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Forums - Sales - Will the PS4 outsell the XBox One and WiiU?

Although now that I think of it, the 360 / ps3 were a little more evenly matched with the Wii pretty far behind.

If the Wii U --- nextbox --- ps4 are a little more staggered power wise, it could be interesting for the Wii U if the Xbox becomes the "starting point" for multiplats. Less of a gap in HW performance would be a good thing for nintendo.



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goopy20 said:

Yes everybody expects a console that comes out 6 years late to the party to be next gen. When they revealed the Wii U at E3 I expected nothing less then all ps3/ 360 games looking like crap in comparison to the "next gen" graphics of the Wii U. Even a launch title like Zombi U should have wowed me but it looked kinda meh and definetly not a upgrade to what we seen before on 6 year old hardware.

There is just no such thing as a console designed as a native 720p machine if it could actually handle 1080p. Lots of current gen ports were announced as 1080p native titles but got downscaled to 720p already. That alone should tell you that the Wii U is not really next gen material. I am sure it's more powerfull then current gen consoles but developers really need to dig deep to get a result that most people won't even notice. Just look at NFS Most Wanted where Criterion really put in the work to make a superior Wii U version. If developers really need to put in so much work then they'll probably not bother, just like with the ps3 (which has a huge installbase to ignore). If developers have problems now, then what will happen when MS/ Sony come out with an easy-to-develop-for platform and 6 times the power? 

Frost Bite 3 has never been running on WiiU. We did some tests with not too promising results with FB2 & chose not to go down that path.

bolded 1: even the ps4 games don't come even close to making ps360 look like crap, because as i stated before, this will never be possible.

bolded 2: so much work? criterion put some work, unlike many who weren't even trying.

bolded 3: who's having problems? the system is easy to develop for and can get a small to moderately downscaled varsion of the not much more powerful ps4/nextbox. saying those consoles are 6x the ps360 is ok. 6x the wii u is just delusional.

 p.s: if you believe that FB2 statement, no one will take you seriously.





g911turbo said:
snowdog said:
There most certainly is such a thing as a console designed from the ground up to be a 720p machine. The 32MB eDRAM and 2MB SRAM on die for Latte are exactly the right size for a 720p native frame buffer.

You really need to check out the Latte thread on Gaf.

A game for the PS4 and 720 that's 1080p native will need only half the processing power when ported to the Wii U in 720p native. And that's before you take less AA, less impressive lighting, less impressive particle effects, more pop-in, less draw distance and longer loading times into account.

Some of you seem to be convinced that we're going to have another Wii/PS3/360 situation this gen when this is simply not the case. The hardware currently doesn't exist to make this possible for a console yet unless you want a console the size of a small house, with a fan over 100Db that's going to cost over a grand lol.

If a console has a big enough installed userbase publishers will always have developers coding for the lowest common denominator. The only thing stopping that last gen with the Wii was that the console had a nonstandard rendering pipeline.

The lowest common demoniator might be the nextXbox though, assuming it is less powerful than the PS4.  It does help the Wii U's cause a little bit if the next box is even less powerful than the PS4, but it doesn't necessarily guarantee ports.

Certainly doesn hurt though.

 

i don't think ps4 will be the lead platform, but even if it is i won't be a problem to port to wii u.



One thing that's going to really help the Wii U is Nintendo's surprisingly forward thinking with their choice of architecture. It's going to be easier to port between the Wii U/PS4/720 than it currently is to port between the Wii U/PS3/360. The architecture of both the PS3 and the 360 is a bit odd with floating point work being done by the CPU rather than the GPU, and this generation we're going back to normal with the floating point work being done by the GPU.

Developers are also going to be greatly helped by both the Wii U and 720's memory setups being virtually identical. I really can't understand why Sony didn't go the same route tbh. They would have ended up with 8GB of RAM with much lower latency and using less chips making the motherboard a hell of a lot cheaper to produce as well as the RAM chips themselves being cheaper.

Another thing going in the Wii U's favour as far as development is concerned is that any interaction between the CPU and GPU is going to be lightning fast.



snowdog said:
There most certainly is such a thing as a console designed from the ground up to be a 720p machine. The 32MB eDRAM and 2MB SRAM on die for Latte are exactly the right size for a 720p native frame buffer.

You really need to check out the Latte thread on Gaf.

A game for the PS4 and 720 that's 1080p native will need only half the processing power when ported to the Wii U in 720p native. And that's before you take less AA, less impressive lighting, less impressive particle effects, more pop-in, less draw distance and longer loading times into account.

Some of you seem to be convinced that we're going to have another Wii/PS3/360 situation this gen when this is simply not the case. The hardware currently doesn't exist to make this possible for a console yet unless you want a console the size of a small house, with a fan over 100Db that's going to cost over a grand lol.

If a console has a big enough installed userbase publishers will always have developers coding for the lowest common denominator. The only thing stopping that last gen with the Wii was that the console had a nonstandard rendering pipeline.

What you are describing sure sounds like another Wii/PS3/360 situation to me. Why would any core gamer want to play their favorite franchises in a: lower res, with less AA, less impressive lighting, less impressive particle effects, more pop-in and longer loading time? That sounds horrible lol.

You also keep forgetting how the Wii did get some of the big core franchise. They just didn't really sell and eventually developers stopped trying on the Wii, even if the 70m installbase was hard to ignore. Nobody bought a Wii U because they want to play next gen FPS games, they bought it for Mario, Just Dance and Wii Sports. That is why core game developers will use the next gen consoles as the main platform and not the lowest common denominator. 

