re: soooo far off the mark its funny.

I am not saying the plan to push hardware more going forward is a good idea or not- but I do not think Balmer is the guy to do it. MSFT has gone from near monopoly to playing catch up in virtually every major area they do business at the very least msft needs a fresh coat of paint

I see. Then again isn't the falling % possibly due to MS losing ground and not due to the other products gaining ground? This could be a stupid question so tread lightly.

In a breakdown dirtyP gave me in the last thread we spoke in, the Windows division made 50% of the operating income. I understand it had 25% of revenue, but I think profit is the more relevant figure here wouldn't you agree?

God...the shareholders are going to be soooooooo pissed. LOL Balmer is like Anti-shareholder.

Actually MS was a hardware producer for a *very* long time but mostly peripherals. Mice, keyboards, even gamepads! I still have this:

And the peripherals were always of good quality and quite successful.

Can't wait for the next shareholder meeting they show that gets documented. This is going to be a great read hearing old people say "screw your aspirations, focus on beating apple on PC!"

Makes sense . In other words once costs are amortized over time the profits will start reeling in. Do we know how long these other revenue streams have been open for? For example I know that Azure is new, and the Server and Tools division nearly equaled the Windows division in revenue (which is quite the feat), but what about the Online Services Division, how new is that, what is it about and what causes it to be 1.4k in the red?

The thing I was wondering though is, what about the competitors in the Windows division and what is MS' relative growth in the market compared to its competitors and to the industry as a whole?

In the end I think you see the answers to those questions and that's why you initially answered that it's a bit of both defensive and offensive, but it does help to understand it all and when you actually take the time to look into it it isn't hauntingly complex.

In general, Microsoft has most often delved into the perpherials market, such as mice, keyboards, joysticks, gamepads, headsets, cameras, and home networking equipment.  The latter is the only one it fully dropped out of.

The original Xbox was the first true consumer electronics device Microsoft created.  The only other two consumer electronics devices it has since created are the Zune and the Surface (tablets).

But before most, if not all of that, Microsoft was the company behind one of the most popular computers in Japan.  The MSX-compatible.   While they didn't manufacture the hardware, they were the company that created the design standard for the MSX and for which companies around the globe created and sold computers for. 

It's not that complex.

MS has always been a strong player when it comes to enterprise software but they have been super aggressive over the last few years. They want businesses to be on the FULL MS STACK for just about every aspect of their business (IT related ovviously). They are killing guys like oracle, IBM etc. They are also in a similar position with Azure...mix in their enterprise offerings and they are in a completely dominating position when it comes to business and rapidly expanding that lead.

This is where Windows as a consumer OS doesnt really have the same importance as it use to have.  And its not like Windows is doing bad....Apple is just growing faster here (i think?) but then again Apple isnt very big when it comes to marketshare with consumer OS and are nowhere at enterprise level.

So yeah i think what Kowen is trying to say is that MS are actually in a very strong position and this might not be obvious to most people who usually only follow consumer trends and not the big picture.

If MS decides to take things seriously in the areas they have been experimenting with lately they will probably be a force to reckon with. Couple that with a complete domination in just about every other thing they involved in and well yeah you get the picture.

An excellent and relevant blog post on Microsoft's OS share:

http://www.asymco.com/2013/06/03/forecasting-windows-market-share/

Short version:

- Microsoft's share of the PC OS market has collapsed from 95% to 60% in just three years.

- This isn't dooooooom for Windows, as they will almost certainly hold onto enough users (especially lucrative enterprise customers) to remain viable for both developers and end users.

But as Mark Shuttleworth noted earlier this week, Microsoft's monopoly is now broken. That puts Microsoft is a less comfortable position, which is why we're seeing big gambles from the company again in products like Windows 8/RT and Surface, and why they're restructuring to improve execution on consumer products. Seems like a good thing to me, but Microsoft shareholders might have been more happy with a rent-taking monopolist.

Thanks Shinobi-San