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Forums - Nintendo - After seeing Bayonetta 2 and 'X' in action today...

 

The PS4's power seems...

Better, but not THAT much better anymore... 241 15.42%
 
Are you crazy?! The PS4 is GOD! 349 22.33%
 
The Wii U is clearly unde... 741 47.41%
 
The PS4 is selling better... 36 2.30%
 
I think I'll be buying a... 191 12.22%
 
Total:1,558
oniyide on 14 February 2014
ZyroXZ2 said:
oniyide said:
ZyroXZ2 said:
oniyide said:
LOL, ok man. Infamous SS still blows both those games away in every category and that is a game being released in the first MONTHS of PS4 being on the market. What do you think will happen when they really start to ultilize the system's power, hell they dont even compare to FF15 and thats a multiplat. Wii U has already been out long enough and they havent shown anything that seems to be able to touch PS4 or Xone games. Lets not compare it to the cross gen game crap.

I said this in a different forum, mostly related to PC graphics (since I'm a PC gamer), but the PS4 is closer to its full capacity than people think.  What we'll see are optimizations and clever ways to pull off graphical tricks over the years, but if you're expecting a PS3/XBox360 level of growth in graphics, that's not going to happen this generation.  If anything, the Wii U is the one that has yet to even reach its full potential, because 3rd parties don't waste their money/time making sure its optimized (ACIV anyone?), and Nintendo even has yet to reach their own full HD stride.

Pikmin 3 was their FIRST AAA HD game, and it came out quite well.  SM3DW took it up a notch, and delivered a solid experience with very neat graphics tech flying completely under the radar (textures, shaders, not a single polygon edge in sight).  DKC:TF brings in fur tech and major on-screen physics, and Mario Kart 8, well, there's no denying that game looks amazing.  See Nintendo's fast growth there?


where's your proof that PS4 and xone are near there full capacity? I didnt say anything about 3rd parties I dont know where you brought that from. They dont optimize PERIOD regardless of console unless its exclusive and even then. AC4 goes both ways for Wii U and PS4 and xone. Full HD stride? OK maybe they still seem to be struggling but that tells me that they may NEVER reach "full stride"

Never said those games didnt come out fine, but if we wanna compare exclusives they are stil MILES behind Infamous SS and KZ:SF for that matter. IMHO. No i dont see fast growth, every game you mentioned are in the same ballpark visually so im not seeing a growth and if im being honest all those games could still run on PS360 7 year old systems, they'll look worst for sure.

I could ask you the same question about the Wii U's capacity... Why is it that the PS4/XBox1 will have SO much growth and are BARELY using full capacity, but the Wii U won't and doesn't?  I mentioned the 3rd party thing because people assume that the Wii U's afterthought ports are somehow a good representation of the console's power.

It's more of a PC gamer thing, with the teraflops of the PS4's GPU and the graphical output they're managing.  After building gaming rigs for a long time (and spending hours benchmarking and overclocking), you start to get a feel for what the power and numbers are capable of pulling off, even unoptimized...

To re-emphasize the whole point of the thread: I never said the PS4/XBox1 aren't more powerful.  But I don't see someone looking at Bayonetta 2 or 'X' and thinking "PS4 blows this out of the water!" other than a Sony fanboy, or potentially a PC gamer who looks for the "details".  That massive gap and "underpowered" problem of the last gen Wii are no longer there, and people need to stop propagating that belief!


Wii U has been out longer and we are still waiting. Its that simple. PS4/One just came out. All we have are 3rd party games to go on, every time somebody brings up Ninty 1st party its always the excuse "well Ninty doesnt really push graphics like that" So we dont even have that much to go on except B2 and X which i have said still doesnt look as good as whats been shown on PS4 or One

So you have to be a fanboy? guess im a fanboy, because I still say Infamous ss and FF15 still blows those two games out of the water. Now its not the distance that Wii had with PS360, but its still a distance



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Scizor_99 on 14 February 2014
JoeTheBro said:
ZyroXZ2 said:
JoeTheBro said:

But why does that matter? To the player it doesn't matter if it's bad architecture or bad specs, the visuals still take a hit. Wii couldn't do lots of PS360 effects because of architecture, and Wii U can't do lots of PS4 effects because of power.

