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Forums - Nintendo - The truth about Nintendo

 

What do you think about Nintendo's attitude?

Awful, they should fail i... 189 14.04%
 
Pretty Bad, they should l... 385 28.60%
 
Not bad, they're just as anybody else 188 13.97%
 
Good, we need more like them 389 28.90%
 
Excellent, they don't need to change one bit 173 12.85%
 
Total:1,324
Zod95 said:

And I said "some": "I appreciate your effort, but listing programs that aren't developed by Nintendo and some are not even considered games".

iQue and Quality of Life aren't games. These "other ventures" prove the OP is wrong how exactly?

Whatever man, just keep spinning and stay inside your bubble then. I'm not going to satisfy you with a response anymore. Goodbye.



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Zod95 said:
Final-Fan said:

I was just going to passively read the thread, not responding until after reading it all (if then), but I snapped on page 3 (@50) when I noticed a passage from the OP I'd overlooked:

Same thing happened in the Fighting genre, where Nintendo came up with Super Smash Bros to compete with the complex and somehow realistic Tekken, Dead Or Alive and Soul Calibur.
YOU SON OF A BITCH! After that huge fight in the other thread over "photo realism" you dare to call Tekken and Soul Calibur "realistic"? I guess Jigglypuff is too much of a balloon for you.

The fact is that you are still mistaking your personal views for universal truth. (This isn't directly talking about Tekken anymore, but in general how rock music and human characters are supposed to be objectively superior in games to orchestral music and Pokemon.)

Nice to see you Final-Fan.

LOL, I understand your anger, but let me explain then. First of all, I called them "somehow realistic", not "realistic". And I did so because they comprise fighters with real techniques and real moves. You can actually learn a lot about martial arts playing those games (in a way that you can't on books or videos, because on videogames you do it yourself and you apply each move when you feel the need to do so). On top of that, the characters are humans (maybe not all of them) and the arenas seem real.

And this is universal truth. Super Smash Bros doesn't comprise real martial arts. Other games do. Super Smash Bros isn't mainly about humans. Other games are. This is not my opinion. These are facts.

In regards to music, one can perceive an evolution along the time. And there was a time in history when music in videogames began to shift from instrumental-only to sang music. For example, 8 bit music is not as evolved as the music we have nowadays on games. Is it better or worse? That's about tastes. But it's not as evolved, that's a fact too.

As for the human characters vs Pokémon, I didn't get it. What are you talking about?

I feel like every time you use the word "evolution", the entire scientific community cringes.Its like when people say that humans are the "most evolved" animal which is complete BS from a scientific perspective.

You really cannot say anything about the music Nintendo uses in their games without being 100% opinionated. There is no facts backing up those opinions. "Sang music" is in no way more evolved than instrumental music. You have spoken about music a few times on here and used it as an example of how Nintendo hasn't evolved or adapted but I am still waiting for proof.

Additionally Nintendo does use vocals in a lot of their music (whether it is a choir or it is lyrical varies)



Zod95 said:

 And I did so because they comprise fighters with real techniques and real moves. You can actually learn a lot about martial arts playing those games (in a way that you can't on books or videos, because on videogames you do it yourself and you apply each move when you feel the need to do so).

On behalf of all of us that have studied a real martial art, we're going to have to ask you to stop.



The rEVOLution is not being televised

Viper1 said:
Zod95 said:

 And I did so because they comprise fighters with real techniques and real moves. You can actually learn a lot about martial arts playing those games (in a way that you can't on books or videos, because on videogames you do it yourself and you apply each move when you feel the need to do so).

On behalf of all of us that have studied a real martial art, we're going to have to ask you to stop.

Do you mean to tell me that you didn't learn from playing tekken?



mysteryman said:
Viper1 said:
Zod95 said:

 And I did so because they comprise fighters with real techniques and real moves. You can actually learn a lot about martial arts playing those games (in a way that you can't on books or videos, because on videogames you do it yourself and you apply each move when you feel the need to do so).

On behalf of all of us that have studied a real martial art, we're going to have to ask you to stop.

Do you mean to tell me that you didn't learn from playing tekken?

About as much as I learned to throw fireballs from my hands playing Street Fighter or absorb the souls of my enemy from playing Mortal Kombat.



The rEVOLution is not being televised

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Viper1 said:
mysteryman said:

Do you mean to tell me that you didn't learn from playing tekken?

About as much as I learned to throw fireballs from my hands playing Street Fighter or absorb the souls of my enemy from playing Mortal Kombat.


