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Forums - Gaming Discussion - The real reason why 3rd party games do not sell well on Nintendo hardware

fordy on 02 March 2013
M.U.G.E.N said:

haha man you are a hoot! Is this like a mini meltdown or something?

First off, no I don't jump to offer an opinion on every thread or against everyone I disagree with. Do you always overreact and have mini meltdowns even without properly understanding other people?

I see that you still don't understand my point. Let me put it this way to you....my point is that it IS subjective. That itself is a fact. The OP is ignoring this. Using a superiority complex as the reason for 3rd party support etc is laughable at best. It definitely is an attempt to damage control. How about you listen to my advice and google any term you don't understand clearly. You can have your cake...and actually know it's a cake and stop ranting how I think it's not a cake when I never said so! 

Now I am in the mood for some cake mmmm


Yeah, so..

THEM: "Nintendo games are great"

YOU: "Well that's completely subjective opinion"

THEM: "..better than 3rd party quality"

YOU: "OMG HOW DARE YOU! YOU'RE JUST SAYING THAT FOR DAMAGE CONTROL!"

 

Yeah....I think I was pretty much on the ball there. You're cherry picking at what you want to interpret as subjective opinion.



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d21lewis on 02 March 2013

Nintendo gamers don't have money because they are seven years old.

/thread.



M.U.G.E.N on 02 March 2013
fordy said:
M.U.G.E.N said:

haha man you are a hoot! Is this like a mini meltdown or something?

First off, no I don't jump to offer an opinion on every thread or against everyone I disagree with. Do you always overreact and have mini meltdowns even without properly understanding other people?

I see that you still don't understand my point. Let me put it this way to you....my point is that it IS subjective. That itself is a fact. The OP is ignoring this. Using a superiority complex as the reason for 3rd party support etc is laughable at best. It definitely is an attempt to damage control. How about you listen to my advice and google any term you don't understand clearly. You can have your cake...and actually know it's a cake and stop ranting how I think it's not a cake when I never said so! 

Now I am in the mood for some cake mmmm


Yeah, so..

THEM: "Nintendo games are great"

YOU: "Well that's completely subjective opinion"

THEM: "..better than 3rd party quality"

YOU: "OMG HOW DARE YOU! YOU'RE JUST SAYING THAT FOR DAMAGE CONTROL!"

 

Yeah....I think I was pretty much on the ball there. You're cherry picking at what you want to interpret as subjective opinion.


So much drama geez

let me put it in the same context as you did just now

'they' as in OP: First party ninty games are better than 3rd party games..they are also much better than other systems' first party offerings. This is why 3rd party games suffer

me: nope. Quality is a subjective matter and the OP is damage controlling despite saying he/she isn't. 

You: omfg how dare you! Let me rant on some random jibberish no one can understand easily blablabla

me: you are misunderstanding but please continue. It's funny

You just went 100% defend Nintendo honor mode and refuse to listen to reason. Not my problem. You question why I'm concerned when there was no indication that I was. You ask me why I care so much when I never said I did. You think nintendo fans don't care about 3rd party support...yet we hear constant bitching about the quality or the lack of 3rd party games on nintendo systems all the time. 

So make up your mind. Make a proper argument as to why you disagree with me and why you think the OP is right or wrong. 



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cyberninja45 on 02 March 2013
NightDragon83 said:
cyberninja45 said:
NightDragon83 said:
1: Nintendo games are always the best sellers on Nintendo consoles, though there are some exceptions.

2: Ever since the N64 days 3rd parties have halfheartedly supported Nintendo consoles, and many of the biggest 3rd party titles have been left off Nintendo consoles altogether during this time like MGS and GTA for example. And yes, I know MGS appeared on the GC as a port/remake of the first MGS, and GTA appeared on DS in Chinatown wars... not the same thing as having a flagship game in the series launch on a Nintendo console.

