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Forums - Gaming - Why do some people get mad when a game goes multiplat? Or they took my games!

flagstaad said:
oniyide said:

Since this gen is coming to a close, i was pondering something that confused for some time.  It seems some people get really mad when a game that was exclusive or announced as such goes multi.

Ok, I have 2 reasons for you, let me see if you agree:

1. There is a term in ecomics called the Positional Good, esencially part of the value of an item is based on the fact that you have it and somebody else don't. When a game is exclusive to the console you own, it has a subjective value that is lost when it is released in the others consoles or PC, people get mad when its stuff has less value even if it was only a subjective one.

2. People with limited resources, have to make a choice and buy only one console (or just not all), this decision is taken based on the advantages one has over the other and that includes exclusive games, people tend to reassure themselves that they took the best possible choice and get very deffensive when someone question their decisions. When a game is no longer an exclusive his/her choice loses one of the reasons behind it and that makes the choice less clear and that makes people mad with the developer that remove the reason. (also this second one is a big reason why fanboys exists, is just people convincing themselves and the rest of the world that his/her choice is/was the best one because his/her company is better or the competition is just worst).

Both reason have the same root cause, by nature the human beign is insecure and selfish, that means it wants the higher value for his stuff and to be right.

1. First point seems kinda petty to me. A game is a game, as long as its good thats all i care about, it being on another console doesnt make it more fun, at least not for me. But maybe for some people.

2. I understand having only one console, we've all been there(unless you were spoiled). But it still a little petty, If you only own that one system and that game later gets ported to another system, you still get to play that game. 

I kinda understand some of these feelings i just never really felt them myself



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lilbroex said:
SvennoJ said:

I have to agree with theprof on this one.
"The game now fits all on one disc due to Square Enix’s decision to ditch Hi-Res FMVs for in-engine cut scenes."
This is the main reason I did not buy 13-2. I can forgive final fantasy a lot of misgivings as long as I know I'll get rewarded regularly with spectacular cutting edge cgi.

Even I said that the only problem would be video and audio data. That is not the major complaint I keep hearing though, nor was it the one I was talking about.

I'm talking about the claim that entire areas were cut out "beause of the 360" not HD Full Motion Video.

The devs made it clear that they cut out those areas and events because they viewed them as uncessary for the plot driven game play.

You're probably right they didn't cut it specifically because of 360. However if they had not spend time and effort on making a multi platform engine they might have had time to add more character background stories through flashbacks, another thing I love from FF games.
Or maybe the only change would have been an earlier release. (most likely)



lilbroex said:
SvennoJ said:

I have to agree with theprof on this one.
"The game now fits all on one disc due to Square Enix’s decision to ditch Hi-Res FMVs for in-engine cut scenes."
This is the main reason I did not buy 13-2. I can forgive final fantasy a lot of misgivings as long as I know I'll get rewarded regularly with spectacular cutting edge cgi.

Even I said that the only problem would be video and audio data. That is not the major complaint I keep hearing though, nor was it the one I was talking about.

I'm talking about the claim that entire areas were cut out "beause of the 360" not HD Full Motion Video.

The devs made it clear that they cut out those areas and events because they viewed them as uncessary for the plot driven game play.

Ok lilbro, I'll admit that you have a very defensible point. Without coming out and saying that their quoted "entire game worth of content was cut" was due to the 360 thusly angering fans everywhere, I can only speculate as to the reason why they would simply cut content from a game that is literally dwarfed by previous final fantasy titles, which is sad because ff12 was ONE DISC.

I can only, logically but maybe wrongly, note that SE is willing to cut cgi, and is logically willing to cut other content (which isn't polygonal but pre-rendered areas with large file sizes) which was then even for the "necessary content" admittedly downgraded (more heavily compressed) due to file size.

I can only look at other games that were multiplat, like Rockstar's CEO on GTA4 quoted as "On PS3 you've got a guarantee that every machine is going to have a hard-drive and, with Blu-ray, you've got plenty of storage, whereas on Xbox 360 there's no guarantee of a hard-drive and you're working with the DVD format. Does that create limitations? Yep."" But maybe that's wrong of me.

I can only see SE saying "we want both versions to be identical", along with “Obviously, when we talk about XIII it’s for PS3 and Xbox – with PS3 being on Blu ray there would be enough memory, but on Xbox probably not. At the moment we’re thinking of releasing the voice in English only. Are there many people who would like to play with Japanese voices?” then see it not included making me see a link in those quotes. Maybe I'm wrong for thinking that.

Sure. You have a point. 

I can't, without a doubt, prove that the game's content was cut smaller than ff12,10,9,8,7 because of the 360. 

I will concede in that vain, that evidence from id's rage, capcom's lost planet 2, rockstars gta 4,and team bondi's LAnoire (who hilariously said they had 2 full arcs they cut BECAUSE OF BLURAY LIMITATIONS)....cutting content due to dvd space limitations (all these on 3 dvds) does not mean Square Enix did so. It is also not proof that any of them actually DID (well except rockstar) because while devs say they did, higher ups say they did not. That is not a confirmation of evidence. I understand that.

I also understand that audio is what takes up the most space, not areas, and it's not proven that lightning nor any other character actually spoke at all during the "full game's worth of content" they cut, so it's very likely that had it been deemed acceptable, they could have put the content in, since with sidequests there's usually no dialogue anyway.

