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Forums - Politics - Russia hasn't changed

makingmusic476 said:
the2real4mafol said:
HesAPooka said:
the2real4mafol said:
Kasz216 said:
Yeah. Heard about that two days ago.

Really sucks.


Also, it's not so much that Russia hasn't changed.

So much as Russia has backslided back into awfulness.

Yeah definitely, maybe Russia will never be democratic have the illusion of democracy like the west. Putin's a dick 

Fixed/

What would you say Democracy is then, if the west doesn't have it?


I would argue different countries in the West have attained varying degrees of it.

A First Past the Post voting system that leads to our only viable choices for candidates coming from two parties that properly represent a tiny sliver of the actual populace isn't all that democratic.

We have the ability to vote out the guy that's fucking up assuming we like the alternative better, but that's it.  Anything beyond that is made unttenable by the spoiler effect.

We need to implement an alternative voting system for the presidency and senate and a proportional system in each state for selecting the house representatives they send to congress for our country to really approach true representation.  I'd get rid of the electoral college (popular vote picks the President) and make all campaigning publicly funded with private contributions outlawed to further that aim.

yeah i hate FPTP, it's a crap system. In the UK, we had a chance to change the system (referendum in 2010), but we sad no. idiot public!!

but i really don't see how a AV system would benefit the USA, ain't the democrats and republicans far too big now, that even under AV, libertarians or who ever else, would still struggle to become elected?

but i agree with you on the last point, private contributions for campaigning, just corrupt the candidate. maybe that's why Mitt Romney is so clueless



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I'm not condoning the Russian (Putin dominated) judicial system and the over the top jail sentence but Pussy Riot do tend to enjoy attracting attention for no apparent reason other than I guess to push more sales of their records.

Before the current anti-Putin protest in the Cathedral , they had an orgy in a museum, performed a sex act with a chicken in a supermarket and successfully kissed a female security officer without her consent (who then punched the band member in the face for trying).



mai said:

Kaz, it's not me who's comparing, it's you who brought this topic to the discusion in the first place. I'm just pointing to the fact that you're not a good position in the discussion, 'cos to prove this I don't need the swastika-drawing guy anyway (this and the value of your "destroyed property" is like 500 bucks, and he got 3 years for this, isn't that too much?).

The American  judicial system is a mess, I know that, American patriots know that :D

Except Kim Dotcom isn't actually in jail.... and hasn't been sentences to anything.

The 50 years number I can only imagine was the max sentence of all the counts added together ignoring the fact that in the US we have concurrent sentencing... and not consecutive sentencing outside of extreme cases pretty much only violent crimes. 

Which means say, you have 25 cases of copyright infringement with up to 2 years each?   That means the max sentence you can get is 50 years.

However the max sentence you would serve is 2 years.  Since each sentence is served concurrently (at the same time).

 

Though your comparing that with the Pussy Riot thing where they did literally no damage.  So i don't see your arguement.

 

Also, for the record.  That Swastika guy actually only spent a couple months in jail after sentencing.  Unlike pussy riot... most of his sentence WAS conditional

http://ww2.gazette.net/stories/05062011/montnew182327_32566.php.

So... yeah.  He got way less time for an actual crime.

 



Badassbab said:
I'm not condoning the Russian (Putin dominated) judicial system and the over the top jail sentence but Pussy Riot do tend to enjoy attracting attention for no apparent reason other than I guess to push more sales of their records.

Before the current anti-Putin protest in the Cathedral , they had an orgy in a museum, performed a sex act with a chicken in a supermarket and successfully kissed a female security officer without her consent (who then punched the band member in the face for trying).


Now a least two of those are actual reasons to be sentenced to jail time.



I don't think the western world can complain when there is prisoners in Guantanamo bay who have been there for years without being judicially sentenced and jails people for sharing media and having sex with 17 year olds.

The judge could have interpreted Pussy Riot desecrated a religious site which apparently means seven years on prison. He or she could very well have done it to send a message. They got it out easy.



 

 

 

 

 

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Kasz216 said:

Also, for the record.  That Swastika guy actually only spent a couple months in jail after sentencing.  Unlike pussy riot... most of his sentence WAS conditional

http://ww2.gazette.net/stories/05062011/montnew182327_32566.php.

So... yeah.  He got way less time for an actual crime.

What about Wuterich? Care to explain?

What about other swastika guys?
http://www.google.com/search?&q=synagogue+desecration+jail

What about the US legal system being screwed in general?
http://www.google.com/search?&q=us+legal+system+screwed

You know, this's stupid rant you've started here, but I'll support you.

