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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Nintendo should copy Sony

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Nintendo should

be more like Sony in gene... 35 19.55%
 
have at least one studio like Team Ico. 53 29.61%
 
not bother with the segment. 91 50.84%
 
Total:179
RolStoppable said:
happydolphin said:

The point, my friend, is simple.

When the Playstation home console is at its worst, it sells 67M units, when it's at its best, it sells 150M units.

When the Nintendo home console is at its worst, it sells 20M units, when it's at its best, it sells 96M units.

DO THE MATH.

When the PlayStation home console is at its worst, it loses $5 billion despite getting all the third party support.

When the Nintendo home console is at its worst, it is still profitable despite being shunned by third parties.

Now do the math. If Nintendo had decided to give away GameCubes for free after things went downhill, how many could they have given away, if they ran their business at a $5 billion loss?

$5 billion divided by $100 is 50 million.

It says this guy is a master troll, but he makes excellent points.

May i also point out to the PSVita as an example of Sony's worse? Less fandom and more logic pls. Busines is all about marketing and profitability.



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Veknoid_Outcast said:

I think this is a super exciting time to be a Nintendo fan, really a fan of video games in general. The Wii U will be an excellent system. The best since Super Nintendo I believe.

To answer your first question, I do believe exclusives are no longer the norm. But this only helps Nintendo I think. Their IPs are the strongest and most profitable, and no one on the face of the Earth can support them outside of Nintendo.

As far as the second question, there are many ways to make a game low-production and top-quality. The problem is this: while it's easy to define low-production, it's tough to define top-quality. There might be people on this site that hate Colossus (I hope not!) and love games you or I think are garbage.

In terms of Ico and Shadow of the Colossus...in many ways those games are one-of-a-kind and can probably never be recreated. What you're looking for, I think, are games that are minimalist yet immersive, short on story, text, and music, but long on emotion and ambiance. And those are truly rare. I suppose Braid could fall into that category.

Team Ico and Fumito Ueda are miracle workers. They discovered something special with those two games. We may never see something like them again. Until The Last Guardian, of course :)

@bold. Exactly. At least while Nintendo is making it a proof of concept and getting their feet wet. Also, the sales metric by which to define its success shouldn't be software sales, but the general excitement surrounding the console in the dedicated gamer space ,as well as the overall HW sales.

I too think it's an exciting time! As for Nintendo's IPs, they are good but the work Nintendo has been doing with them during years 2 onwards on the Wii has been lackluster. OP addresses that too. All in all the call in OP is for greater quality, greater emotion and greater immersion overall. Galaxy being a top-production game, lacked a bit of that emotion, that immersion (imho), though it was an excellent game. I just want to see perfect scores in my book for these top-production games from now on, not with one single thing lacking.



Nem said:

It says this guy is a master troll, but he makes excellent points.

May i also point out to the PSVita as an example of Sony's worse? Less fandom and more logic pls. Busines is all about marketing and profitability.

I wasn't talking about the Vita. It has alot going for it but alot that's causing it to sink. I specifically said ITT, leaving what is not working and taking notes from what works, Nintendo should learn some things from Sony. I also updated OP to show that Nintendo already is doing that, and that's a good thing.

Posts like these frustrate me, because they show that people read into some posts what they want to read. A change of attitude would be in order.



@ninetailschris.

Section regarding "Copy-Paste":

happyd:

ninetailschris:

But God I don't want to see a Uncharted nintendo just no. I don't want to see a movie with a character that looks copy and paste.

"Copy paste as in Copy-Paste of Indiana Jones? What about Golden Eye on 64 then that is pure copy-paste of James Bond?? Please explain."

Please read my questions and please explain.

 

Section regarding "Xenoblade" and its business purpose:

ninetailschris:

Already answered the "Xenoblade" I said it was great but it's not a system seller. That's fact.

[HD] "Would you recommend the same thing to Monolith before they set out to make it"

Recommend to person and saying Nintendo needs it to have sucess to different things. If nintendo never released the game it would have done nothing to the wii.

