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Forums - Nintendo - Can Nintendo sell to other crowds than DS and PS360?

Mnementh said:
Soundwave said:

Games that have sexuality integrated into them and have themes more aimed at adults (further than even Last of Us) is actually the blue ocean now, no one is really daring to step into that relam but there's a large potential audience for games that cater to the tastes of grown ups and not teenager males or little kids.

Games that have a narrative more like a graphic novel or a novel full stop for example. 

But Nintendo won't go there.

Waving a controller around to mimic playing tennis or golf is no longer blue ocean. It's an old idea by now, much like playing with a plastic guitar and matching up notes on screen.

I don't think Nintendo made Wii U for the "hardcore" audience at all. If they had, it would be much more in line with the PS4/XB1. I think their hope with Wii U was to make a more *balanced* version of the Wii. I think their research showed them that there was actually some truth behind the "I bought Wii for Wii Sports and now just use it for Netflix and nothing else" stigma. And things like Metroid and Zelda, proportionate the increase in userbase didn't have as explosive of sales, the Mario games sold great, but things like Xenoblade found a very narrow market given such a larger userbase which was odd.

So I think with Wii U, they wanted to keep the Wii audience, but encourage them to delve into more games, and deeper types of games. Iwata said it himself, they never intended for the Wii to be strictly a casual-only console where you played like Wii Sports and maybe the odd game of Mario Kart and nothing else.

They wanted to I think to make the Wii to be more like the DS (not neccessarily the PS4/XB1) ... the DS at least in Japan (and Nintendo still seems to put extra emphasis on what the Japanese market is thinking) had great success with casual games, but a lot of core games and even core third party games. I think Wii U basically was meant to make the Wii more like the DS. Of course none of Nintendo's plans really worked out this gen.

LOL. The sexualized more adult approach was probably a blue ocean with the first Tomb Raider. It is that no longer for years now.

Also, if I want to read a novel, I read a novel. No game - and that includes The Last of Us and Beyond Two Souls - have a story that is anywhere to match the story of a proper novel or even a movie. If you don't believe me - take a video of a playthrough of The Last of Us, get your friends and some popcorn for a movie-evening and watch that playthrough. Then you know, that still every somewhat decent movie has a better story than a game. And that every movie with some budget has better graphics than every game. So, why pay five time the amount (and additionally for the gaming-system) to get an experience a movie can do better?

And, you people seem to have the wrong idea of 'mature storyline'. While The walking dead is a successful series, the movie theaters cash in most on relationship comedies in different flavour. Sure, some single movies like LOTR are bigger, but the pure mass of relationship comedies bring in much more profit. Actually this is not very common in games. So probably a relationship comedy-game could be a new blue ocean for gaming. Or wait, doesn't the japanese devs already make movements in this direction?

The Wii is still in usage for much more than WiiSports and Netflix. Look at the sales of Just Dance and on which platform these sales happen. If a game for the demographic that bought the Wii is released, they are buying and playing that game. So probably motion gaming is sort of a blue ocean again, because all devs more or less deserted that ocean. Ubisoft is with Just Dance the only one releasing for that market consistently, Nintendo doesn't really do that.

I agree with you at the end. The thinkset to see the WiiU as a net to catch core-gamers and motion-gamers alike seems to be matching. Probably you're right, Nintendo might have intended to make something like the DS, to catch both groups. That would explain the completely inconsistent presentation, that appeals to no group at all.


I don't mean games like Tomb Raider. I mean games that actually feature sex (and relationships) in them, just like a movie would. That is a blue ocean, probably the bluest ocean right now, because no game maker wants to touch that, the industry is still very juvenile in many ways in that it can't deal with something like that. But Nintendo obviously cannot go there. 

You don't want to play a novel, but a lot of women love story rich content, but don't want to play an action/violent video game like The Last of Us. Nintendo could've tapped into that market, because they had a lot of women with the Wii, but instead they only looked at the expanded market as something that needed mini-game collections. They ended up oversaturating their own market and failing to expand it. Six years after Wii Sports, their answer is Nintendo Land ... another mini-game collection that's more cartoony and childlike in its design. 

They really honestly did not look at expanding what "non-games" were. What about a murder mystery that's easily playable with a Wiimote? Throw some sex and salaciousness into that, put some sizzle on that steak. That might be something an adult woman might enjoy. Or something that is less action based in its gameplay but along the lines of Game Of Thrones or Lost ... as a game. The game industry still ties games with storylines and associates that strictly with hyperviolent action games like Last of Us, and that's a turn off to a lot of women and adults.