I learned this little maneuver from fighting games.  Was very useful for my day to day fights I have.



Viper1 said:
Zod95 said:

 And I did so because they comprise fighters with real techniques and real moves. You can actually learn a lot about martial arts playing those games (in a way that you can't on books or videos, because on videogames you do it yourself and you apply each move when you feel the need to do so).

On behalf of all of us that have studied a real martial art, we're going to have to ask you to stop.

Yeah, I have to second this... I don't think you can actually learn to perform moves properly from videogames, not to mention how martial arts are more than that... And I've seen teaching books that can certainly be of more help here.

Those games being largely comprised of real and inspired moves is true though... For example, Ryu's style is inspired by Shotokan-style Karate, which is the martial art I practiced for 7 years. Hitomi from Dead or Alive also uses the same style, and in this trailer for Dead or Alive 3 (at 3:30) you can see her perform "Heian Yondan", one of the standard kata. Of course, there's a lot of fantasy in them too, and I for one am glad of that. I have little interest in playing a fully realistic fighting game, yet the genre is my favorite one in gaming. Same with all the shonen anime focused on fighting that I love...



seiya19 said:
Viper1 said:
Zod95 said:

 And I did so because they comprise fighters with real techniques and real moves. You can actually learn a lot about martial arts playing those games (in a way that you can't on books or videos, because on videogames you do it yourself and you apply each move when you feel the need to do so).

On behalf of all of us that have studied a real martial art, we're going to have to ask you to stop.

Yeah, I have to second this... I don't think you can actually learn to perform moves properly from videogames, not to mention how martial arts are more than that... And I've seen teaching books that can certainly be of more help here.

Those games being largely comprised of real and inspired moves is true though... For example, Ryu's style is inspired by Shotokan-style Karate, which is the martial art I practiced for 7 years. Hitomi from Dead or Alive also uses the same style, and in this trailer for Dead or Alive 3 (at 3:30) you can see her perform "Heian Yondan", one of the standard kata. Of course, there's a lot of fantasy in them too, and I for one am glad of that. I have little interest in playing a fully realistic fighting game, yet the genre is my favorite one in gaming. Same with all the shonen anime focused on fighting that I love...

No doubt inspirations are there.  EVen fully motion capped at times.  Namco's motion capture of Marcelo Pereira for Eddy Gordo's character in Tekken 3 was jaw dropping.  But you can't 'learn' the martial art of capoeira simply through imitation of moves.  I'm almost shocked he even insinuated that you could.  But then I read some of the first post again and now I'm not shocked anymore.



The rEVOLution is not being televised

Final-Fan said:
Zod95 said:
Final-Fan said:

I was just going to passively read the thread, not responding until after reading it all (if then), but I snapped on page 3 (@50) when I noticed a passage from the OP I'd overlooked:

Same thing happened in the Fighting genre, where Nintendo came up with Super Smash Bros to compete with the complex and somehow realistic Tekken, Dead Or Alive and Soul Calibur.
YOU SON OF A BITCH! After that huge fight in the other thread over "photo realism" you dare to call Tekken and Soul Calibur "realistic"? I guess Jigglypuff is too much of a balloon for you.

The fact is that you are still mistaking your personal views for universal truth. (This isn't directly talking about Tekken anymore, but in general how rock music and human characters are supposed to be objectively superior in games to orchestral music and Pokemon.)

Nice to see you Final-Fan.

LOL, I understand your anger, but let me explain then. First of all, I called them "somehow realistic", not "realistic". And I did so because they comprise fighters with real techniques and real moves. You can actually learn a lot about martial arts playing those games (in a way that you can't on books or videos, because on videogames you do it yourself and you apply each move when you feel the need to do so). On top of that, the characters are humans (maybe not all of them) and the arenas seem real.

And this is universal truth. Super Smash Bros doesn't comprise real martial arts. Other games do. Super Smash Bros isn't mainly about humans. Other games are. This is not my opinion. These are facts.

In regards to music, one can perceive an evolution along the time. And there was a time in history when music in videogames began to shift from instrumental-only to sang music. For example, 8 bit music is not as evolved as the music we have nowadays on games. Is it better or worse? That's about tastes. But it's not as evolved, that's a fact too.

As for the human characters vs Pokémon, I didn't get it. What are you talking about?