No, see, that's the difference, the Wii U CAN do effects the PS4 can, but probably not on the same scale.

It can but it won't. Even first party games won't be using "next gen" effects. The scale becomes so small that it's just pointless for the Wii U.

Are you sure? I see no reason why they wouldn't be tapped into at some point, especially with big projects like Zelda. They also need to impress in order to draw more people to the console.



JoeTheBro on 14 February 2014
Scizor_99 said:
JoeTheBro said:
ZyroXZ2 said:
JoeTheBro said:

But why does that matter? To the player it doesn't matter if it's bad architecture or bad specs, the visuals still take a hit. Wii couldn't do lots of PS360 effects because of architecture, and Wii U can't do lots of PS4 effects because of power.

No, see, that's the difference, the Wii U CAN do effects the PS4 can, but probably not on the same scale.

It can but it won't. Even first party games won't be using "next gen" effects. The scale becomes so small that it's just pointless for the Wii U.

Are you sure? I see no reason why they wouldn't be tapped into at some point, especially with big projects like Zelda. They also need to impress in order to draw more people to the console.

Look at PS3 graphics. They're great. Considering the Wii U is about twice as strong, they can wow people without using stuff like real-time global lighting systems or soft body physics.



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Scizor_99 on 14 February 2014
oniyide said:
ZyroXZ2 said:
oniyide said:
ZyroXZ2 said:
oniyide said:
LOL, ok man. Infamous SS still blows both those games away in every category and that is a game being released in the first MONTHS of PS4 being on the market. What do you think will happen when they really start to ultilize the system's power, hell they dont even compare to FF15 and thats a multiplat. Wii U has already been out long enough and they havent shown anything that seems to be able to touch PS4 or Xone games. Lets not compare it to the cross gen game crap.

I said this in a different forum, mostly related to PC graphics (since I'm a PC gamer), but the PS4 is closer to its full capacity than people think.  What we'll see are optimizations and clever ways to pull off graphical tricks over the years, but if you're expecting a PS3/XBox360 level of growth in graphics, that's not going to happen this generation.  If anything, the Wii U is the one that has yet to even reach its full potential, because 3rd parties don't waste their money/time making sure its optimized (ACIV anyone?), and Nintendo even has yet to reach their own full HD stride.

Pikmin 3 was their FIRST AAA HD game, and it came out quite well.  SM3DW took it up a notch, and delivered a solid experience with very neat graphics tech flying completely under the radar (textures, shaders, not a single polygon edge in sight).  DKC:TF brings in fur tech and major on-screen physics, and Mario Kart 8, well, there's no denying that game looks amazing.  See Nintendo's fast growth there?


where's your proof that PS4 and xone are near there full capacity? I didnt say anything about 3rd parties I dont know where you brought that from. They dont optimize PERIOD regardless of console unless its exclusive and even then. AC4 goes both ways for Wii U and PS4 and xone. Full HD stride? OK maybe they still seem to be struggling but that tells me that they may NEVER reach "full stride"

Never said those games didnt come out fine, but if we wanna compare exclusives they are stil MILES behind Infamous SS and KZ:SF for that matter. IMHO. No i dont see fast growth, every game you mentioned are in the same ballpark visually so im not seeing a growth and if im being honest all those games could still run on PS360 7 year old systems, they'll look worst for sure.

I could ask you the same question about the Wii U's capacity... Why is it that the PS4/XBox1 will have SO much growth and are BARELY using full capacity, but the Wii U won't and doesn't?  I mentioned the 3rd party thing because people assume that the Wii U's afterthought ports are somehow a good representation of the console's power.