Nintendo could've married the ease of using the Wiimote and spun that off into making more non-traditional genres of games, but there seemed to be little interest on their side other than "here's another mini-game collection, now go play Mario and Zelda, will ya?". The Wii attracted a ton of adults, who legitimately were interested in things other than violent action games, but Nintendo I don't think really knew what to do with that audience at all and subsequently lost it. 



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padib said:

So far, the threads have grown like a plague saying that since Nintendo's 3DS is doing well and Nintendo can't market to the PS360 crowd, that the WiiU is doomed.

Is there any way that Nintendo could target an audience that is neither one, nor the other?

Or are we completely blind to any concept like that?


Do you want to know WHY Nintendo can't get the Xbox and PS crowd? HARDWARE. By using old specs and a different controller/architecture/archaic online service, Nintendo eliminates any and all possibilities of major third party support. And it's THAT, which sells those two consoles.

Believe it or not, it's not Uncharted and it's not Gears Of War that sold those systems. NSMB Wii outsold both by a mile. It's COD and BF, Madden and Fifa. It's dude bro games and dude bro features that push Xbox and PS, not their exclusives.

If Nintendo would just stop being so damn stubborn and/or cheap, and release something like PS4 with their own IP on it? They would have another NES on their hands because who the hell wouldn't buy that thing? It would totally blow the other two out of the water because what do the other two offer? Nintendo's first party games will always, on the whole, out perform the other two's first party games and if their system had exactly the same third party support and online features of XBL and PSN? Yeah...you get the picture.

My fingers are crossed. I'm hoping the Wii-U bombs so they can once again rise. I want to own another kick ass Nintendo console like the SNES.



They need to make games for a different age group if they want to appeal to those markets. You just have to look at the Wii's top games to get what i mean. I only went as far as their top 10 exclusives, but every one of them was rated E or T :/

Before someone jumps down my thought about how "age ratings have nothing to do with how good a game is", i completely agree. However what does matter is variety, and that includes meeting all the different age groups. Mario is all fine and good, but it's not going to appeal to someone who wants something more in line with Halo or The Last of Us. Normally 3rd party support can carry you for the age groups you don't hit with well, but Nintendo's isn't strong enough. They either need to hit those market themselves, or just be content losing them to the PS4 and X1.

They basically need to break the "Nintendo only make kids games" stigma. While they do make fantastic games, that claim does often hit pretty close to home.



padib said:
prayformojo said:
padib said:

So far, the threads have grown like a plague saying that since Nintendo's 3DS is doing well and Nintendo can't market to the PS360 crowd, that the WiiU is doomed.

Is there any way that Nintendo could target an audience that is neither one, nor the other?

Or are we completely blind to any concept like that?


Do you want to know WHY Nintendo can't get the Xbox and PS crowd? HARDWARE. By using old specs and a different controller/architecture/archaic online service, Nintendo eliminates any and all possibilities of major third party support. And it's THAT, which sells those two consoles.

Believe it or not, it's not Uncharted and it's not Gears Of War that sold those systems. NSMB Wii outsold both by a mile. It's COD and BF, Madden and Fifa. It's dude bro games and dude bro features that push Xbox and PS, not their exclusives.

If Nintendo would just stop being so damn stubborn and/or cheap, and release something like PS4 with their own IP on it? They would have another NES on their hands because who the hell wouldn't buy that thing? It would totally blow the other two out of the water because what do the other two offer? Nintendo's first party games will always, on the whole, out perform the other two's first party games and if their system had exactly the same third party support and online features of XBL and PSN? Yeah...you get the picture.

My fingers are crossed. I'm hoping the Wii-U bombs so they can once again rise. I want to own another kick ass Nintendo console like the SNES.

Your hopes are misplaced. I only need to cite Metroid Prime versus Halo.

Their problem is thinking the industry will do what they want, rather than giving the industry what IT wants. When that changes, they will return.



prayformojo said:
padib said:

So far, the threads have grown like a plague saying that since Nintendo's 3DS is doing well and Nintendo can't market to the PS360 crowd, that the WiiU is doomed.

Is there any way that Nintendo could target an audience that is neither one, nor the other?

Or are we completely blind to any concept like that?


Do you want to know WHY Nintendo can't get the Xbox and PS crowd? HARDWARE. By using old specs and a different controller/architecture/archaic online service, Nintendo eliminates any and all possibilities of major third party support. And it's THAT, which sells those two consoles.