The lines are a lot blurrier than you seem to be claiming here.  Consider Soul Calibur.  Sure, there are relatively realistic-looking moves going on there, but on the other hand, you have ridiculous crap like Ivy's chain-sword and Voldo in general.  Additionally, people routinely get stabbed and have things done to them that would cripple or kill real humans, and they get up none the worse for wear, aside from a lower health bar.  Super Smash Bros. doesn't pretend to be realistic, but how much less realistic is it actually?—aside from at-a-glance appearance? 

The arenas in Soul Calibur are just platforms with cosmetic features and backgrounds that sometimes look sort of real, like the cave dock/shipyard area, and sometimes are pretty fantastical.  Yes, it's more "realistic" than SSB but it's just a matter of degrees.  The biggest difference is the fact that you have more interaction and variation with the level in SSB.  More stuff to jump around and play with, versus a small blank area for pure one-on-one combat in Soul Calibur. 

"the characters are humans (maybe not all of them)"
There are also more human characters in SSB than non-human, although some of them are "cartoony". 

As for music, my thought is that there came a time when the technology in video games made it possible to have pleasing-sounding music with vocals, and then some games included that.  But I wouldn't say there's a large scale trend of phasing out instrumental music in favor of vocal, and I wouldn't say that music with vocals is more "evolved" in terms of video games.  So no, I dispute your "facts". 

Humans vs. Pokemon:  I thought you had said or implied somewhere that a game with human characters would, all else being equal, be intrinsically superior to a game with made-up fantasy creatures done in a non-"realistic" style.  Similar to the instrumental vs. vocal/rock music.  Pokemon was just an example, I didn't mean that you specifically said humans>Pokemon. 

I don't know how can you ignore my comments (Tekken/DOA/SC have indeed realistic characters, arenas and moves) and I don't know how can you ignore my notes (they are only somewhat realistic, not fully realistic). Do they have non-humans? Yes, they have. Do they have surreal arenas? Sure. Do they have a gameplay system that comprises damage? No, they don't. Then, what? They still are far more realistic than Super Smash Bros...and no, cartoony characters don't seem real.

Regarding music, no, games don't need to (and they didn't) phase out instrumental music. They (can) have both. And of course vocal music is more evolved. Games began to have only instrumental music and then adopted vocal music when they became more evolved. Even the music itself began to be instrumental-only and then evolved too. Nonetheless, that doesn't mean vocal music is better. A perfect comparison would be 2D and 3D games. Games began to be 2D and then most of them evolved to 3D. Does this mean 2D games are worse? Of course not. But they are not as evolved, that's for sure.

In regards to non-realistic style, I never something like that. Maybe you're talking about when I was explaining that it's easier to perceive remarkable achievements on realistic games (once we can compare them with reality) than on non-realistic games (the analysis is far more difficult).



Prediction made in 14/01/2014 for 31/12/2020:      PS4: 100M      XOne: 70M      WiiU: 25M

Prediction made in 01/04/2016 for 31/12/2020:      PS4: 100M      XOne: 50M      WiiU: 18M

Prediction made in 15/04/2017 for 31/12/2020:      PS4: 90M      XOne: 40M      WiiU: 15M      Switch: 20M

Prediction made in 24/03/2018 for 31/12/2020:      PS4: 110M      XOne: 50M      WiiU: 14M      Switch: 65M

S.Peelman said:
Zod95 said:

And I said "some": "I appreciate your effort, but listing programs that aren't developed by Nintendo and some are not even considered games".

iQue and Quality of Life aren't games. These "other ventures" prove the OP is wrong how exactly?

Whatever man, just keep spinning and stay inside your bubble then. I'm not going to satisfy you with a response anymore. Goodbye.

First, you wanted to prove the OP is wrong. You failed.

Then, you wanted to be picky with my comments. You failed on that too and the only thing you've got was a taste of your own poison.

Then, you wanted me to comment on off-topic stuff. I just asked you how that off-topic is on-topic ("These "other ventures" prove the OP is wrong how exactly?"). And you answered "whatever".



Prediction made in 14/01/2014 for 31/12/2020:      PS4: 100M      XOne: 70M      WiiU: 25M

Prediction made in 01/04/2016 for 31/12/2020:      PS4: 100M      XOne: 50M      WiiU: 18M

Prediction made in 15/04/2017 for 31/12/2020:      PS4: 90M      XOne: 40M      WiiU: 15M      Switch: 20M

Prediction made in 24/03/2018 for 31/12/2020:      PS4: 110M      XOne: 50M      WiiU: 14M      Switch: 65M