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Forums - Nintendo - Will Nintendo's next handheld and console use Power PC like the Wii U?

No, I think they will use ARM. For power efficiency and cost/performance, I don't think Power PC can beat ARM. If it could other vendors (like cell phone makers) would use it.

They will just have a dev system that streamlines the process of porting old PowerPC code to the new ARM setup.

Nintendo's handhelds already use ARM so I don't think it'll be that big of a leap for Nintendo either. 

The important thing really is cost/performance ... ARM scales in cost much more quickly than PowerPC I believe because no one else really uses PowerPC, it's a very custom part. ARM is used in tons of devices, so Nintendo will be able to get a part that goes down in price much more quickly. This is a problem right now I believe with the Wii U. 



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spemanig said:
amak11 said:

Architecture isn't a problem now, devs complained about power. In 5 years a lot of the technology in the PS4 and One will be outpaced by phones. 


In 5 years, a lot of the tech in the PS4 and XBO will be outpaced by everything, including the next x86 whatever. Architecture clearly is a problem. If it wasn't, games like Plants vs Zombies: Garden Warefare would be on the Wii U. A game like that would have no problem selling, but the extra work porting is obviously an issue on the Wii U that doesn't exist on the PS4 thanks to nearly identical hardware.

Work required in porting still doesn't matter. x86 isn't efficient and is extremely power hungry. Nintendo chose ARM for a reason, powerful and efficient. You can only find that on RISC based systems. Besides, PS4 and Xbox One still require a decent amount of porting between the two consoles, it makes zero difference with the Wii U involved. 



Maybe. The latest power pc cpu's are very very power efficient and if they mirror the design of the wii U, in that they have a separate arm cpu for the os, they could use that same arm processor to keep 3ds backwards compatibility. It's a mistake to think of the wii U's cpu as simply a 3 core wii cpu running faster. It's a custom design which is much more efficient.

Personally, I think the handhelds will stay arm, but there's no reason why they have to. Both the other archs are viable.



amak11 said:

Work required in porting still doesn't matter. x86 isn't efficient and is extremely power hungry. Nintendo chose ARM for a reason, powerful and efficient. You can only find that on RISC based systems. Besides, PS4 and Xbox One still require a decent amount of porting between the two consoles, it makes zero difference with the Wii U involved. 


Again, I'm not tech savvy, so forgive me, but if the Wii U and 3DS successors both used ARM, wouldn't porting from the PS4 to that still require much more work and money than to each other? If x86 isn't efficiant, why are they being used by the PS4 and XBO? What's stopping Nintendo from using them next generation?



Alot of people in here are talking about porting from PS/Xbox/PC to Nintendo's next console/handheld but if they do go with a unified approach where all games run on both platforms then do they really need the major 3rd party titles?

I kinda think thats a major reason for going with this strategy so that they can essentially support themselves without the need of 3rd parties, of course they will still be welcome but not absolutely necessary, its not like Nintendo home consoles have really gotten excellent 3rd party support for the last 20 years and when they do the games usually sell much worse than the competition.

Nintendo has excellent software output, the only problem is that they are spread out across two seperate platforms resulting in droughts but if all the games released on there handhelds were also on there consoles and vice versa then Nintendo may honestly be able to pump out an exclusive every month. Combine that with the fact that Nintendo handhelds always have excellent support from Japanese 3rd parties and u have devices with a steady stream of high quality software.



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

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zorg1000 said:
Alot of people in here are talking about porting from PS/Xbox/PC to Nintendo's next console/handheld but if they do go with a unified approach where all games run on both platforms then do they really need the major 3rd party titles?

I kinda think thats a major reason for going with this strategy so that they can essentially support themselves without the need of 3rd parties, of course they will still be welcome but not absolutely necessary, its not like Nintendo home consoles have really gotten excellent 3rd party support for the last 20 years and when they do the games usually sell much worse than the competition.

Nintendo has excellent software output, the only problem is that they are spread out across two seperate platforms resulting in droughts but if all the games released on there handhelds were also on there consoles and vice versa then Nintendo may honestly be able to pump out an exclusive every month. Combine that with the fact that Nintendo handhelds always have excellent support from Japanese 3rd parties and u have devices with a steady stream of high quality software.


...Yes. Obviously yes. Short of them releasing a quantity of eclusives all different genres to rival the 3rd party output seen on other consoles, they can't live off just there games. There are not enough of them. Not even close. They don't have excellent software output. They don't even have servicable software output. They have downright abysmal software output. I think that Nintendo being self sufficient it best for Nintendo too, but they aren't making moves to do that. They don't have nearly enough content for that. They are making moves towards a unified userbase though.



spemanig said:
amak11 said:

Work required in porting still doesn't matter. x86 isn't efficient and is extremely power hungry. Nintendo chose ARM for a reason, powerful and efficient. You can only find that on RISC based systems. Besides, PS4 and Xbox One still require a decent amount of porting between the two consoles, it makes zero difference with the Wii U involved. 