[HD] "Another important question, do you believe that even though a game doesn't sell insanely, that it still bring support value to the console so it can in turn sell more HW-dependent SW (like Mario Kart, see my post above to Mr Khan)?"

Most people who bought Xenoblade already owned a wii and mostly were Nintendo fans who bought games Nintendo trademark games like Zelda. 

So, Xenoblade was useless from a business perspective and should not be encouraged by an advisor, if you were to suggest something to Nintendo. Do I understand this correctly?

 

Section regarding "Putting down the controller":

"@underlined. Do you realize there are people who like [putting down the controller to watch a cutscene (esp. if it's good)]? Do you realize SotC barely has cinematics and is almost all in-game epicness?"

I was talking about God of War or Uncharted.  If you look you see I meation them not SOTC. Looking forward to new mario looks like there trying to bring back the feel of SMB Land. 

@bold. Okay, I was just making sure you were aware that the argument didn't apply to SotC.

Also, I was hoping you would answer underlined.



ninetailschris said:
selnor said:
I think people give to much credit to ALL of Sonys exclusives.

Personally on PS3 the games that really shine and impress me are God Of War 3 and Ratchet And Clank.

To be honest Uncharted is good. Not great just good. For example I think Max Payne 3 which is just like Uncharted 2 or 3 is better than Uncharted. Only difference is the climbing in Uncharted, which could be taken out as it is linear and pointless. Uncharteds platfroming bits are pretty much a joke.

Killzone is a very average franchise just worth a go, but noting to write home about. And GT died at the start of the gen. Its competition raising the bar to high for them.

Anyway, I dunno bout Nintendo these days. Their games NEVER appeal to me anymore. The last Zelda I played and finished was OOT on the GC version. So muc better than Windwaker in fact I never finished Windwaker.

To be honest the PS3 is ok. I enjoyed a few games so far. But have been seriously surprised by the averageness of some of the games that people on forums go gaga over.

Theres better out there in the same genre imo.

You not liking a game doesn't make your opinion objective. The game was rank very good and many people love the game. 

I probably don't have the same taste as you seeing as your mostly a xbox fan if I remember correctly.



Nothing in videogames is fact my friend. And I didnt say  I was right.

Hence the imo at the end.

Also I love all genres. Being an Xbox fan does not mean we dont like the same games.



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RolStoppable said:

That's a long post about personal taste, so there isn't much to say about it. You like those Sony games you mentioned in the OP (although I am not sure if you really play Gran Turismo), you have your reasons for liking them and because of this you want Nintendo to make such games as well. I understand that. You've made similar threads in the past (about what you want from Nintendo).

But... let's stick to things that can be measured objectively. In your previous post you said this (emphasis: mine):

The WiiU strategy is not fail-proof. It will be missing the lion's share of exclusives in the category of darker games aimed at the segment unless something is done right to fix that. My assumption here is that the exclusives would be of higher quality. Also, apart from the AAA multi-plats in your post, some 3rd party multi-plat games lack depth. For instance many are pure violence and lack the depth and emotion of the games mentioned in OP (ie Serious Sam, Duke Nukem). Having only multiplats is not enough.

So I asked you what these exclusives are. You didn't answer.

I don't think it's fair to brush it off as personal taste, as many here claim that Nintendo has the best IPs, which is also based on personal taste then iiuc.

For the question, I remember you asking it I guess I must have missed it.

So, the way I see it, at the moment we have Bayonetta 2, DQX, MH3U, ZombiU, Rayman Legends, Wonderful101 and whatever I'm forgetting. It's a good start I guess. So, I'll take that back. Your point Rol.

Edit: The remaining question is, is this enough to prop up the prestige of the WiiU? Possibly. Would adding some 1st party games to the mix with the qualities (properties) of the games in OP help prop up the console's prestige? Definitely, but by how much, we don't know since the U has yet to launch. However as a Nintendo fan that is what I would like, because I know it's something they're capable of. Anything that will make them stronger and make games that a wider variety of people would like is a good thing. And oddly enough the minority of gamers that like the games I do are pretty vocal and contribute to important word of mouth (negative and positive).

