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Forums - Microsoft - Microsoft: Xbone Is 3x As Powerful Than X360 (Phil Spencer Twitter: It Was A Mistake)

Michael-5 on 18 June 2013
ethomaz said:

Michael-5 said:

Like the other guy said, 2 was bigger. MK2 was the game that made MK.

Just like Street Fighter, SF2 was THE Street Fighter, the big one.

Still MK is a bigger franchise then Killer Instinct because KI is only 1 game, and a kind of remake for N64. MK has around a dozen different games.

Guys I have 31 years... I lived MK and KI ages... I was a hardcore game already.

Before MK2 Sub-Zero, Scorpion, Jonny Cage, etc were already worldwide icons... the first MK combat made the MK famous... after that the MK2 because a high expected sequel (and it didn't disapointed)... the hype for MK2 was crazy due MK original.

Ed Boom and John Tobias were cult names already before MK2.

The sales in VGC are wrong... I don't have any data but I'm pretty sure MK did close to 5 million for SNES/MegaDrive and MK2 over 5 million for both too.

KI never did that... I lived the hype for MK and KI... and KI never had the same hype level than MK.

Maybe, they did make that big MK movie.

No point arguing it, Killer Instinct still did very well in the arcades and on SNES, and it's still a name brand fighter. If Mortal Kombat was bigger then that would still make Killer Instinct what the 3rd or 4th largest 2D fighter? I dunno where to place the Marvel/Capcom vs. fighters.



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tuscaniman99 on 18 June 2013

The Xbox One is vastly more powerful than the WiiU.



Michael-5 on 18 June 2013
Captain_Tom said:
Zero999 said:
Captain_Tom said:
LOL the Wii U is like 1.25 times as strong as the 360, and the PS4 is about 12-16 times stronger based on simple math (Not because 16x the ram, that is a coincidence)!

The X1 from my estimates is probably 6-8 times stronger but IDK for sure because MS keeps hiding it...

you're absurdly wrong regarding wii u and ps4.


I adressed the PS4 with a response to someone else, and LOL you Wii U people just won't get your heads out of the sand will you?  The Wii U has NO GAME that looks better than Killzone 2 or even BF3.  At best it will look slightly better but it will b e hardly noticable.  

That's your opinion

No PS3 game runs at 1080p, 60FPS, and looks as good as Pikmin 3 or X



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ethomaz on 18 June 2013

Michael-5 said:

Maybe, they did make that big MK movie.

No point arguing it, Killer Instinct still did very well in the arcades and on SNES, and it's still a name brand fighter. If Mortal Kombat was bigger then that would still make Killer Instinct what the 3rd or 4th largest 2D fighter? I dunno where to place the Marvel/Capcom vs. fighters.

Well I will put King of The Fighter over KI too.



HoloDust on 18 June 2013
ethomaz said:

HoloDust said:

No, not really, it is based on similar architecture, specially TMU and ROP, but shader units have more in common with R600 (2xxx) family. If you look at 2600Pro/XT, 360 is basically 2 of those slapped together, but at lower clock and significantly lower combined memory bandwidth. Some math and educated guesstimation are required to get to that number at the end.

Actual performance is higher of course, but considering we can't really measure how much specific customizations play role in final products, taking just vanilla numbers is a good starting point for the sake of discussion (hence, 141VP of 7850 for PS4, and 96VP of 7770 for XOne, though in reality, both solutions perform lot better).

A exemple... the RSX is supposed to be close a GeForce 7800... the Xenon is a better GPU than RSX... and the GeForce 7800 are in the 12.3 to 15.9 VPs... I'm pretty sure Xenon will be over 15 VP at that table.

In fact most forum and techs guys uses X1900 for X360 (~25VP) and GTX 7900 (~22VP) for PS3 but I think that a little exagerated... I think it is more in line with ~20VP (360) and 16VP(PS3)

A good article about that: http://br.dir.groups.yahoo.com/group/gamejutsu/message/2690

Edit - lol sorry I forget the article is in Portugue... look just the graph.

Using the 20VPs for X360:

PS4: ~7x X360
Xbone: ~5x X360

Only comparing GPU power.


RSX is gimped down 7800GTX with memory bandwidth of 7600GT.  Xenos is nowhere near X1900XT,  with lower pixel/texel rate and half the memory bandwidth. Good example of how much bandwidth is important are 5550s (speculated architecture for WiiU's GPU) with the same core clocks, but different bandwidth  - 27VP, 21.8VP and 16.5VP (last result for the card with same bandwidth as WiiU).

As I said in earlier post, due to customization in console's GPUs (like eDRAM in 360 and WiiU) they will perform better than what the math is suggesting in vanilla versions - that's why I'm using lower numbers, that way you can compare them with vanilla versions of PS4/XOne's counter parts, and not try to guesstimate their enhanced performance (which would be more practical when you want to compare them with PCs).

