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Forums - Nintendo - Dark Souls Producer says Wii U audience doesn't care about Dark Souls.

ps3-sales! said:
Why are you Nintendo fans getting so mad? What he said is 100% true. A very small percentage of Nintendo gamers like Dark/Demon's Souls. It would flop on the Wii U.

That's like saying why not port Mario or Pokemon to Sony/Microsoft platforms. Sure they are great games, but the audience most likely doesn't care about them. Better example would be like a Pikman, but you get the point.

And Dark Souls isn't ugly. You don't need to criticize a game just because you can't play it.

Becuase we are that small percentage!!!

I get it that 97% of wiiu owner don't use the machine for another game than nintendo' one, but i have to care about what i want! A wiiu port would be usefull for management inventory on gamepad screen. I don't care if would be a flop or not, i onlly care about me buying it or not.

Have a loook at MH3U. Average graphics. "Hard to get into" game. Strong online component. All about weapons and armors. Then look at Dark Souls.
I see anyone that liked MH3U buying DarkSouls for wiiu too. Yeah, i know that was a bundle launch title in Japan, that MH is a lot more popular than dark Souls, that was the only version with online(almost exclusive). But i don't see a bomba like Yakuza hd collection, or W101.

C'mom nitenndo, you own part of the publisher, make some pressure.



"Hardware design isn’t about making the most powerful thing you can.
Today most hardware design is left to other companies, but when you make hardware without taking into account the needs of the eventual software developers, you end up with bloated hardware full of pointless excess. From the outset one must consider design from both a hardware and software perspective."

Gunpei Yoko

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supernihilist said:
ps3-sales! said:
supernihilist said:
ps3-sales! said:
Why are you Nintendo fans getting so mad? What he said is 100% true. A very small percentage of Nintendo gamers like Dark/Demon's Souls. It would flop on the Wii U.

That's like saying why not port Mario or Pokemon to Sony/Microsoft platforms. Sure they are great games, but the audience most likely doesn't care about them. Better example would be like a Pikman, but you get the point.

And Dark Souls isn't ugly. You don't need to criticize a game just because you can't play it.


You are wrong. A WIiU port would be profitable 100%. With only 100k units sold they would already profit.

 

Are you telling me DArk souls U wouldnt sell 100k when every other popular 3rd party has achieved this? (AC, CoD, Batman...etc)

dont count EA games because EA sent them to failure. Only game i feel dissapointed with was NFS MW U is the exception that confirms the rule


I didn't say it wouldn't profit. If they could port it very cheaply, then yes it probably would make a profit. But it'll still be a flop sales wise. 100k is flop for a Souls game. 

The WiiU port was estimated to cost about 1.5m $, thats a reaaaallly low quantity for a game that can easily revenue 5m$ selling 100k!!!!!
Thing is you have to create the fanbase yourself as a publisher/developer with your work. thats how it works.

 

Imagine it sold 150k, that could lead to a higher budget sequel releasing too on WiiU with a bigger installbase and a bigger expected revenue.

In the end is about trust, leadership and confidence like everything in life. 3rd parties are reclutant to join Nintendo but they dont understand they are the ones should be pushing the envelope. htey are too afraid and only release half asses products and they ultimately dont realize they are killing the market themselves on WIiU. ANd its a shame cause im a3rd paty buyer on Nintendo consoles since SNES days.

No they arent the ones who are pushing the envelope on Ninty systems. taht is not there job, their job is to get their game in the hands to as much people as possible as cheaply as posssible and the WIi U aint doing it not with those sales. THey are not afraid they are being smartly cautious. And lets stop saying half assed products, when they all have been selling pretty bad across the board. Its not their job to move HW for any company.



Maybe he's talking about mature games not selling well on Nintendo consoles. And I don't think he's wrong. GTA Chinatown Wars and Eternal Darkness both bombed despite being critically acclaimed. Does anyone have an example of an M-rated game selling well on a Nintendo system?



Sigs are dumb. And so are you!

Mr Khan said:
Aielyn said:
daredevil.shark said:
He is kinda right. Wii U fanbase is very small and they dont get anything than first party games. Why waste your gaming investment?

The decision couldn't possibly have been made recently enough for either part of that claim to be a convincing argument.

Also, if Wii U owners are only buying first-party games, it's because third parties are mostly screwing over Wii U owners with the versions they release. The few exceptions have seen the Wii U version selling well relative to the other platforms (like Rayman Legends, which is still selling best on the Wii U, despite the way that Ubisoft screwed owners over with their delay decision, or Sonic Racing Transformed, which sold about as well on Wii U as PS3, and not far behind 360, despite the much smaller install base).