Believe it or not, it's not Uncharted and it's not Gears Of War that sold those systems. NSMB Wii outsold both by a mile. It's COD and BF, Madden and Fifa. It's dude bro games and dude bro features that push Xbox and PS, not their exclusives.

If Nintendo would just stop being so damn stubborn and/or cheap, and release something like PS4 with their own IP on it? They would have another NES on their hands because who the hell wouldn't buy that thing? It would totally blow the other two out of the water because what do the other two offer? Nintendo's first party games will always, on the whole, out perform the other two's first party games and if their system had exactly the same third party support and online features of XBL and PSN? Yeah...you get the picture.

My fingers are crossed. I'm hoping the Wii-U bombs so they can once again rise. I want to own another kick ass Nintendo console like the SNES.


isnt that what the WIi U was supposed to be? Hell isnt that what Gamecube was supposed to be and you are really underestimating 1st party MS and Sony. Halo says hi



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oniyide said:
prayformojo said:
padib said:

So far, the threads have grown like a plague saying that since Nintendo's 3DS is doing well and Nintendo can't market to the PS360 crowd, that the WiiU is doomed.

Is there any way that Nintendo could target an audience that is neither one, nor the other?

Or are we completely blind to any concept like that?


Do you want to know WHY Nintendo can't get the Xbox and PS crowd? HARDWARE. By using old specs and a different controller/architecture/archaic online service, Nintendo eliminates any and all possibilities of major third party support. And it's THAT, which sells those two consoles.

Believe it or not, it's not Uncharted and it's not Gears Of War that sold those systems. NSMB Wii outsold both by a mile. It's COD and BF, Madden and Fifa. It's dude bro games and dude bro features that push Xbox and PS, not their exclusives.

If Nintendo would just stop being so damn stubborn and/or cheap, and release something like PS4 with their own IP on it? They would have another NES on their hands because who the hell wouldn't buy that thing? It would totally blow the other two out of the water because what do the other two offer? Nintendo's first party games will always, on the whole, out perform the other two's first party games and if their system had exactly the same third party support and online features of XBL and PSN? Yeah...you get the picture.

My fingers are crossed. I'm hoping the Wii-U bombs so they can once again rise. I want to own another kick ass Nintendo console like the SNES.


isnt that what the WIi U was supposed to be? Hell isnt that what Gamecube was supposed to be and you are really underestimating 1st party MS and Sony. Halo says hi


The Super NES was a moderately souped up NES with a gimmick controller that wouldn't be able to run games like Street Fighter II or Final Fantasy VI? News to me. 

Neither the Wii or Wii U are comparable to the SNES, they are very clearly part of a new lineage of Nintendo console with different priorties. 

The last of the SNES' "kin" was the GameCube and that died due to terrible mismanagement.



padib said:
Soundwave said:
oniyide said:

isnt that what the WIi U was supposed to be? Hell isnt that what Gamecube was supposed to be and you are really underestimating 1st party MS and Sony. Halo says hi


The Super NES was a moderately souped up NES with a gimmick controller that wouldn't be able to run games like Street Fighter II or Final Fantasy VI? News to me. 

Neither the Wii or Wii U are comparable to the SNES, they are very clearly part of a new lineage of Nintendo console with different priorties. 

That time is revolved. MS and Sony cater much better to that audience than Nintendo does, they aren't competing with Sega anymore. If Nintendo wants to cater to that market they have to use a very advanced strategy, such as calling in the help of 3rd party studios much like they did during the cube days, but also boosting marketing, creating a LOT of software to cater to that market, all the while catering to their own bread and butter. Very different from the gamecube strategy, but also very difficult and expensive. It would need to be really worth it.

But the question of OP is, does there exist a 3rd market that is neither ps360's market, neither the Wii/DS market. Is there a category of gamers that likes something a little more involved but not necessarily violent, for example? Can Nintendo create that market or enrich it? That's the question of OP.

Well I gave you an example above, they could have made more games for adults by using the easy interface of the Wiimote for things like murder mystery games or story-engrossing titles along the lines of Game Of Thrones or Lost. 

Things that appeal to adults and have edgier themes/content, not in a "Lara Croft has giant booobz and gunz too! AWESOME!" way of pandering to 15-year-old boys (that's not the type of "maturity" I'm talking about). 

Another Code and Professor Layton on the Wii/DS kinda went in this direction, but that's really not aimed at adult tastes. 