@GT. I played the 3rd one mostly and really liked it. I would recommend the series to any prospective buyer.



happydolphin said:

@ninetailschris.

Section regarding "Copy-Paste":

happyd:

ninetailschris:

But God I don't want to see a Uncharted nintendo just no. I don't want to see a movie with a character that looks copy and paste.

"Copy paste as in Copy-Paste of Indiana Jones? What about Golden Eye on 64 then that is pure copy-paste of James Bond?? Please explain."

Please read my questions and please explain.

 

Section regarding "Xenoblade" and its business purpose:

ninetailschris:

Already answered the "Xenoblade" I said it was great but it's not a system seller. That's fact.

[HD] "Would you recommend the same thing to Monolith before they set out to make it"

Recommend to person and saying Nintendo needs it to have sucess to different things. If nintendo never released the game it would have done nothing to the wii.

[HD] "Another important question, do you believe that even though a game doesn't sell insanely, that it still bring support value to the console so it can in turn sell more HW-dependent SW (like Mario Kart, see my post above to Mr Khan)?"

Most people who bought Xenoblade already owned a wii and mostly were Nintendo fans who bought games Nintendo trademark games like Zelda. 

So, Xenoblade was useless from a business perspective and should not be encouraged by an advisor, if you were to suggest something to Nintendo. Do I understand this correctly?

 

Section regarding "Putting down the controller":

"@underlined. Do you realize there are people who like [putting down the controller to watch a cutscene (esp. if it's good)]? Do you realize SotC barely has cinematics and is almost all in-game epicness?"

I was talking about God of War or Uncharted.  If you look you see I meation them not SOTC. Looking forward to new mario looks like there trying to bring back the feel of SMB Land. 

@bold. Okay, I was just making sure you were aware that the argument didn't apply to SotC.

Also, I was hoping you would answer underlined.

" "Copy paste as in Copy-Paste of Indiana Jones? What about Golden Eye on 64 then that is pure copy-paste of James Bond?? Please explain." "

The only thing I remember from Golden Eye was the multiplayer. I wouldn't dream to defend the game story-mode because it was crap imo. But the multiplayer was great. But it's not a game I considered the best ever or even in my top 20. Most people I know quit playing the series after that one. The multiplayer sold the game not the single player that's for sure. 

"Do you realize there are people who like [putting down the controller to watch a cutscene (esp. if it's good)]"

 

I'm not talking one or two times I'm talking about it becoming common to put it down like both did. It being good depends on peference of how many times the average person is willing to keep watching cutscenes. But I read an article somewhere where most people skip shooter games cutscenes because of the average person not caring.  If I can find a link or post I will.

"So, Xenoblade was useless from a business perspective and should not be encouraged by an advisor, if you were to suggest something to Nintendo. Do I understand this correctly?"

In technical terms it made money but it isn't necessary/ or beg to make sequal or make more the series when others do millions more/ or just a million more. But from fan side it would great for those jrpg lovers and fans. I mean like F-Zero on gamecube it undersold according to nintendo and we never saw  on the wii because of it even though many people loved it. There is no reason business wise to make a F-Zero even though fans love it because it would not bring in the money. That's how business works. Nintendo needs to make games fans like that ACTUALLY sell very well.



"Excuse me sir, I see you have a weapon. Why don't you put it down and let's settle this like gentlemen"  ~ max

ninetailschris said:

" "Copy paste as in Copy-Paste of Indiana Jones? What about Golden Eye on 64 then that is pure copy-paste of James Bond?? Please explain." "

The only thing I remember from Golden Eye was the multiplayer. I wouldn't dream to defend the game story-mode because it was crap imo. But the multiplayer was great. But it's not a game I considered the best ever or even in my top 20. Most people I know quit playing the series after that one. The multiplayer sold the game not the single player that's for sure. 

"Do you realize there are people who like [putting down the controller to watch a cutscene (esp. if it's good)]"

 

I'm not talking one or two times I'm talking about it becoming common to put it down like both did. It being good depends on peference of how many times the average person is willing to keep watching cutscenes. But I read an article somewhere where most people skip shooter games cutscenes because of the average person not caring.  If I can find a link or post I will.