ZombiU has sold to one in eight Wii U owners - not a bad result for a third-party game. Monster Hunter Tri for Wii U has sold a similar number, despite it being the third release of the game, after the Wii and 3DS versions (both of which sold over 2 million copies - making the Wii version the best-selling home console Monster Hunter of all time).

So when it comes down to it, a more accurate statement would be "Wii U fanbase don't buy inferior versions of games or late ports".

 

The funny thing is, when the PS3 version of No More Heroes struggled to sell compared with the Wii version, nobody said that it doesn't appeal to the PS3 audience, or that PS3 owners don't buy . Instead, it was brushed off as being due to the PS3 version releasing three years later. And rightly so - it was a late port, people with an interest in it already bought it for Wii. And yet, if a Wii U game that is a late port struggles relative to the original releases on other platforms, it's blamed on the Wii U audience, and not on the fact that it's a late port.

Hypocrisy is quite rampant within the gaming industry (and the gaming community, for that matter). Third parties will find any excuse to not release a quality product, especially on Nintendo systems. I always loved the old chestnut of "we can't compete with Nintendo on their systems, they're too good" - basically admitting that their games are actually crap, but spun as though it's a sensible business decision. Then there's the variations of "The audience for our games isn't there"... which is like complaining that there's nowhere in a field to build a house because there aren't any foundations already there - you're meant to lay the foundations yourself, and build the house from there (in this analogy, it's Nintendo's job to clear the land, but Nintendo can't lay foundations for third-parties' houses). I also found the "the install base isn't big enough" particularly absurd... it didn't stop them from ignoring the Wii, and didn't stop them from making games for the PS4 and XBO prior to launch, despite the former having the biggest install base of the generation and the latter having no install base at all.

And when they do release a relatively shoddy product on a Nintendo system, they tend to charge full price compared with the other versions. Mass Effect 3 was released practically simultaneously with Mass Effect Trilogy for the other systems, at pretty much the same price. Batman: Arkham Origins was released without the multiplayer, and everyone was shocked when it was actually $10 cheaper than the other versions - because all the other Wii U ports of games were being left with missing features but still having full price charged for them.

Maybe it's true that the Wii U audience doesn't care about Dark Souls. But that's probably because they have higher standards, and haven't been offered anything worthy within the genre. On the other hand, nearly a million PS3 owners were willing to buy *Haze*. You remember that game, right? Rated below 56% on Gamerankings, with the best rating amongst 66 ratings being 80%? With Eurogamer and IGN both giving it less than 50%?

So-called "hardcore gamers" like to say that Wii owners would buy any old crap, but personally, I've found that the standards on Wii and Wii U are actually higher, not lower. And when it comes down to it, third parties were right when they said Nintendo games were just too good, they couldn't compete. To return to the earlier house-building analogy, it's like Nintendo has built mansions in the area, and the little huts that third-parties want to build and try to sell for the same price as the mansions just aren't going to sell to anyone, because who wants to buy a hut instead of a mansion when they're the same price.

Note that I'm not saying the other systems don't have these "mansions". They do. This isn't about the systems, or the libraries, or anything like that. This is about attitudes within the various audiences - Nintendo owners have a higher expectation of quality, because Nintendo games come with a seal of quality. The seal looks like this: 

Win.

ugh.....can't believe you want to agree with this self indulgent masturbatory drivel.  The idea that any fanbase has higher flipping standards than another is the stupidest thing I've heard in a while.  Particularly when your proof is just "that's how I feel" and a single example of a well selling poorly reviewed game.  Here's a check of a couple of the games that topped the Wii charts and their metas.

Wii Play 28.75 million sales Meta score: 58

Mario Party 8      7.97m sales Meta score: 62

Michael Jackson: The Experience  4.24m sales Meta Score 56



...

Drakrami said:
Your title twists his quotes. It is not exactly what he said.

Enough said.


Agreed. Fix the title, please.



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oniyide said:
supernihilist said:
ps3-sales! said:
supernihilist said:
ps3-sales! said:

 


I didn't say it wouldn't profit. If they could port it very cheaply, then yes it probably would make a profit. But it'll still be a flop sales wise. 100k is flop for a Souls game. 