There's nothing wrong with Nintendo making intelligent investements in hardcore gaming either ... they are, whether Nintendo wants to admit it or not, the most enthusiastic and highest spending portion of the market. Simply ceding the entire audience to Sony/MS should not be an option. Go buy back the James Bond license, do something with that $8 billion sitting in the bank. 

If you're going to do fanservice projects, then do it right. Zelda Musou and SMT x Fire Emblem is OK, but why not Zelda x Final Fantasy? Or Mario x Dragon Quest? Or Nintendo x Square-Enix RPG? If you're going to do these collaborations, then you might as well make ones that can actually sell hardware. 



Soundwave said:
oniyide said:
prayformojo said:
padib said:

So far, the threads have grown like a plague saying that since Nintendo's 3DS is doing well and Nintendo can't market to the PS360 crowd, that the WiiU is doomed.

Is there any way that Nintendo could target an audience that is neither one, nor the other?

Or are we completely blind to any concept like that?


Do you want to know WHY Nintendo can't get the Xbox and PS crowd? HARDWARE. By using old specs and a different controller/architecture/archaic online service, Nintendo eliminates any and all possibilities of major third party support. And it's THAT, which sells those two consoles.

Believe it or not, it's not Uncharted and it's not Gears Of War that sold those systems. NSMB Wii outsold both by a mile. It's COD and BF, Madden and Fifa. It's dude bro games and dude bro features that push Xbox and PS, not their exclusives.

If Nintendo would just stop being so damn stubborn and/or cheap, and release something like PS4 with their own IP on it? They would have another NES on their hands because who the hell wouldn't buy that thing? It would totally blow the other two out of the water because what do the other two offer? Nintendo's first party games will always, on the whole, out perform the other two's first party games and if their system had exactly the same third party support and online features of XBL and PSN? Yeah...you get the picture.

My fingers are crossed. I'm hoping the Wii-U bombs so they can once again rise. I want to own another kick ass Nintendo console like the SNES.


isnt that what the WIi U was supposed to be? Hell isnt that what Gamecube was supposed to be and you are really underestimating 1st party MS and Sony. Halo says hi


The Super NES was a moderately souped up NES with a gimmick controller that wouldn't be able to run games like Street Fighter II or Final Fantasy VI? News to me. 

Neither the Wii or Wii U are comparable to the SNES, they are very clearly part of a new lineage of Nintendo console with different priorties. 

The last of the SNES' "kin" was the GameCube and that died due to terrible mismanagement.

um no when they unveiled Wii U they were showing off 3rd PARTY games, how quickly we forget prior to launch Wii U was supposed to be another SNES, it would finally get all the big 3rd party games in addition to Ninty's regular offerings. Thats not how it turned out of course and now its getting even less support than Wii was but lets not act like that was the plan all along.

GC, that was my point his dream console is exactly what the GC was it got 3rd party games(alot did remain exclusive to PS2) and the Ninty stuff. Maybe it died because people just thought the PS2 and to a lesser extent Xbox were better systems. His quesion was if a NInty console would get similar 3rd party support as the other two who wouldnt buy it? Alot of people wouldnt as the GC showed us, i thought we were all past the point of putting so much stock into Ninty first party.



oniyide said:
Soundwave said:
oniyide said:
prayformojo said:
padib said:

So far, the threads have grown like a plague saying that since Nintendo's 3DS is doing well and Nintendo can't market to the PS360 crowd, that the WiiU is doomed.

Is there any way that Nintendo could target an audience that is neither one, nor the other?

Or are we completely blind to any concept like that?


Do you want to know WHY Nintendo can't get the Xbox and PS crowd? HARDWARE. By using old specs and a different controller/architecture/archaic online service, Nintendo eliminates any and all possibilities of major third party support. And it's THAT, which sells those two consoles.

Believe it or not, it's not Uncharted and it's not Gears Of War that sold those systems. NSMB Wii outsold both by a mile. It's COD and BF, Madden and Fifa. It's dude bro games and dude bro features that push Xbox and PS, not their exclusives.

If Nintendo would just stop being so damn stubborn and/or cheap, and release something like PS4 with their own IP on it? They would have another NES on their hands because who the hell wouldn't buy that thing? It would totally blow the other two out of the water because what do the other two offer? Nintendo's first party games will always, on the whole, out perform the other two's first party games and if their system had exactly the same third party support and online features of XBL and PSN? Yeah...you get the picture.

