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Forums - Gaming Discussion - PS4 has "50% more raw power" in graphics than Xbox One, says report

Zappykins said:
Yes, but 50% isn't all that noticeable. Might not matter at all in the real world. Even the WiiU is less and that might not matter either.

Neither one are where I think they should be - should be 2.5Tflops or close to it. This gen GPU's are a disappoint.

But it's what you can do with your tools not the size. And both Halo 4 and Uncharted 3 have shown you can make fine looking games on the old hardware.

no, those are amazing looking games. people have to understand that the existance of something superior doesn't change how good the rest look. example:

star fox/alone in the dark = crap 3d graphics        PS games = bad/moderate 3d graphics    N64= moderate 3d graphics

GC/PS2/XBOX= very good 3d graphics           ps360= amazing 3d graphics         Wii U/PS4/XONE= excellent/perfect 3d graphics

the 8th gen being better looking won't change how amazing the 7th looks.



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fillet said:
Scoobes said:
sales2099 said:
michael_stutzer said:
sales2099 said:
Wasn't PS3 being boasted for similar things?

In the end, because multiplats are the bulk of libraries, they will be made to tailer to Xbox and PS4, and they will be made as equal as possible.

Only exclusives can set them apart, but I suspect even then the graphics gap will be minimal.

Keep telling yourself that. Ps3 had a significantly worse GPU. Look at the graphical differences in exclusive games. Here there is a 50% power  difference. 50% I tell you.

Sorry but this is "teh cell" talk all over again.

On paper /= real application.

It's not. Both consoles use the same architecture for both the CPU and GPU.

We can make a direct comparison between the GPUs unlike the 360 vs PS3 which had different architectures for both CPU and GPU. Multiplats will likely have a combination of better resolution, greater tessellation, more shader effects, more physics, better lighting etc. It'll be like the difference between Medium and High settings on a PC game.


Started well.

Possibly...but a very big possibly not at this point.

Why wouldn't they? The only possible reason is for parity between different versions, but not every developer or publisher will do that when it costs virtually nothing to up a few effects; they already have to do this for different PC setups.



CGI-Quality said:
Zappykins said:
Yes, but 50% isn't all that noticeable. Might not matter at all in the real world. Even the WiiU is less and that might not matter either.

Neither one are where I think they should be - should be 2.5Tflops or close to it. This gen GPU's are a disappoint.

But it's what you can do with your tools not the size. And both Halo 4 and Uncharted 3 have shown you can make fine looking games on the old hardware.

As I asked you in a different topic, why 2.5TFLOPS, specifically? 

Oh, I didn't realize that was what you were asking.  I see, yes there is a very specific reason I keep quoting that number.  It is because it is specifically what was asked for by developer Tim Sweeney.  He is the developer of the new Unreal Engine 4 and specifically showed that on the Samaritan demo.  The Unreal Engine is one of the most significant developmental tools.

I was hoping they would give one of the most significant developers exactly what they wanted.  We already know that WiiU will not be able to run a full Unreal Engine 4.  And the PS4 had some issue with it's demo.  As I am of the opinion this would be the target for development, then things would get lowered down to different platforms.  I think it will effect the level for most PC games as well.  So I wanted the ‘bar’ set high.

Also, Microsoft boosted the memory on the Xbox 360 because of his pushing for more RAM.  He wanted 10x the power of the X360. I was really hoping they would try to make him happy again, but they opted for only approximately half the GPU power in the Xbox One.  

The reason I wanted 2.5Tflops was to make that the new 'best of', as that standard will effect so many other games.

Here is more info about it:  http://www.tomshardware.com/news/UE3-UE4-Samaritan-Tim-Sweeney-Mark-Rein,14698.html

Partial of games using Unreal Engine (Everyone uses it):  Devil May Cry, Gears of War, Mass Effect 3, Sorcery, Kinect Adventures, Transformers: War for Cybertron, Yaiba: Ninja Gaiden Z, etc.



 

Really not sure I see any point of Consol over PC's since Kinect, Wii and other alternative ways to play have been abandoned. 

Top 50 'most fun' game list coming soon!

 

Tell me a funny joke!

CGI-Quality said:

Ah, I gotcha now.

Sorry for being snippy before, sometimes I forget we all come from our own reference point.  I was disappointed neither platform met his request.

But then perhaps that is why he ask for so much.  He was saying later, last year, that it didn't quite need to be so high with optimization.  But I think it might have been because the already knew they weren't going to hit his mark.



 

Really not sure I see any point of Consol over PC's since Kinect, Wii and other alternative ways to play have been abandoned. 

Top 50 'most fun' game list coming soon!

 

Tell me a funny joke!

sales2099 said:
michael_stutzer said:
sales2099 said:
Wasn't PS3 being boasted for similar things?

In the end, because multiplats are the bulk of libraries, they will be made to tailer to Xbox and PS4, and they will be made as equal as possible.

Only exclusives can set them apart, but I suspect even then the graphics gap will be minimal.

Keep telling yourself that. Ps3 had a significantly worse GPU. Look at the graphical differences in exclusive games. Here there is a 50% power  difference. 50% I tell you.

Sorry but this is "teh cell" talk all over again.

On paper /= real application.


Hmm no its a fundamentally different situation this time. PS4 is superior in everything. 

There will be no PS3x360 gap. The PS3 was not better in everything and has a sucky memory design. Getting it to perform was hard and bottlenecks everywhere unified Ram was a very smart decision for MS.

 

PS4 and Xbone are identical. Same tech same manufacturer. PS4 and Xbone are directly comparable the difference is just that PS4 has 1152 Steamingcores Xbone has 768. PS4 has 32 Rops Xbone has 16. PS4 has 7gb Ram GDDR5 and Xbone 5GB DDR3 +32 Esram.