Again, I'm not tech savvy, so forgive me, but if the Wii U and 3DS successors both used ARM, wouldn't porting from the PS4 to that still require much more work and money than to each other? If x86 isn't efficiant, why are they being used by the PS4 and XBO? What's stopping Nintendo from using them next generation?


Usually not, A lot of companies use engines that are very diverse and have support for both consoles. let say you build a game in Unity. It has both Wii U and PS4 support, It's just a matter of optimization from there 

MS and Sony are using them because it's easy for developers to make games for, not for efficency. Efficency in technology is just a faster way to do things. powerPC will always have the advantage over x86 in this category. It's the difference of sending 3 large men carrying a ton of barrels each (x86) and  a ton of men carrying a single barrel each (ARM/PowerPC). Both groups will finish their task, but the people carrying single barrels will be done first. The RAM you put in to it is the steroids. 

X86 just don't fit in to Nintendo's philosophy. Hell the Wii U uses less power than the Wii. There is always more to consider than raw unadulterated power. Look at Sony last gen. The cell had huge potential, and it wasn't used by anyone except internal devs. 



spemanig said:
zorg1000 said:
Alot of people in here are talking about porting from PS/Xbox/PC to Nintendo's next console/handheld but if they do go with a unified approach where all games run on both platforms then do they really need the major 3rd party titles?

I kinda think thats a major reason for going with this strategy so that they can essentially support themselves without the need of 3rd parties, of course they will still be welcome but not absolutely necessary, its not like Nintendo home consoles have really gotten excellent 3rd party support for the last 20 years and when they do the games usually sell much worse than the competition.

Nintendo has excellent software output, the only problem is that they are spread out across two seperate platforms resulting in droughts but if all the games released on there handhelds were also on there consoles and vice versa then Nintendo may honestly be able to pump out an exclusive every month. Combine that with the fact that Nintendo handhelds always have excellent support from Japanese 3rd parties and u have devices with a steady stream of high quality software.


...Yes. Obviously yes. Short of them releasing a quantity of eclusives all different genres to rival the 3rd party output seen on other consoles, they can't live off just there games. There are not enough of them. Not even close. They don't have excellent software output. They don't even have servicable software output. They have downright abysmal software output. I think that Nintendo being self sufficient it best for Nintendo too, but they aren't making moves to do that. They don't have nearly enough content for that. They are making moves towards a unified userbase though.

I mostly meant the AAA western titles that literally have never been a major factor on Nintendo platforms, I later said they would still need the Japanese 3rd party support that there handhelds usually get.

But ur wrong Nintendo has amazing software output, here are the major games they have released from November 2012-May 2014

Paper Mario, Animal Crossing, Pokemon Mystery Dungeon, New Super Mario Bros U, Nintendo Land, Game & Wario, New Super Luigi U, DKC Returns 3D, Luigi's Mansion 2, Pikmin 3, Wii Party U, Wind Waker HD, Wii Fit U, Wii Sports Club, Mario Party, Mario Golf, Link Between Worlds, Pokemon X/Y, Yoshi's New Island, Kirby Triple Deluxe, Mario Kart 8, DKC Tropical Freeze, Tomodachi Life, Super Mario 3D World.

Thats well over 1 game per month and I might be missing a few. Nintendo does have excellent software output, the problem is they have to spread them out on 2 seperate platforms.



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

Soundwave said:

No, I think they will use ARM. For power efficiency and cost/performance, I don't think Power PC can beat ARM. If it could other vendors (like cell phone makers) would use it.

They will just have a dev system that streamlines the process of porting old PowerPC code to the new ARM setup.

Nintendo's handhelds already use ARM so I don't think it'll be that big of a leap for Nintendo either. 

The important thing really is cost/performance ... ARM scales in cost much more quickly than PowerPC I believe because no one else really uses PowerPC, it's a very custom part. ARM is used in tons of devices, so Nintendo will be able to get a part that goes down in price much more quickly. This is a problem right now I believe with the Wii U. 


Cell phones don't use x86, but that hasn't stopped PS4/XBO from using it. This is about BC, not ports. The hardware needs to be able to run the old Wii U games you already have, not port them. I downloaded MK8. I should be able to play that same copy on the Wii U's successor, and maybe even the 3DS successor.



If the next console is supposed to match PS5 / Xbox Tu in power, or even have half as much power, that would be more than enough to emulate WiiU via software, but programming a WiiU emulator on x86 hardware could be quite difficult...

 

Edit: yay 4000th post!