My fingers are crossed. I'm hoping the Wii-U bombs so they can once again rise. I want to own another kick ass Nintendo console like the SNES.


isnt that what the WIi U was supposed to be? Hell isnt that what Gamecube was supposed to be and you are really underestimating 1st party MS and Sony. Halo says hi


The Super NES was a moderately souped up NES with a gimmick controller that wouldn't be able to run games like Street Fighter II or Final Fantasy VI? News to me. 

Neither the Wii or Wii U are comparable to the SNES, they are very clearly part of a new lineage of Nintendo console with different priorties. 

The last of the SNES' "kin" was the GameCube and that died due to terrible mismanagement.

um no when they unveiled Wii U they were showing off 3rd PARTY games, how quickly we forget prior to launch Wii U was supposed to be another SNES, it would finally get all the big 3rd party games in addition to Ninty's regular offerings. Thats not how it turned out of course and now its getting even less support than Wii was but lets not act like that was the plan all along.

GC, that was my point his dream console is exactly what the GC was it got 3rd party games(alot did remain exclusive to PS2) and the Ninty stuff. Maybe it died because people just thought the PS2 and to a lesser extent Xbox were better systems. His quesion was if a NInty console would get similar 3rd party support as the other two who wouldnt buy it? Alot of people wouldnt as the GC showed us, i thought we were all past the point of putting so much stock into Ninty first party.

How is it the Super NES? Because it had ports of some third party franchises that have been available on the 360/PS3 for seven years now? 

The Super NES did not come out 7 years after the Sega Genesis and did not rely on a controller gimmick to sell it, nor was half of Nintendo's lineup for the system aimed at mini-game casuals (who is Nintendo Land, Game & Wario, Sing Party, Wii Sports Club, Wii Fit U, Wii Party U, Mario & Sonic Olympics aimed at? This is HALF of Nintendo's entire Wii U output).

Super NES got first dibs on games like Street Fighter II and Chrono Trigger and Contra III and was the most powerful of the three major console platforms that generation allowing it to have the best arcade conversions (which was a big deal for its time). 

GameCube honestly IMO was Miyamoto and other "creative forces" inside of Nintendo self-sabotaging the console because they wanted more of a toy console for their own design tastes rather than what made sense for the market. It was kinda like "well, OK we'll do this Resident Evil deal, but I want the console to be purple because it's cute". 

We don't know how the GameCube would've done if it was more competently managed. I mean basically with the GameCube what Nintendo said was "hey did you like Mario 64, GoldenEye, and Zelda: OoT? Of course you did! Now here's a new console where we changed everything you loved about Mario 64 and Zelda: OoT! Oh yeah and here's a FPS which is nothing like GoldenEye and has no multiplayer! And to top it off we're giving you Donkey Kong ... in bongo form!"

GameCube was the console of a hundred ideas that no one asked for wrapped in a console design that screamed "hey!!! It's your little brother's console!". 



Soundwave said:
oniyide said:
Soundwave said:
oniyide said:
prayformojo said:
padib said:

So far, the threads have grown like a plague saying that since Nintendo's 3DS is doing well and Nintendo can't market to the PS360 crowd, that the WiiU is doomed.

Is there any way that Nintendo could target an audience that is neither one, nor the other?

Or are we completely blind to any concept like that?


Do you want to know WHY Nintendo can't get the Xbox and PS crowd? HARDWARE. By using old specs and a different controller/architecture/archaic online service, Nintendo eliminates any and all possibilities of major third party support. And it's THAT, which sells those two consoles.

Believe it or not, it's not Uncharted and it's not Gears Of War that sold those systems. NSMB Wii outsold both by a mile. It's COD and BF, Madden and Fifa. It's dude bro games and dude bro features that push Xbox and PS, not their exclusives.

If Nintendo would just stop being so damn stubborn and/or cheap, and release something like PS4 with their own IP on it? They would have another NES on their hands because who the hell wouldn't buy that thing? It would totally blow the other two out of the water because what do the other two offer? Nintendo's first party games will always, on the whole, out perform the other two's first party games and if their system had exactly the same third party support and online features of XBL and PSN? Yeah...you get the picture.

My fingers are crossed. I'm hoping the Wii-U bombs so they can once again rise. I want to own another kick ass Nintendo console like the SNES.


isnt that what the WIi U was supposed to be? Hell isnt that what Gamecube was supposed to be and you are really underestimating 1st party MS and Sony. Halo says hi


The Super NES was a moderately souped up NES with a gimmick controller that wouldn't be able to run games like Street Fighter II or Final Fantasy VI? News to me. 

