carlos710 said: Bladeneo said: carlos710 said: Bladeneo said: carlos710 said: Bladeneo said: carlos710 said: disolitude said: carlos710 said: DMeisterJ said: @ FishyJoe I lose more and more faith in you as a mod each passing day. Because he hasnt't banned you for your trolling in the rest of the forum??     DMC 3 was the 3rd game of the series in the same console. DMC 4 it's the first HD DMC. It was a failure in terms of profits IMO, since it sold way less than the first DMC on the ps2 while (likely) having way bigger development costs. You're forgeting it was released to a much smaller userbase...   You are forgetting that nobody cares about attach rates.   Try to learn what this means: PROFIT Early PS2 development costs were huge as well so I doubt capcom are going to be disappointed. DMC4 strikes me as a game with average development costs, possibly slightly higher due to having to develop on two consoles. How is 200,000 in one week in one region a bad thing? I guarantee its better than Capcom were anticipating. It'll probably have 400-500,000 sales during its first week on both platforms (so pushing a million), almost definately break even point for a game like DMC. NOT EVEN CLOSE to about 20 million for an HD game like now.   And DMC 4 may sell more than past DMC games worldwide (thanks to new x360 sales), but its likely going to be the worst rated DMC game ever on reviews. When developers make their games multiplatform instead of taking 100% advantage of a console's hardware the game loses quality quickly. When did quality enter the conversation? A games quality does NOT define its sales, a hell of a lot of PS2 games sold a million copies with sub par reviews, likewise a hell of a lot of games sold hardly anythin despite excellent reviews. So you are fine with paying more money to get less quality -i guess i don't care about what you think then.   But still the development costs are atleast 2.5-3 times bigger than what they were 5 years ago. Woah youre good at making assumptions. I NEVER said I was happy paying more for less, you originally discussed profit, NOT quality and thus I responded. Now that you realise youre point about profit was null, you move onto something else. Well done. Any proof about an average ps2 game being over 20 million?

Carlos710 - you stopped making sense an hour ago. First you said the game is a failure because it didn't sell as much as the first one. It isn't as with xbox and ps3 sales worldwide it will most likely match if not exceed DMC1 sales. Japan is not as big of a player because its USERBASE!!! is much smaller than PS2. Lets see Euro and NA numbers who have a greater userbase.

Secondly DMC4 is on par with if not better than any DMC ever made quality wise. Being multiplatform has nothing to do with that. One version may be inferior to the other but all games are made on a PC. So converting that code to PS3, Xbox or sega master system has nothing to do with the game itself.

Lastly, its obvious you did not play this game as your budget ideas are rediculous. The game has no CGI (its all in game engine), no paid actors, no licences...budget for it was 3 to 5 mil tops.

@starcraft I'm calling BS on the hardware. Every console is less than it should be.

Are you serious Carlos?
You are one of the biggest trolls I've seen.

How is DMC4 opening to 200k+ a bad thing?
It will surely, I can almost guarantee it, turn a profit WW, probably a very healthy one. 200k opening is most likely well above Capcom's expectations, and it will likely outsell DMC 3 in the long run.

Please, know what you're talking about next time.

 Not true.  The Wii is doing fine (screwing the gamecube to the wall).  The Xbox 360 is doing terribly, as it was always going to, but still significantly bettering the Xbox.  The Ps3 just saw a game we were all told would move systems in Japan do almost nothing.

Killzone2 is rumored to cost 64 mil(it was only supposed to cost 32 mil but guerilla sucks at accounting apparently), and its going to be the 2nd most expensive game ever made next only to shenmue which supposedly costed 70 mil.

if MGS4 costed 70 mil now it would be on track to be the most expensive game ever made, and would somehow be making the news. but since KZ2 is still on track to being third and not second, i would have to say that your numbers are false. especially since you just "read it somewhere"

@starcraft so PS3 gets significant sales increase the last 2 weeks in a row in NA and barely a drop in others for the same period with no significant game release, but for a game that sells 210k on a console suffering softwar it sees barly an increase?

I think DMC4 did really well in Japan. Especially for a Hardcore style game these days. But uh....whatever...I guess. I'm not really part of this argument...whatever it's about. Just trying to give some Props to Dante.

There is no way any PS/360 game that isn't a PSN/Live game would cost that little. Even the cheapest Wii games probably cost around that.

Also, from reading both of your posts, I would say that carlos is saying that even though it's on par with other DMC games, since it cost so much more (and if it's HD, then it costs more) than previous DMC games, that though it may not be a flop compared to other DMC games, it's a flop commerically. Also, from looking at DMC 1-3 for the PS2 in Japan, if the numbers are correct, it usually sells about 60% of lifetime totals in Japan first week. Meaning an opening week of 250k would mean it would sell lifetime in Japan 416k. I'd say that is a winner. Overall, we need to wait for US/Europe data. Everyone was calling Zack and Wiki a flop because it only sold 150k or something between NA and Japan, but it wasn't out in Europe yet, and now that it is, it's selling a decent amount, especially for a niche title. Let's wait for NA and Europe before we go on the whole "EPIC FAILURE" run. I think we can assume though that the game probably cost 25million between the two versions combined. I have no idea how many copies it has to sell for it to be profitable, because at $60 a game, it'd only have to sell 415k to break even revenue wise, but since some of that $60 goes to the store at which it was sold, and some goes to the publisher, some to Sony/Microsoft, etc, etc, and we may never know. Will it turn a profit? I would assume it would. Will it turn over massive profits? Eh. We'll sell. 

Wow. A lot of stuff happened in this thread. Carlos seems to have left it already but I'm still sending him a warning.

We're trying to talk about a game that involves blowing shit up with funky guns. Can't we be nicer about it?

Actually, according to VGChartz numbers, PS3 sales dropped in Japan the week DMC4 was released.  So its worse than your saying.