3: Nintendo themselves. Unlike Sony or M$ who have no problem sharing the spotlight with major 3rd parties and their software, Nintendo does not actively push or advertise major 3rd party games on their consoles. Sure, occasionally they'll throw gamers a bone like "rescuing" Bayonetta 2 from certain doom, and actually signing a deal for some exclusive 3rd party games like they did with Capcom during the GC era (most of which were promptly ported to PS2).

4: Nintendo's audience. This also ties in with #2, because while SEGA, Sony and M$ have all gone for older gamers, Nintendo has always targeted younger gamers and families. Not a bad thing back in the NES/SNES days, but a terrible business decision in today's market with the majority of gamers in their 20s and 30s and who constantly crave cutting edge technology and new and challenging gameplay experiences rather than the same-old that Nintendo continues to offer on their consoles.

So basically there's only one reason that 3rd party games don't sell well on Nintendo hardware... and that reason is Nintendo.

1. This goes with my point that most nintendo games are high quality games.

2. This is the same as my point that most 3rd party games are either terrible or cash grabs.

3. Because MS and Sony need the 3rd party games to sell their consoles so they will promote them on alot, ps360 would not sell on 1st party alone.

4. Yes nintendo does cater to a wider audience.But do you think the gamers that buy metroid, zelda and xenoblade are children 7 and under or families?

No... which is why 2 out of 3 of those series have absolutely abysmal sales compared to the more casual offerings on Wii.  Prime 3, one of the best games on the Wii, couldn't even crack 2 mil, and Xenoblade, arguably one of the best games this gen period, can't even top just 1m WW on a system that has an install base of nearly 100m.  In comparison, a 3rd party "cash grab" like Just Dance 3 has nearly 10m in sales... which means at minimum 1/10 households with a Wii has Just Dance 3.

Even Zelda doesn't have the selling power it once did... Skyward Sword has done just 3.6m over the past 15 months, again, on a console with nearly 100m units WW.  In comparison, Skyrim sold more than double that in the same time on the 360 alone.  Ironically enough though, the 360's "top selling game" is the Kinect pack-in Kinect Adventures... which proves that the causual audience (which makes up about 90% of Nintendo's current userbase judging by sales) will buy anything that comes with a plastic peripheral.


Metriod has always been a niche title so those sales are expected for the game. Xenoblade was released when the console was already dying so interest in games for wii were going with it, not to mention that game was reluctantly released  in NA so most gamers who wanted to play the game probably just pirated it.

As for zelda again when the console was dying but SS also had a bigger problem it used the motion+ which was not sold with the game so the users that could actually play game was much smaller than 100m.

What about my other points?



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fordy on 02 March 2013
M.U.G.E.N said:
fordy said:
M.U.G.E.N said:

haha man you are a hoot! Is this like a mini meltdown or something?

First off, no I don't jump to offer an opinion on every thread or against everyone I disagree with. Do you always overreact and have mini meltdowns even without properly understanding other people?

I see that you still don't understand my point. Let me put it this way to you....my point is that it IS subjective. That itself is a fact. The OP is ignoring this. Using a superiority complex as the reason for 3rd party support etc is laughable at best. It definitely is an attempt to damage control. How about you listen to my advice and google any term you don't understand clearly. You can have your cake...and actually know it's a cake and stop ranting how I think it's not a cake when I never said so! 

Now I am in the mood for some cake mmmm


Yeah, so..

THEM: "Nintendo games are great"

YOU: "Well that's completely subjective opinion"

THEM: "..better than 3rd party quality"

YOU: "OMG HOW DARE YOU! YOU'RE JUST SAYING THAT FOR DAMAGE CONTROL!"

 

Yeah....I think I was pretty much on the ball there. You're cherry picking at what you want to interpret as subjective opinion.


So much drama geez

let me put it in the same context as you did just now

'they' as in OP: First party ninty games are better than 3rd party games..they are also much better than other systems' first party offerings. This is why 3rd party games suffer

me: nope. Quality is a subjective matter and the OP is damage controlling despite saying he/she isn't. 