Neither the Wii or Wii U are comparable to the SNES, they are very clearly part of a new lineage of Nintendo console with different priorties. 

The last of the SNES' "kin" was the GameCube and that died due to terrible mismanagement.

um no when they unveiled Wii U they were showing off 3rd PARTY games, how quickly we forget prior to launch Wii U was supposed to be another SNES, it would finally get all the big 3rd party games in addition to Ninty's regular offerings. Thats not how it turned out of course and now its getting even less support than Wii was but lets not act like that was the plan all along.

GC, that was my point his dream console is exactly what the GC was it got 3rd party games(alot did remain exclusive to PS2) and the Ninty stuff. Maybe it died because people just thought the PS2 and to a lesser extent Xbox were better systems. His quesion was if a NInty console would get similar 3rd party support as the other two who wouldnt buy it? Alot of people wouldnt as the GC showed us, i thought we were all past the point of putting so much stock into Ninty first party.

How is it the Super NES? Because it had ports of some third party franchises that have been available on the 360/PS3 for seven years now? 

The Super NES did not come out 7 years after the Sega Genesis and did not rely on a controller gimmick to sell it, nor was half of Nintendo's lineup for the system aimed at mini-game casuals (who is Nintendo Land, Game & Wario, Sing Party, Wii Sports Club, Wii Fit U, Wii Party U, Mario & Sonic Olympics aimed at? This is HALF of Nintendo's entire Wii U output).

Super NES got first dibs on games like Street Fighter II and Chrono Trigger and Contra III and was the most powerful of the three major console platforms that generation allowing it to have the best arcade conversions (which was a big deal for its time). 

GameCube honestly IMO was Miyamoto and other "creative forces" inside of Nintendo self-sabotaging the console because they wanted more of a toy console for their own design tastes rather than what made sense for the market. It was kinda like "well, OK we'll do this Resident Evil deal, but I want the console to be purple because it's cute". 

We don't know how the GameCube would've done if it was more competently managed. I mean basically with the GameCube what Nintendo said was "hey did you like Mario 64, GoldenEye, and Zelda: OoT? Of course you did! Now here's a new console where we changed everything you loved about Mario 64 and Zelda: OoT! Oh yeah and here's a FPS which is nothing like GoldenEye and has no multiplayer! And to top it off we're giving you Donkey Kong ... in bongo form!"

GameCube was the console of a hundred ideas that no one asked for wrapped in a console design that screamed "hey!!! It's your little brother's console!". 

you're missing my point, i never said WIi U is SNES im saying alot of people thought it would be. Just check the threads prior and right after E3 of the WIi U reveal to see it for yourself. It wasnt just that they were getting ports of 3rd party games, but multiplats too. Again this is also long before PS4 or xone were revealed so alot assumed that the gap in power in those systems would not be great because they went the power route last gen and lost alot of money, so whatever next gen games being put out would be on WIi U by default becasue the year lead would have ensured a bigger install base and the HW would be closer to a PS2/GC/xbox situation than a Wii/PS60 one. Also people were hyping the WIi U up to be much more powerful than it actually turned out to be. 

NOW all that went to crap. PS4 and xbone turend out to be a bit more powerful that some thought they would be and PS4 was cheaper than some thought it would be as well(especially considering it wasnt that much more expensive than WII u but way more powerful). 3rd party support oh boy. games got cancelled and hell WIi u isnt even getting alot of the PS360 stuff NVM the PS4/xone multiplats. The WII U isnt anywhere near a close power wise than some people were saying it would be. PS4 and even xbone are selling at a faster rate than WII u so it might not have its lead for much long. However i do see your point im just painting a picture why people did think like that, no one now would think that.

Gamecube how was it mismanged? Im not going to get into SW because that is so subjective we'll be here all night. IMHO i liked the first party titles but thats me. How was it mismanaged from a HW standpoint? cause it was purple? there were other colors and i dont believe that core gamers at least or so shallow they would care about color and look, games is all that matters. hell i think PS3 looks ugly (1st and 3rd versions). FYI GC had plenty FPS shooters most of quality alot more than WIi did. What were these hundreds of ideas? IMHO GC was just a regular system. maybe that was the problem I dont know. BUt it seems some people are making excuses for it. It would have still been slaughtered by PS2 because the PS brand itself was THAT much stronger.