It's more of a PC gamer thing, with the teraflops of the PS4's GPU and the graphical output they're managing.  After building gaming rigs for a long time (and spending hours benchmarking and overclocking), you start to get a feel for what the power and numbers are capable of pulling off, even unoptimized...

To re-emphasize the whole point of the thread: I never said the PS4/XBox1 aren't more powerful.  But I don't see someone looking at Bayonetta 2 or 'X' and thinking "PS4 blows this out of the water!" other than a Sony fanboy, or potentially a PC gamer who looks for the "details".  That massive gap and "underpowered" problem of the last gen Wii are no longer there, and people need to stop propagating that belief!


Wii U has been out longer and we are still waiting. Its that simple. PS4/One just came out. All we have are 3rd party games to go on, every time somebody brings up Ninty 1st party its always the excuse "well Ninty doesnt really push graphics like that" So we dont even have that much to go on except B2 and X which i have said still doesnt look as good as whats been shown on PS4 or One

So you have to be a fanboy? guess im a fanboy, because I still say Infamous ss and FF15 still blows those two games out of the water. Now its not the distance that Wii had with PS360, but its still a distance

Basically anything out of the EAD group looks a clear step above the PS3 and X360. Not a massive one, but a step nonetheless. So we're talking Mario 3D World, Mario Kart 8, and then maybe Zelda. Super Mario 3D World has lighting, character models and some effects that can't be achieved by last-generation hardware. I can't quite speak for Mario Kart 8, but if the game looks as good or better on final release as in the trailers, it will be much more impressive than Mario 3D World.



Scizor_99 on 14 February 2014
JoeTheBro said:
Scizor_99 said:
JoeTheBro said:
ZyroXZ2 said:
JoeTheBro said:

But why does that matter? To the player it doesn't matter if it's bad architecture or bad specs, the visuals still take a hit. Wii couldn't do lots of PS360 effects because of architecture, and Wii U can't do lots of PS4 effects because of power.

No, see, that's the difference, the Wii U CAN do effects the PS4 can, but probably not on the same scale.

It can but it won't. Even first party games won't be using "next gen" effects. The scale becomes so small that it's just pointless for the Wii U.

Are you sure? I see no reason why they wouldn't be tapped into at some point, especially with big projects like Zelda. They also need to impress in order to draw more people to the console.

Look at PS3 graphics. They're great. Considering the Wii U is about twice as strong, they can wow people without using stuff like real-time global lighting systems or soft body physics.

Hasn't NIntendo already made use of the advanced lighting effects in Mario 3D World? Mario Kart 8 looks like it will use it too. Bayonetta 2 and X don't really seem to be really pushing the console (considering it's in its second year), so I'm not sure they're the best games to use if you want to talk graphics. Though I suppose the comparison is being made due to more similar games being on other consoles



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Scizor_99 on 14 February 2014
ZyroXZ2 said:

Anyone else kind of feel like the PS4's power gap isn't that big anymore?  I mean, sure it's more powerful, but after seeing these two, I don't find myself thinking "Oh, how much better this would have looked on PS4"... Am I the only one that thinks that people will stop thinking the Wii U is underpowered after these two games see daylight?


If Mario Kart 8 ends up looking as good (or better) as/than it does in the most recent trailer, then I think that would be a better showcase for the Wii U's graphical capabilities. Bayonetta 2 and X look good but not to the point where it makes you say "this absolutely couldn't be done on the last generation of hardware". I know that Mario Kart 8 doesn't have that much to render but if you look at similar games on older systems there's a pretty noticeable difference. 



JoeTheBro on 14 February 2014
Scizor_99 said:
JoeTheBro said:
Scizor_99 said:

Are you sure? I see no reason why they wouldn't be tapped into at some point, especially with big projects like Zelda. They also need to impress in order to draw more people to the console.

Look at PS3 graphics. They're great. Considering the Wii U is about twice as strong, they can wow people without using stuff like real-time global lighting systems or soft body physics.