"So, Xenoblade was useless from a business perspective and should not be encouraged by an advisor, if you were to suggest something to Nintendo. Do I understand this correctly?"

In technical terms it made money but it isn't necessary/ or beg to make sequal or make more the series when others do millions more/ or just a million more. But from fan side it would great for those jrpg lovers and fans. I mean like F-Zero on gamecube it undersold according to nintendo and we never saw  on the wii because of it even though many people loved it. There is no reason business wise to make a F-Zero even though fans love it because it would not bring in the money. That's how business works. Nintendo needs to make games fans like that ACTUALLY sell very well.

But don't you think that even if the games don't sell too well, that they still increase the value proposition of the console, pushing it into more homes, leading to more sales of games that are affected by the popularity of the console (e.g. Mario Kart)?

@Copy-paste. You mentioned that UC is a copy-paste of something, what were you referring to?



Nem said:
RolStoppable said:
happydolphin said:

The point, my friend, is simple.

When the Playstation home console is at its worst, it sells 67M units, when it's at its best, it sells 150M units.

When the Nintendo home console is at its worst, it sells 20M units, when it's at its best, it sells 96M units.

DO THE MATH.

When the PlayStation home console is at its worst, it loses $5 billion despite getting all the third party support.

When the Nintendo home console is at its worst, it is still profitable despite being shunned by third parties.

Now do the math. If Nintendo had decided to give away GameCubes for free after things went downhill, how many could they have given away, if they ran their business at a $5 billion loss?

$5 billion divided by $100 is 50 million.

It says this guy is a master troll, but he makes excellent points.

May i also point out to the PSVita as an example of Sony's worse? Less fandom and more logic pls. Busines is all about marketing and profitability.

Sony losing 5 billion on gaming is very different than Nintendo losing 5 billion in gaming

nice job at a false equivalency, though the point is.... well pointless 



happydolphin said:
ninetailschris said:

" "Copy paste as in Copy-Paste of Indiana Jones? What about Golden Eye on 64 then that is pure copy-paste of James Bond?? Please explain." "

The only thing I remember from Golden Eye was the multiplayer. I wouldn't dream to defend the game story-mode because it was crap imo. But the multiplayer was great. But it's not a game I considered the best ever or even in my top 20. Most people I know quit playing the series after that one. The multiplayer sold the game not the single player that's for sure. 

"Do you realize there are people who like [putting down the controller to watch a cutscene (esp. if it's good)]"

 

I'm not talking one or two times I'm talking about it becoming common to put it down like both did. It being good depends on peference of how many times the average person is willing to keep watching cutscenes. But I read an article somewhere where most people skip shooter games cutscenes because of the average person not caring.  If I can find a link or post I will.

"So, Xenoblade was useless from a business perspective and should not be encouraged by an advisor, if you were to suggest something to Nintendo. Do I understand this correctly?"

In technical terms it made money but it isn't necessary/ or beg to make sequal or make more the series when others do millions more/ or just a million more. But from fan side it would great for those jrpg lovers and fans. I mean like F-Zero on gamecube it undersold according to nintendo and we never saw  on the wii because of it even though many people loved it. There is no reason business wise to make a F-Zero even though fans love it because it would not bring in the money. That's how business works. Nintendo needs to make games fans like that ACTUALLY sell very well.

But don't you think that even if the games don't sell too well, that they still increase the value proposition of the console, pushing it into more homes, leading to more sales of games that are affected by the popularity of the console (e.g. Mario Kart)?

@Copy-paste. You mentioned that UC is a copy-paste of something, what were you referring to?

You don't sell games expecting them to undersale unless it's very cheap or bundled. No business man would in there right mind create a game to undersell just so other products do good. That rarely would work for them and has a higher rate of failing as most people who know it are already hardcore fans.

 

@Copypaste

I'm saying he looks like generic character. Looks copy and paste of a famous person with good looks nothing special or eye grabing like Master Cheif or Killzone General.



"Excuse me sir, I see you have a weapon. Why don't you put it down and let's settle this like gentlemen"  ~ max