You: omfg how dare you! Let me rant on some random jibberish no one can understand easily blablabla

me: you are misunderstanding but please continue. It's funny

You just went 100% defend Nintendo honor mode and refuse to listen to reason. Not my problem. You question why I'm concerned when there was no indication that I was. You ask me why I care so much when I never said I did. You think nintendo fans don't care about 3rd party support...yet we hear constant bitching about the quality or the lack of 3rd party games on nintendo systems all the time. 

So make up your mind. Make a proper argument as to why you disagree with me and why you think the OP is right or wrong. 


It seems liek you're the only one having trouble understanding here. Of course, that's why you're on a thread talking about Nintendo 3rd party and attempting to give your opinion despite only using the facts that appear to favour your argument.

For instance, you're basing the assumption on ANY attempts that 3rd parties have made in the past have been equal attempts made on other systems. Are you wanting to try and claim otherwise as fact? But you have to barge in and give your own uniformed opinion, don't you? For some reason the OP irked you that much and upset you that you had to respond to it, like it was some kind of insult drilling through your mind.

You want a lot of other people's opinion? Nintendo games ARE better quality than others on the market, hence why they buy Nintendo consoles. For some reason that seems to bother you immsensely. So sorry to hear...



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Jay520 on 02 March 2013

Does this mean games like Just Dance and Mario vs Sonic match the quality of Nintendo's first party?



d21lewis on 02 March 2013
Jay520 said:
Does this mean games like Just Dance and Mario vs Sonic match the quality of Nintendo's first party?


It's almost like I've seen this posted somewhere else.... It's like that movie Inception (I imagine.  I've never seen it.)



cyberninja45 on 02 March 2013
Jay520 said:
Does this mean games like Just Dance and Mario vs Sonic match the quality of Nintendo's first party?


No nintendo consoles also has a larger variety of audience on it, well at least the wii.



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Scoobes on 02 March 2013
cyberninja45 said:
Scoobes said:
Wow, confirmation bias and elitism in a single post, lol.

I disagree. Different audiences and market segments influence thrid-party sales rather than anything to do with actual game quality. Recent Nintendo consoles have sold predominantly to the wider audience as well as core Nintendo fans who will happily buy the next iteration of Mario or Zelda.

Funnily enough, third party games do sell on Nintendo consoles, just not in the genres traditionally associated with core gaming. On the Wii the likes of Just Dance, Zumba fitness, Lego: Star Wars, Carnival games, EA Sports active and Cooking Mama are all third party franchises that have sold millions. Like I said before, market segments influence third-party sales, not game quality.

@bolded So you are saying that there is no market for 3rd party sales on a nintendo console because they are a different market from the other console? So how does a game like RE4 (which is a high quality 3rd party game) manage to sell 2 mil copies on the wii if the market is not there?

Yes nintendo consoles do cater to a wider audience also.

It's present, but smaller compared to HD consoles + PC and less relevant from a publisher POV. When a publisher can produce a Just Dance game that sells >5 million and with a cheaper budget then a new RE, they're going to take that route.

Take shooters for instance. The Wii got a few shooters early in its life cycle (CoD3, a few Medal of Honors, Red Steel), but even with the marketing (especially for Red Steel), the lack of competition (especially as Nintendo don't have a traditional FPS- you seem to suggest this is why third party games don't sell, right?) and even with the rapidly expanding userbase the Wii had in its first 2 years, they were still low selling titles when comapred to the likes of Resistance or Gears of War.

Sales are still determined more by market segments than by the games quality. More importantly perhaps, the early sales on the Wii demonstrated that the audience was more heavily skewed towards party games and platformers with dance and fitness taking off a couple of years later. This is where third parties have had the most success.




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Pavolink on 02 March 2013
Jay520 said:
Does this mean games like Just Dance and Mario vs Sonic match the quality of Nintendo's first party?


Does Nintendo have a dance game or whatever genre is Mario and Sonic to compare those?



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