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Forums - Gaming Discussion - Why PS4 won't be cutting edge, and neither will Xbox3 - or Why Nintendo might win next gen

 

Is my reasoning sound?

Hellz yeah! Spot on 265 33.42%
 
I never thought of it like that.... 69 8.70%
 
So it's the mental institution next for you? 101 12.74%
 
So very, very wrong 266 33.54%
 
I'm a pussy with no opinion 88 11.10%
 
Total:789
DanneSandin said:
TheShape31 said:
DanneSandin said:
TheShape31 said:
Microsoft is in the best position to come out ahead next gen. Especially if they're able to launch with $299 and $399 pricing, Kinect 2.0, the most 3rd party support, big exclusives, an improved Xbox LIve, a native 1080p @60fps standard for all games, and solid physical gaming media (my biggest hope).

Sony is in the worst position out of the 3 by far. They can only lower the price of PS3 so much, and they don't have the funds that Nintendo and Microsoft have. Compared to a base unit costing $249-269, they'll have to release the PS4 with at least a $499 price tag and a loss. Sony may not survive this next generation, since there's really no market left for such expensive gaming machines.

Nintendo will do fine, and I feel that they will be neck and neck with the new Xbox console this time around. They'll continue to offer unique gameplay and IPs, so they're only obstacle will be pricing this time around. It's a very different economy than when Wii was launched, and people may not be willing to spend as much for that kind of tech.

I wish a new company were joining the console wars to bring a new and fresh face to the hardware scene. All 3 companies seem to be going through the motions, and not able to surprise anyone anymore.

I agree with most of your post, everything except that Xbox3 will have the most 3rd party support :) it's either gonna be equel, or if MS decides to make the über box it's more likely that WiiStation will get better support.

There's no telling at this point who will have the most 3rd party support.  But I have a feeling that during the next generation of console it will have a lot to do with how much success each one will have.  As you can see above, I never suggested that they will have the most.

Oh, my bad then =) But I don't really think 3rd party support will depend on how successful a console are: take a look at the current gen. Wii is nr1, but ain't getting any lovin' from 3rd parties. IF next gen is about equel in graphics I think 3rd parties will publish for all 3 consoles - and that's great for us gamers either way you look at it =) I think next gen is gonna be brilliant!!

I agree that next gen should be pretty exciting.  But looking at the Wii, it actually had more 3rd party software sales than PS3 or X360 did.  3rd part support doesn't necessarily mean 'the biggest AAA titles'.  Wii didn't have GTA, Bioshock, or countless other big name titles.  But it had plenty of other less 'popular' titles (which catered to the style of the system) that sold even more.  3rd parties will continue to make even more unique brands of software for the specific control schemes of each console.  They'll be taking into account the Wii Game Pad, Smart Glass, and whatever Sony comes up with this time around.  It may be the lesser known, console-specific, titles that create success more than anything else next-gen.



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RenderMonk said:
The graphics of the PS4 and XboxNext won't be wildly better than the wiiU. What we will see is, higher frame rates, better anti-aliasing, smoother edges, less distortion on texture maps, less screen tearing, and better quality lighting and shadows. But to the average gamer, that is not going to translate to "Wow, that's WAY BETTER than anything I've seen before."

But if you think for a second, that Sony and Microsoft are going to come out for another generation of consoles, and not throw everything they have at it...you'd be sadly mistaken. Both have seen what Nintendo was able to accomplish with non-traditional controls. The tested the water with the Kinect, and the Move. Whatever they have up their sleeve, will be better versions of what they've tried already.

You are right about one thing though. Now that Nintendo has 3rd party support, all platforms will have all games on them, EXCEPT for 1st party titles. While it is true that this is where Nintendo shines, Sony has done an excellent job of creating a stellar 1st party lineup of their own. I'd say it's right up there with Nintendo now. Seeing as Nintendo isn't creating very many new IP, they are just re imagining the existing IP they have had for decades. While Sony on the other hand, are still bringing out new IP such as Beyond and Last of Us, to name two of the most recent.

I think this is something that many/most people miss ...

Even if Sony and Microsoft produce dramatically more powerful systems than the Wii U, third party publishers will have to make a choice whether to produce better visuals or target a larger userbase. They can target these high end consoles and high end PCs few people own, or they can release games that can be bought by almost anyone.

I'm inclined to believe that for the first few years of the generation most games will be released for the current HD consoles with the lowest detail settings while running at 720p@30fps and will be designed to scale to run on higher end consoles and gaming PCs. New(er) game engines are actually being developed to take advantage of tessellation to achieve this, and it is not unreasonable to expect that (in the not too distant future) most big budget games could easily manage the multiple levels of detail to make this possible.