The WiiU port was estimated to cost about 1.5m $, thats a reaaaallly low quantity for a game that can easily revenue 5m$ selling 100k!!!!!
Thing is you have to create the fanbase yourself as a publisher/developer with your work. thats how it works.

 

Imagine it sold 150k, that could lead to a higher budget sequel releasing too on WiiU with a bigger installbase and a bigger expected revenue.

In the end is about trust, leadership and confidence like everything in life. 3rd parties are reclutant to join Nintendo but they dont understand they are the ones should be pushing the envelope. htey are too afraid and only release half asses products and they ultimately dont realize they are killing the market themselves on WIiU. ANd its a shame cause im a3rd paty buyer on Nintendo consoles since SNES days.

No they arent the ones who are pushing the envelope on Ninty systems. taht is not there job, their job is to get their game in the hands to as much people as possible as cheaply as posssible and the WIi U aint doing it not with those sales. THey are not afraid they are being smartly cautious. And lets stop saying half assed products, when they all have been selling pretty bad across the board. Its not their job to move HW for any company.

their job is to make profit.but they are ruining their own profit on Nintendo consoles treating them lik a bitch . Wii era was the worst. the amount of shoddy ports and shovelware 3rd parties flodded Wii environment was unparalleled. fact is they mad a TON of money out of Wii SW thanks to NIntendo ability to sell HW.

but know are being cautious lol how soon they forget Nintendo made them a lot of easy cash with zero risk at it.

they are trying now on WiiU the same aproach and its not working simple as that. if they want to sell they have to put more effort. but maybe they prefer to focus on more easy cash in projects like they did in the past. and thats a shame and makes me sad cause ive always bought a ton of 3rd party on Nintendo



Torillian said:
Mr Khan said:
 

Win.

ugh.....can't believe you want to agree with this self indulgent masturbatory drivel.  The idea that any fanbase has higher flipping standards than another is the stupidest thing I've heard in a while.  Particularly when your proof is just "that's how I feel" and a single example of a well selling poorly reviewed game.  Here's a check of a couple of the games that topped the Wii charts and their metas.

Wii Play 28.75 million sales Meta score: 58

Mario Party 8      7.97m sales Meta score: 62

Michael Jackson: The Experience  4.24m sales Meta Score 56

Less about that part and more about the apt description of hypocrisy, how when games fail to sell on other platforms for good reasons nobody makes a fuss, but when anything fails to sell on Nintendo platforms we're all treated to everyone's crackpot diatribes on how ungrateful/uncultured/myopic the Nintendo fanbase really is.



Monster Hunter: pissing me off since 2010.

Aielyn said:

The decision couldn't possibly have been made recently enough for either part of that claim to be a convincing argument.

Also, if Wii U owners are only buying first-party games, it's because third parties are mostly screwing over Wii U owners with the versions they release. The few exceptions have seen the Wii U version selling well relative to the other platforms (like Rayman Legends, which is still selling best on the Wii U, despite the way that Ubisoft screwed owners over with their delay decision, or Sonic Racing Transformed, which sold about as well on Wii U as PS3, and not far behind 360, despite the much smaller install base).

ZombiU has sold to one in eight Wii U owners - not a bad result for a third-party game. Monster Hunter Tri for Wii U has sold a similar number, despite it being the third release of the game, after the Wii and 3DS versions (both of which sold over 2 million copies - making the Wii version the best-selling home console Monster Hunter of all time).

So when it comes down to it, a more accurate statement would be "Wii U fanbase don't buy inferior versions of games or late ports".

 

The funny thing is, when the PS3 version of No More Heroes struggled to sell compared with the Wii version, nobody said that it doesn't appeal to the PS3 audience, or that PS3 owners don't buy . Instead, it was brushed off as being due to the PS3 version releasing three years later. And rightly so - it was a late port, people with an interest in it already bought it for Wii. And yet, if a Wii U game that is a late port struggles relative to the original releases on other platforms, it's blamed on the Wii U audience, and not on the fact that it's a late port.

Hypocrisy is quite rampant within the gaming industry (and the gaming community, for that matter). Third parties will find any excuse to not release a quality product, especially on Nintendo systems. I always loved the old chestnut of "we can't compete with Nintendo on their systems, they're too good" - basically admitting that their games are actually crap, but spun as though it's a sensible business decision. Then there's the variations of "The audience for our games isn't there"... which is like complaining that there's nowhere in a field to build a house because there aren't any foundations already there - you're meant to lay the foundations yourself, and build the house from there (in this analogy, it's Nintendo's job to clear the land, but Nintendo can't lay foundations for third-parties' houses). I also found the "the install base isn't big enough" particularly absurd... it didn't stop them from ignoring the Wii, and didn't stop them from making games for the PS4 and XBO prior to launch, despite the former having the biggest install base of the generation and the latter having no install base at all.