As for graph, you'll see it puts Xenos at nearly the same level as 4670, and 2900 Pro and 5570, if you check VPs - which is quite silly, tbh, as Xenos just doesn't have initial muscle to be nowhere near that.

Anyhow, whatever VPs you take into measurement, one way or the other, MS themselves stated that XOne= 8x360, so PS4 being 1.5x XOne, you come to what I stated at the beginning - PS4 = 12x360...just for fun, try to extrapolate VPs for XOne and PS4 using that graph, and you'll come to some really redonkulous numbers.



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Zero999 on 18 June 2013
Captain_Tom said:
Zero999 said:
Captain_Tom said:
LOL the Wii U is like 1.25 times as strong as the 360, and the PS4 is about 12-16 times stronger based on simple math (Not because 16x the ram, that is a coincidence)!

The X1 from my estimates is probably 6-8 times stronger but IDK for sure because MS keeps hiding it...

you're absurdly wrong regarding wii u and ps4.


I adressed the PS4 with a response to someone else, and LOL you Wii U people just won't get your heads out of the sand will you?  The Wii U has NO GAME that looks better than Killzone 2 or even BF3.  At best it will look slightly better but it will b e hardly noticable.  

bolded: keep dreaming and hoping to get Curé Syndrome. anyway, i don't see any game on ps4 looking much better than ps3 games either since, you know, we reached the diminishing returns point.



Zero999 on 18 June 2013
Michael-5 said:
Zero999 said:
Michael-5 said:
superchunk said:
X360 * 2.5 = WiiU * 5 = Xbone * 1.5 = PS4

That's pretty much how I see it based on all the various specs. Of course if Xbone is downclocked... it might change a little.

In the end I don't think it will matter.

WiiU may get ignored just for being Nintendo and/or lack of DRM.
PS4/XB1 will have essentially identical 3rd party and that's over 90% of their games anyone cares about. WiiU's 3rd party ports will be close enough to not matter as well. Same game lower res/AA/etc.


XBone is about as powerful as PS4, and WiiU isn't that much more powerful then current gen consoles. Also PS4 is 9x more powerful then PS3, so if anything

X360 * 1.2 = PS3 * 1.4 = WiiU * 5.5 = XBOne * 1.15 = PS4.

dude, ate the very MAXIMUN, ps4 is 3x the wii u, with all 3 consoles being capable of all the modern effects and tools.

Maybe, I might be underspecing Wii U. How many GFLOPS can it push? From what I read Wii U is between 350-530GFLOPS. So at the minimum, PS4 with 1.84 GFLOPS is 3.5x as powerful as the Wii U. At a maximum it's 5x as powerful.

Also this would put Wii U at 1.5 to 2x as powerful as the PS3, so WiiU is still closer to PS3 then PS4.

bolded: those are imaginary numbers, people who looked the inside of wii u saw a slight similarity with a certain gpu and haters quickly spread that wii u used that gpu and had that low flop number. even though everybody knows it's a highly custom made gpu that share similarities with many others.

Either way, even if that difference were true, it would still be many times smaller than wii vs ps360, with wii u having modern architeture like the others and at a time where graphics are getting stagnant.



Alby_da_Wolf on 18 June 2013
Conegamer said:
So Wii U not far off the Xbone?


Close enough to bone it.   



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Michael-5 on 18 June 2013
Zero999 said:
Michael-5 said:

Maybe, I might be underspecing Wii U. How many GFLOPS can it push? From what I read Wii U is between 350-530GFLOPS. So at the minimum, PS4 with 1.84 GFLOPS is 3.5x as powerful as the Wii U. At a maximum it's 5x as powerful.

Also this would put Wii U at 1.5 to 2x as powerful as the PS3, so WiiU is still closer to PS3 then PS4.

bolded: those are imaginary numbers, people who looked the inside of wii u saw a slight similarity with a certain gpu and haters quickly spread that wii u used that gpu and had that low flop number. even though everybody knows it's a highly custom made gpu that share similarities with many others.

Either way, even if that difference were true, it would still be many times smaller than wii vs ps360, with wii u having modern architeture like the others and at a time where graphics are getting stagnant.

I agree, Wii U for instance can support 1080p, 60 FPS for games that look pretty damn good (Pikmin, X, even Super Mario 3D World). There might not be a lot going on in SM3DW, but the resolution and fluidity of the gameplay is significantly out of the reach of PS360.

Wii couldn't even do HD, where Wii U is on equal footing to PS4/Nextbox in terms of resolution.



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tuscaniman99 on 18 June 2013

At this point I don't really care. PS4 may be more powerful but from what I saw out of Ryse and Forza 5 I know that Xbox One can push out great looking graphics. I'm more worried about the quality of the exclusives. Most of the multiplats I'm getting on PC anyways which is > all. The WiiU is looking pretty good lately too.