People, I´ve just read some pages and I´m getting the conclusion that many people here are not considering a key fact on next gen consoles success: consumer economy.
Taking the example of the Vita, and past examples like Dreamcast and 3DO, it´s clear that it´s not just power that matters. Vita may be a powerhouse but it still doesn´t have what it takes to convince new consumers to spent heavy on it. Everyone is talking about power matters, power matters, graphics, graphics, graphics and to tell you the truth, it´s kind of boring talking about the same thing over and over again.
If Sony and Microsoft can´t sustain a new high-tech-high-performance-high-price console, we won´t see it soon and they will have to come with something not so powerful but instead with something that´s acessible and with an affordable price for consumers. Or they will have to take the most advantage possible from their actual consoles in therms of consumer approaching before taking a step on new grounds that are not acessible to customers today.
How risk would be for them to come with a $ 600 console right now? Would people buy it or only their fans? How long would Sony sustain another product with a loss, like they´re sustaing Vita today? Are consoles sales continue to fall in 2013, 2014 ? Nintendo´s bet is, at least, a cheap one, one that is acessible to people and at the same time has some innovations, it may be a hit or not, but it seems like a safe bet for the next three or four years, as much as PS3 and Xbox still have good sales potential worldwide.
Those are not easy questions to answer, but after the case of Vita, production costs and consumer costs will be very, very important not for Sony and MS but for the future of the console market itself.



TheFallen said:
People forget that the WiiU has to power the Gamepad ASWELL as the TV. I'm assuming if Sony/MS take a different approach to the Gamepad , they will only have to focus on the TV visuals and thus even if The consoles were SLIGHTLY weaker than WiiU, there games could look better.

Processing power needed for the gamepad is pretty minimal, especially if it is just menus.



Yridian said:
I'd like to think neither Sony nor MS would dump the amount of power (And money) into their system they did this gen, especially Sony which isn't exactly healthy across its entire portfolio of products. I'd also like to think 3rd party support will be strong for WiiU, especially after the other systems launch. Yes, I'd to think all that ... but history. It has a tendency to repeat itself.

What tricks do MS and Sony have? Raw power. Sony can't get away with launching a new system second or third in line and have it be seen as weak. Look at PSP, and its sales. Did Sony learn its lesson with Vita? Nope, they produced an expensive item with top of the line graphical ability. They will do the same with PS4 I'm afraid. Nintendo may be the only company who can get away with a weaker system. Microsoft did learn some lessons from XBox to 360, cutting some corners, cutting costs. They also have a hit on their hands, with their own motion sensor which will no doubt be bundled in every new system. So maybe they can do it again, and we may see a console not very much stronger than the Wii?

As for Nintendo, Iwata thinks the gap between Nintendo's console and the other two will be less than it was with the Wii and the current consoles. I think he's right, but a gap there will still be. And if it's significant enough to make it impossible to port games down to WiiU, we will see yet another 3rd party drought on a Nintendo system. WiiU's saving grace, would be the controller. Which is rather 'standard' in terms of dual analog and traditional buttons. Companies won't have to fight a two front war like they did with the Wii, being graphically weaker and having a very different controller.

The Vita does not have top of the line hardware. I would say SONY did learn their lesson, before the 3DS dropped its price the $249 price point of the Vita was praised.



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Wh1pL4shL1ve_007 said:
Cthulhu said:
There is no need for Sony to release a new console if ps3 can compete with a "next" gen console

I never expected that when I paid 650euro for a 2007 60gb ps3


Honestly... if it cant run skyrim properly, then you know you have an aging console. No trolling just my oppinion. 

If Bethesda were competent it could run Skyrim properly.



brendude13 said:
Wh1pL4shL1ve_007 said:
Cthulhu said:
There is no need for Sony to release a new console if ps3 can compete with a "next" gen console

I never expected that when I paid 650euro for a 2007 60gb ps3


Honestly... if it cant run skyrim properly, then you know you have an aging console. No trolling just my oppinion. 

If Bethesda were competent it could run Skyrim properly.

If the PS3 had more system ram (or graphics ram) available, Bethesda could get skyrim to run properly.  The problem is fixed vram and fixed system ram, at 256 mb each.  I imagine the cell architecture is givnig them fits as well.



Check out my Youtube Let's Play channel here.

Crono141 said:
brendude13 said:

If Bethesda were competent it could run Skyrim properly.

If the PS3 had more system ram (or graphics ram) available, Bethesda could get skyrim to run properly.  The problem is fixed vram and fixed system ram, at 256 mb each.  I imagine the cell architecture is givnig them fits as well.

There are RAM limitations and obviously the PS3 suffers more than the Xbox 360 and PC, but it's not like it's impossible. Many other developers achieve greater things than Skyrim on the PS3.

That's one thing I'm looking forward to with the Wii U, RAM, and lots of it.



brendude13 said:

The Vita does not have top of the line hardware. I would say SONY did learn their lesson, before the 3DS dropped its price the $249 price point of the Vita was praised.


The PS-Vita's price was praised by the same people who thought $600 was reasonable for a PS3 and $250 was too much for a Wii ...

Essentially, people who look at these in terms of value as hardware rather than value as a system.



HappySqurriel said:
brendude13 said:

The Vita does not have top of the line hardware. I would say SONY did learn their lesson, before the 3DS dropped its price the $249 price point of the Vita was praised.


The PS-Vita's price was praised by the same people who thought $600 was reasonable for a PS3 and $250 was too much for a Wii ...

Essentially, people who look at these in terms of value as hardware rather than value as a system.

Is that unreasonable?