 




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There wasn't a single port of a major core franchise. All that it had was gimped versions developed separately. No Elder Scrolls, no Fallout, no Dead Space, no Bioshock etc etc.

The Guitar Hero and Call of Duty franchises were the only major core franchises that Wii owners saw, and with the exception of the last CoD they all did well. But those games were a completely separate SKU developed independent from the others.

And as I've already stated when I started posting in this thread your Mr Average Joe won't be able to tell the difference between the Wii U, PS4 and 720 versions of games unless viewed side by side. Your average gamer is pretty dim tbh lol.



Zero999 said:
goopy20 said:

Yes everybody expects a console that comes out 6 years late to the party to be next gen. When they revealed the Wii U at E3 I expected nothing less then all ps3/ 360 games looking like crap in comparison to the "next gen" graphics of the Wii U. Even a launch title like Zombi U should have wowed me but it looked kinda meh and definetly not a upgrade to what we seen before on 6 year old hardware.

There is just no such thing as a console designed as a native 720p machine if it could actually handle 1080p. Lots of current gen ports were announced as 1080p native titles but got downscaled to 720p already. That alone should tell you that the Wii U is not really next gen material. I am sure it's more powerfull then current gen consoles but developers really need to dig deep to get a result that most people won't even notice. Just look at NFS Most Wanted where Criterion really put in the work to make a superior Wii U version. If developers really need to put in so much work then they'll probably not bother, just like with the ps3 (which has a huge installbase to ignore). If developers have problems now, then what will happen when MS/ Sony come out with an easy-to-develop-for platform and 6 times the power? 

Frost Bite 3 has never been running on WiiU. We did some tests with not too promising results with FB2 & chose not to go down that path.

bolded 1: even the ps4 games don't come even close to making ps360 look like crap, because as i stated before, this will never be possible.

bolded 2: so much work? criterion put some work, unlike many who weren't even trying.

bolded 3: who's having problems? the system is easy to develop for and can get a small to moderately downscaled varsion of the not much more powerful ps4/nextbox. saying those consoles are 6x the ps360 is ok. 6x the wii u is just delusional.

 p.s: if you believe that FB2 statement, no one will take you seriously.



Off course next gen games will make 360 games look like crap in comparison dude. Why would they even build a new console if it wouldn't?

Not many pictures of true next gen games out there, but if it's real then a comparable game on ps4 defintely makes a 360 game look like a pile of poo.



snowdog said:
There wasn't a single port of a major core franchise. All that it had was gimped versions developed separately. No Elder Scrolls, no Fallout, no Dead Space, no Bioshock etc etc.

The Guitar Hero and Call of Duty franchises were the only major core franchises that Wii owners saw, and with the exception of the last CoD they all did well. But those games were a completely separate SKU developed independent from the others.

And as I've already stated when I started posting in this thread your Mr Average Joe won't be able to tell the difference between the Wii U, PS4 and 720 versions of games unless viewed side by side. Your average gamer is pretty dim tbh lol.

Ok, they were gimped version, but what do you call a game with: " lower res, with less AA, less impressive lighting, less impressive particle effects, more pop-in and longer loading time?"

The drop from 1080p to 720p alone is enough for core gamers to ignore the wii version and even my half blind grandmother can see the difference between 720p and 1080p. For a while the 360 was winning this console generation because people were buying it's "superior versions" of multiplatform games on their platform. This wasn't due to a big difference in resolution, it was because of differences that most people can't even see with the naked eye.

Like I said, even if the Wii U gets the next-gen multiplatform games, people still wouldn't care and it won't help the Wii U sell more then the 30k a week that it's currently selling. All it will do is show the whole world that it can't handle next gen titles, unless off course they get gimped to some weak sauce version that will make my granny's eyes hurt. 



I meant gimped in terms of content, not due to a lack of power but due to a whole new game in its entirety being built from the ground up for the Wii.

As for the difference between 720p and 1080p native, perhaps you personally may be able to tell the difference but the majority of people won't due to the majority of people not having the correct viewing distance between their seats and the screen even before you take into account that the Wii U's GPU will upscale the images anyway.

The difference in IQ between Wii U multiplatform titles and PS4/720 multiplatform titles should be equivalent to the difference in quality between PC Medium settings and PC High and Very High settings. They're not going to look like GameCube/Wii games compared to PS3 and 360 games, nowhere near.

We're going to get a taster of what sort of IQ that Latte is capable of when we see the likes of 3D Mario, Mario Kart 8, more of X and Retro's new game, and these will still be first generation titles. We still don't know what around a third of the GPU does and what we do 'know' is pure guesswork from the GPU die shot very kindly released by Chipworks.

I'm of the opinion that Nintendo have evolved the fixed functions that Flipper and Hollywood had so that they can be used whilst keeping the pipeline standard so that these fixed functions can be implemented into engines such as Unreal, CryEngine etc.

You've also got to remember that the pipelines for both the CPU and GPU are quite short so any instructions can be carried out quicker than those of the other consoles. Those of you that are technically minded really should check out the Latte thread on Gaf, you'll find it very interesting.



PS4 will be around twice as powerful as the XBox 720. PS4 will be 3 or 4 times more powerful than the Wii U. 8th generation repeating the 7th generation in terms of specifications but PS4 should be able to blow the XBox 720 and Wii U out of the water in regards to consoles sales.