 

It is no contest. The difference will be there always. No additional super optimization necessary. Since its basically PC style development Devs simply can make the PC a priority and treat the PS4 like a PC on high settings and Xbone on middle.

 



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Zero999 said:
HoloDust said:

I think in theory WiiU could get much more support - then again (I posted this in some other thread) I think it's really the combination of 2 separate problems with 3rd party support and WiiU - first being user base, and second being weak hardware. Later cannot be changed (unfortunately), otherwise I believe we would most certainly see way more support no matter the user base, but I'm not sure that problem number 1 will (or could) be fixed any time soon.

As for development, the way things look now, I'm not so certain One will be lead platform...unlike current gen where 360 had more or less the same power as PS3, but was much easier to work with, PS4 seems to have quite a bit more power that can be easily tapped...and devs seems to like it a lot.

ps4 and one's userbase is 0 right now. and weaker than competition =/= weak.

Its not actually the size of user base I was referring to, but rather their buying habits. As Wii has shown, you can put CoD on it, but still, no matter the huge user base, it will sell only small fraction of what it sold on platforms that have user bases that are, though smaller, actually interested in buying those type of titles.

That's where 2nd problems kicks in - WiiU's hardware is much, much, much closer to PS360 than to XOne/PS4, and for the next-gen standards that is really weak. If WiiU performed (as some were hoping for way back in a day, myself included) at the level of HD4850-4870 (or equivalent), most 3rd parties would have no problems porting easily to it, no matter the user base.



Just to clarify the difference in gpu power between the Xbox One and PS4 is the exact difference between running a game at 720P(hd-ready) or 1080P(full hd) with the same settings. You can check HD7770 vs HD7850 benchmarks for this(though the difference between Xbox One and PS4 is slightly larger).

So my expectation is that developers will simply lower the resolution for multi-platform titles.



HoloDust said:
Zero999 said:
HoloDust said:

I think in theory WiiU could get much more support - then again (I posted this in some other thread) I think it's really the combination of 2 separate problems with 3rd party support and WiiU - first being user base, and second being weak hardware. Later cannot be changed (unfortunately), otherwise I believe we would most certainly see way more support no matter the user base, but I'm not sure that problem number 1 will (or could) be fixed any time soon.

As for development, the way things look now, I'm not so certain One will be lead platform...unlike current gen where 360 had more or less the same power as PS3, but was much easier to work with, PS4 seems to have quite a bit more power that can be easily tapped...and devs seems to like it a lot.

ps4 and one's userbase is 0 right now. and weaker than competition =/= weak.

Its not actually the size of user base I was referring to, but rather their buying habits. As Wii has shown, you can put CoD on it, but still, no matter the huge user base, it will sell only small fraction of what it sold on platforms that have user bases that are, though smaller, actually interested in buying those type of titles.

That's where 2nd problems kicks in - WiiU's hardware is much, much, much closer to PS360 than to XOne/PS4, and for the next-gen standards that is really weak. If WiiU performed (as some were hoping for way back in a day, myself included) at the level of HD4850-4870 (or equivalent), most 3rd parties would have no problems porting easily to it, no matter the user base.

bolded one:You can't expect a crappy port to sell the same as the other versions. the wii ports were just too bellow.

bolded 2: wrong. and also, even if wii u hardware was exactly like the ps360, the difference would be far smaller than wii vs ps360. third party's won't have problems to port, hardware wise.



Zero999 said:
HoloDust said:

Its not actually the size of user base I was referring to, but rather their buying habits. As Wii has shown, you can put CoD on it, but still, no matter the huge user base, it will sell only small fraction of what it sold on platforms that have user bases that are, though smaller, actually interested in buying those type of titles.

That's where 2nd problems kicks in - WiiU's hardware is much, much, much closer to PS360 than to XOne/PS4, and for the next-gen standards that is really weak. If WiiU performed (as some were hoping for way back in a day, myself included) at the level of HD4850-4870 (or equivalent), most 3rd parties would have no problems porting easily to it, no matter the user base.

bolded one:You can't expect a crappy port to sell the same as the other versions. the wii ports were just too bellow.

bolded 2: wrong. and also, even if wii u hardware was exactly like the ps360, the difference would be far smaller than wii vs ps360. third party's won't have problems to port, hardware wise.

As things stand now, XOne is some 5-6x WiiU (and 8x 360 as confirmed by MS), and PS4 8-9x, and that's if WiiU's GPU is indeed 320 shader part, and not 160 as some suggest. But, sure, whatever makes you happy.



HoloDust said:
Zero999 said:
HoloDust said:

Its not actually the size of user base I was referring to, but rather their buying habits. As Wii has shown, you can put CoD on it, but still, no matter the huge user base, it will sell only small fraction of what it sold on platforms that have user bases that are, though smaller, actually interested in buying those type of titles.

That's where 2nd problems kicks in - WiiU's hardware is much, much, much closer to PS360 than to XOne/PS4, and for the next-gen standards that is really weak. If WiiU performed (as some were hoping for way back in a day, myself included) at the level of HD4850-4870 (or equivalent), most 3rd parties would have no problems porting easily to it, no matter the user base.

bolded one:You can't expect a crappy port to sell the same as the other versions. the wii ports were just too bellow.

bolded 2: wrong. and also, even if wii u hardware was exactly like the ps360, the difference would be far smaller than wii vs ps360. third party's won't have problems to port, hardware wise.

As things stand now, XOne is some 5-6x WiiU (and 8x 360 as confirmed by MS), and PS4 8-9x, and that's if WiiU's GPU is indeed 320 shader part, and not 160 as some suggest. But, sure, whatever makes you happy.

It better not be because then they might aswell have made it a real tablet.