And when they do release a relatively shoddy product on a Nintendo system, they tend to charge full price compared with the other versions. Mass Effect 3 was released practically simultaneously with Mass Effect Trilogy for the other systems, at pretty much the same price. Batman: Arkham Origins was released without the multiplayer, and everyone was shocked when it was actually $10 cheaper than the other versions - because all the other Wii U ports of games were being left with missing features but still having full price charged for them.

Maybe it's true that the Wii U audience doesn't care about Dark Souls. But that's probably because they have higher standards, and haven't been offered anything worthy within the genre. On the other hand, nearly a million PS3 owners were willing to buy *Haze*. You remember that game, right? Rated below 56% on Gamerankings, with the best rating amongst 66 ratings being 80%? With Eurogamer and IGN both giving it less than 50%?

So-called "hardcore gamers" like to say that Wii owners would buy any old crap, but personally, I've found that the standards on Wii and Wii U are actually higher, not lower. And when it comes down to it, third parties were right when they said Nintendo games were just too good, they couldn't compete. To return to the earlier house-building analogy, it's like Nintendo has built mansions in the area, and the little huts that third-parties want to build and try to sell for the same price as the mansions just aren't going to sell to anyone, because who wants to buy a hut instead of a mansion when they're the same price.

Note that I'm not saying the other systems don't have these "mansions". They do. This isn't about the systems, or the libraries, or anything like that. This is about attitudes within the various audiences - Nintendo owners have a higher expectation of quality, because Nintendo games come with a seal of quality. The seal looks like this: 

Everytime someone just mentions that Nintendo fans have a different taste in games and mostly want Nintendo stuff on their Nintendo console, which is not even something bad to begin with, people like you come and pull arguments and excuses out of your asses just to try and disprove that notion. Third parties treat us badly, we only buy quality, there is no foundation on Nintendo platforms, it's all because of shoddy and late ports etc. it's always someone elses fault.

Tell me, why didn't Nintendo fans buy AC IV on Wii U? Was there no foundation? No, AC III released on the console as well. Because Ubisoft treated you badly? Yeah, I don't think so. Is the game a late port? Nope. Is it a shoddy port? No. Is it a bad game? No.

Or Cod Ghosts. No foundation? CoD games have even released on the Wii. Bad treatment? Certainly not. Late port/shoddy port? No. Bad game? Not brilliant, but certainly not 80k-copies-sold-bad.

And now about that whole "Nintendo fans only buy quality" thing, yesterday Nintendo fans collectively lost their shit over a Dynasty Warrior game with a Zelda paint coat, did they do that because they have such high standards and this game looks to fulfill their standards? No, they got hyped over it being a Nintendo game cross-over, a fucking Nintendo character was all it took to get them hyped over a game that they otherwise wouldn't care about one bit.

Nintendo fans don't care more about quality then other fans, they just want their beloved characters and aside from a couple exceptions nothing else.



LurkerJ said:

Asked whether From Software and Namco ever considered a Wii U port, Miyazoe bluntly replies: “No.” When asked why, he explodes with laughter. “Wii U never came up, and we never doubted that (decision) either,” he says. “It was more of a company decision, so I wasn’t the one that decided this, but I think the audience for the Wii U is a lot different from the audience for Dark Souls.”


http://www.edge-online.com/features/dark-souls-producer-says-pc-version-was-rushed-problems-were-expected/

I don't get the mentalitly. I get why developers are hesitant to jump on the Wii U but even if the Wii U was a success it wouldn't have changed their minds. Wii didn't dark souls despite being an ugly game. Of course there is no audience for Dark souls when there is no Dark Souls.

I am exploding with laughter.

It's not like Dark Souls has SO MANY FANS on the HD consoles. It sold 2 millions combined on both, PS3 and X360.

160 million install base and it only managed to shift 2 million copies despite being a critical hit. Why was there no Wii version? The game is ugly and it fits the Wii controls. I would've tested the waters with a Wii version at least.

doesn't really matter even huge thirdparty franshises can't sell on wiiu, AC3 and 4,both batmans and both COD have all bombed on wiiu.



what? that game would be nice on the Wii U..



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