Star Beast: The Stellar Wind
Swords & Soldiers II
Tengami (WiiU/PC)
Two Brothers (WiiU/PC)

Go to Wikipedia and and you'll see 116 more indie/arcade exclusives which have been announced and yet to release. I don't want to include indies/arcade only games because they aren't high budget enough to warrant a retail release, and while there might be some gems out there, there is a lot of crap, on all platforms. Not going to go through 129 Arcade games on WiiU to find out which ones are worthwhile (or even localizing/not cancelled)

Smash Bros is a different game the previous gens, there Tearaway is not, but even if you count Tearaway (and GT7, didn't know they made a statement saying it's in development), you still have 14 Retail PS4 games & 11 Retail XB1 games compared to 18 Retail WiiU games. Start counting indies, and WiiU really starts to dominate.

No matter how you like to slice it, number of retail games, number of games altogether, what to expect based off previous gens, etc. WiiU has the most exclusive content, in both quality and quantity. WiiU is still the best 2nd console, but if you don't like the exclusives, it's not terrible to get a PS4/XB1 as an alternative.

Who says that Wild will be all that? You say it will be an Arcade game, but have you anything to back that up? Wild, Rime and Alienation all have reasons to be counted, if you count something like Project Giant Robot. Nintendo giving it the budget of a retail game means absolutely nothing, they gave that to Game & Wario as well.

If a game is important enough to its publisher to get a special segment outside of an indie reel in a big public event like Gamescom or E3, then it's well worth putting on this list and its completely unfair to for example exclude a game that is made by the creator of Rayman and is supposed to have a world size equal to that of Europe but then include another game that looks essentially like Rock em' sock em' robots digital version (for now) just because it has a retail release.

I said we shouldn't count Smash Bros if we don't count Tearaway because it has a 3DS version releasing ahead of it, that will more than likely also share at least 50% of the features with the Wii U version.

But I'd say we better stop now and agree to disagree since I don't see us getting to a point where we agree what should be counted and what shouldn't.

I am not so sure that is the absolute case anymore... WiiU is definitely a must-have for some people as there is no other way to get Nintendo exclusives. I also used to think that the XB1 exclusives are not plenty and different enough to differentiate from a PS4 but with the upcoming releases such as Forza 2, I tend to think otherwise.

So, depending on the kind of games you tend to like both WiiU and XB1 can be compelling systems, especially when they get a price cut. For a person like me, who prefers PS4 and Sony experience primarily, I'd definitely have a compelling reason to grap an XB1 when it gets a price cut and redesigned slim version. Others may be willing to do the same with a WiiU (especially after a price cut).

I would rather have a PS4 as my primary and the XB1 as my secondary.

99% of Nintendo's 1st party offerings do not appeal to me.

However, I would rather play M$ 1st party games over what Nintendo offers.

I feel the same as you. That is why I'm getting an XB1 to sit alongside my PS4 in December.

So you're saying if they made a trailer for the game and showed it off, it should be counted? Well they showed a dozen Arcade games at E3 for Nintendo, guess we should count Pushmo World, Mario vs. Donkey Kong, A Hat in Time, Art Acadamy, Tengami......the list goes on.

I'm not saying ignore Rime, Wild, Pushmo World, etc, I'm saying count them separately.

Oh I get you're point about Smash Bros., fair point, but since I said lets count Tearaway, then lets count Smash.

Agree to disagree? So I prove to you that Nintendo will get more exclusives (both retail and arcade) then PS4, and you want to agree to disagree? Are you going to ignore Nintendo's arcade games now because only PSN games count? Nintendo has more exclusives to offer, both Retail and Arcade, and if Wii if anything to judge the quality by, then we can expect more highly rated exclusives for WiiU then any other 8th gen console. This makes WiiU the best 2nd console to own after a PS4/XB1.

Admit to being wrong, simple as that.

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P.S. I find it funny how you only argued for PS4 being a better second console then WiiU. Do you admit XB1 is the worst 2nd console to own? PS4/WiiU make the best package IMO, + a 3DS.

Owning a Xbone and a PS4 is like banging two 21 year old super model twins. Both are great, but neither are all that different. Variety is the spice of life.

I have a Wii U (primary) and a Ps3 (secondary) may get a Ps4 as new secondary