I understand that 5 companies all saying that they've cut the game in some way, does not reflect upon each other's company's decision to cut due to limitations on dvd disc space. In fact, to my chagrin, at least one of those games cut content because Bluray wasn't large enough, not because dvd wasn't. All of these companies have since released this extra content as DLC, so in the end, what it boils down to is that companies were simply blaming dvd space (arguably) in order to release DLC without looking like chiselers. The fact that most of these games are compressed on the dvd, and uncompressed on ps3 could only be described as a keen attempt to LOOK like they were trying to fit things on dvd, so that people would feel sorry for them.

I concede this argument to your cunning and strong argument of "they never explicitly said that". I am humbled by this exchange and will now saunter away in utter defeat.

EDIT: This post has had additional information cut from it due to size limitations.



oniyide said:

1. First point seems kinda petty to me. A game is a game, as long as its good thats all i care about, it being on another console doesnt make it more fun, at least not for me. But maybe for some people.

2. I understand having only one console, we've all been there(unless you were spoiled). But it still a little petty, If you only own that one system and that game later gets ported to another system, you still get to play that game. 

I kinda understand some of these feelings i just never really felt them myself

I am not saying these are good or valid reasons, but those are some of the rational ones, and yes they are petty and inmature and above all selfish.

Now, WHY we fell that the diminishing value of our goods or beign wrong about a choice we made is bad?, that is a more complex question, and we may need a deep sociology study to get to that answer, but it has to be a mix of factors like... nature that implies that the fittest survives, society that show us that is better to have the higher valuable stuff, education that punish the mistake made, and many others.

Another interesting question is WHY some people are beyond these feelings and don't get mad with this kind of news?. Maybe is because of a different uprising, an ability to analyze better the situation, not having the necessity of deffend his/her choice because it has all the consoles or something else.



flagstaad said:
oniyide said:

1. First point seems kinda petty to me. A game is a game, as long as its good thats all i care about, it being on another console doesnt make it more fun, at least not for me. But maybe for some people.

2. I understand having only one console, we've all been there(unless you were spoiled). But it still a little petty, If you only own that one system and that game later gets ported to another system, you still get to play that game. 

I kinda understand some of these feelings i just never really felt them myself

I am not saying these are good or valid reasons, but those are some of the rational ones, and yes they are petty and inmature and above all selfish.

Now, WHY we fell that the diminishing value of our goods or beign wrong about a choice we made is bad?, that is a more complex question, and we may need a deep sociology study to get to that answer, but it has to be a mix of factors like... nature that implies that the fittest survives, society that show us that is better to have the higher valuable stuff, education that punish the mistake made, and many others.

Another interesting question is WHY some people are beyond these feelings and don't get mad with this kind of news?. Maybe is because of a different uprising, an ability to analyze better the situation, not having the necessity of deffend his/her choice because it has all the consoles or something else.

As a person who is beyond those feelings i can try to answer this.  I dont feel the need to defend my choice because I have all the consoles(i dont) I dont do it, because I am having fun and I am satisified with my choice, randomguy@AOL or whatever doesnt really phase me as I see him/her as a person who wasnt happy with their choice, why else would they say something.  Now some people will buy a system just because of the name and then get made when they have droughts, they only have themself to blame we live in a world where info is there at the touch of a buttong, their is no excuse to be making "mistakes" IMHO. I believe that 3rd party games should be multiplat and if they are not it should be for a good reason. At the end of the day, its just games. We're not talking about politics or anything that will really affect our lives. If any of the big three go under tomoorrow will i lose sleep? Probably not. There is more important things to worry about.



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Jay520 said:
Immortal said:

Okay, good. That's already some argument fodder. Why exactly do you find this kind of fanboy argument crazy to the extent of, uh, cat excretion? What's wrong with genuinely disliking other video game companies and not wanting them to get any good games?

My question would be why don't you like other video game companies? I presume it's because you believe they lack good games, correct? In which case, it wouldn't make sense to want the companies to not get good games, because not getting good games is the reason you don't like the companies. You have a problem with something, but you don't want the solution to surface. You want the problem to persist.

That's like me disliking a TV Show because it's unrealistic. But at the same time, I actively oppose the idea of the Show becoming more realistic. It makes no sense whatsoever.

I dont like Microsoft because they dont give a shit (or even know) about games, just profit and owning the living room. They've proven it three times in a row at E3 that they just dont care. Theyve shown it for two gens now as well. Then again...I go to an art school thats owned by Goldman Sachs. They dont know crap about art. Luckily for me though, i have good teachers. American companies. :)



so...

...13 pages into this thread and this answer is still games get compromised, one way or another.



Jay520 said:

 

About an hour ago, you said you were trying to provoke a conversation. I figured I'd be interested in discussing the logic behind what you said here, but only if they are your sincere feelings. However, if you don't adhere to that post, then I'd rather not discusss it. Debating over a topic in which we share the same views doesn't seem very appealing to me.


Okay, fine, let's work with that. That is how I think. Do you believe there's something wrong with hating the companies and not wanting them to get good games? If so, could you elaborate as to why?



 

“These are my principles; if you don’t like them, I have others.” – Groucho Marx

DigitalDevilSummoner said:
so...

...13 pages into this thread and this answer is still games get compromised, one way or another.

Well, in our defense we are trying to discuss another options, for me the "games get compromised" sound more like an excuse than a reason, is an invalid rationalization of the feelings the gamer is having, because there is no real way to prove it and most likely it has not happen very often if at all.



DigitalDevilSummoner said:
so...

...13 pages into this thread and this answer is still games get compromised, one way or another.


so...

...after 13 pages you still havent explained how games get compromised. THe only game that came close was a maybe FF13. GE released on WIi and was built from the ground up, then was later ported to PS360, where was the compromise in that scenario?