Hasn't NIntendo already made use of the advanced lighting effects in Mario 3D World? Mario Kart 8 looks like it will use it too. Bayonetta 2 and X don't really seem to be really pushing the console (considering it's in its second year), so I'm not sure they're the best games to use if you want to talk graphics. Though I suppose the comparison is being made due to more similar games being on other consoles


They're certainly using advanced lighting effects, but they're still pre-baking. Basically the 7th gen was the gen of "close enough." We started making photo-realistic worlds yet everything was an illusion. Shadows look correct, but under analysis they don't mathematically make sense. Now with PS4 and XBONE we're starting to do things the legit way. It takes way more power but also is cheaper. Take that rising dev costs!



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curl-6 on 14 February 2014
oniyide said:

Wii U has been out longer and we are still waiting. Its that simple. PS4/One just came out. All we have are 3rd party games to go on, every time somebody brings up Ninty 1st party its always the excuse "well Ninty doesnt really push graphics like that" So we dont even have that much to go on except B2 and X which i have said still doesnt look as good as whats been shown on PS4 or One

I'm not saying Wii U can match PS4 and Xbone graphically, but Wii U being out longer doesn't mean its been more tapped out than PS4/Xbone; the hasn't been a single Wii U game made from the ground up to be graphically intensive, whereas PS4/Xbone have Killzone and Ryse.

I believe we have seen more of PS4/Xbone's potential than we have of Wii Us.



ZyroXZ2 on 14 February 2014
JoeTheBro said:


They're certainly using advanced lighting effects, but they're still pre-baking. Basically the 7th gen was the gen of "close enough." We started making photo-realistic worlds yet everything was an illusion. Shadows look correct, but under analysis they don't mathematically make sense. Now with PS4 and XBONE we're starting to do things the legit way. It takes way more power but also is cheaper. Take that rising dev costs!

Actually, SM3DW does use some advanced lighting effects.  In fact, just sitting and watching the title screen shows off global lighting/illumination (not to mention I also show it off in my review in-game), something that the last generation consoles had to use sparingly, and instead relied on artistically and strategically placed pre-baked shadows and soft-shadow interaction with the character (a very clever shortcut to achieve an almost believable global lighting system).  SM3DW cleverly creates a "placement" shadow perfectly underneath your character so you can see where your character is above the ground, but an eye for detail will make it apparent that the levels and lighting itself demonstrate proper light sourcing, including the way light reflects at an angle off surfaces...  It's a pretty game, there's no way to spin that once you've seen and played through it yourself.  Sure, it's water could have used Pikmin 3's water, but that's really the only shortcoming...



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fatslob-:O on 14 February 2014
dahuman said:
fatslob-:O said:
dahuman said:
fatslob-:O said:
 

How exactly is it a bad question to begin with ? 

Massive scale ? Does everything have to be of massive scales ? Exactly ...  "Massive" is a relative term. While I don't think it's big it is somewhat meaningful.

Instead of jumping in this thread so brashly why don't you go and read the rest of thread ...

I'm not here trying to justify my question however why don't you justify your impudent response when a conclusion has already being made.

Your question was dumb because you worded it wrong(TBH I don't think you did, I think you honest didn't think the Wii U can even do it, but I know you don't like the Wii U, so I wouldn't be surprised,) then you tried to recover it by changing topics and shifting shit around, and Curl still kept going with you which I don't know why. It's not that complicated, it's not like the new consoles has the capacity to make anything game changing with the ability to do water physics a little better, it's the destruction part that will matter more, water is just for woo ahh pretty shit going on that doesn't do much with that kind of power to start with.

Changing Topics ? O RLY ?

/sarcasm

Game changing is on the eye of the beholder, personally speaking It is a massive jump in trying to do SPH simulation when the last gen consoles would just crash instead ...

It's all relative to one person or another here whether it is destructibility or SPH simulation that matters more ... (We can do this all day y'know ...) 


Hey man, I'm just talking like how it is, you fucked up your words, you are just not man enough to admit it.

whatever ...