Let me know when you finish this^, I'll bring some more :D



Badassbab said:
I'm not condoning the Russian (Putin dominated) judicial system and the over the top jail sentence but Pussy Riot do tend to enjoy attracting attention for no apparent reason other than I guess to push more sales of their records.

Before the current anti-Putin protest in the Cathedral , they had an orgy in a museum, performed a sex act with a chicken in a supermarket and successfully kissed a female security officer without her consent (who then punched the band member in the face for trying).

*facepalm*

If it was Putin-dominated, how the f**k  the whole deal has happened? Why he needs such publicity? And to the best of my knowledge they don't have any records, they're the kind of artists who piss on a carpet and call it performance.



mai said:
Kasz216 said:

Also, for the record.  That Swastika guy actually only spent a couple months in jail after sentencing.  Unlike pussy riot... most of his sentence WAS conditional

http://ww2.gazette.net/stories/05062011/montnew182327_32566.php.

So... yeah.  He got way less time for an actual crime.

What about Wuterich? Care to explain?

What about other swastika guys?
http://www.google.com/search?&q=synagogue+desecration+jail

What about the US legal system being screwed in general?
http://www.google.com/search?&q=us+legal+system+screwed

You know, this's stupid rant you've started here, but I'll support you.

Let me know when you finish this^, I'll bring some more :D

Thouuugh yeah, did you look at any of the google search info you looked at?

Nothing is near as bad as what Russia just did.



the2real4mafol said:
makingmusic476 said:
the2real4mafol said:
HesAPooka said:
the2real4mafol said:
Kasz216 said:
Yeah. Heard about that two days ago.

Really sucks.


Also, it's not so much that Russia hasn't changed.

So much as Russia has backslided back into awfulness.

Yeah definitely, maybe Russia will never be democratic have the illusion of democracy like the west. Putin's a dick 

Fixed/

What would you say Democracy is then, if the west doesn't have it?


I would argue different countries in the West have attained varying degrees of it.

A First Past the Post voting system that leads to our only viable choices for candidates coming from two parties that properly represent a tiny sliver of the actual populace isn't all that democratic.

We have the ability to vote out the guy that's fucking up assuming we like the alternative better, but that's it.  Anything beyond that is made unttenable by the spoiler effect.

We need to implement an alternative voting system for the presidency and senate and a proportional system in each state for selecting the house representatives they send to congress for our country to really approach true representation.  I'd get rid of the electoral college (popular vote picks the President) and make all campaigning publicly funded with private contributions outlawed to further that aim.

yeah i hate FPTP, it's a crap system. In the UK, we had a chance to change the system (referendum in 2010), but we sad no. idiot public!!

but i really don't see how a AV system would benefit the USA, ain't the democrats and republicans far too big now, that even under AV, libertarians or who ever else, would still struggle to become elected?

but i agree with you on the last point, private contributions for campaigning, just corrupt the candidate. maybe that's why Mitt Romney is so clueless


Proportional representation would be at the heart of any changes to our electoral system.  When moving to a proportional sysem, some voters in, say, Califronia would be more likely to vote Green over Democrat, and voters in a place like Louisiana may vote Libertarian as opposed to Republican.  Right now in Louisiana, Republicans generally take 60% of the vote in statewide elections, but take 5/6 congressional districts due to gerrymandering.  Under a proportional system where people aren't afraid to vote for third parties because it may help an opposing party win within their district, you may see a situation in which Republicans land three seats, Democrats land 2, and Libertarians land 1.  Suddenly voters of each affiliation within that state are more properly represented, instead of almost the entire state being represented by Republicans.

Once you start seeing third parties in Congress, that leaves open the possibility of one of the more popular third party candidates running for the Presidency.  At that point it's crucial for the AV to allow people to vote for their preferred third party candidate with their major party candidate as a back up.  Third parties will start small, maybe getting 10-15% of the vote, but if that party's ideals grow in popularity over time, it could eventually become a major party alonngside the oother parties, thus winning a presidential election.



Kasz216 said:

 Thouuugh yeah, did you look at any of the google search info you looked at?

Nothing is near as bad as what Russia just did.

Well, that we're the worst, that I somehow have figured out already :D Thank you, I watch Fox News.

How about yet another poor creature (not the swastika guy, another one) jailed for whatever he's done in synagouge? It's on the very first page.

 

Never cease to amuse, why among all possible questions to ask regarding the topic you choose the stupidiest? Like the discussion we're both (hopefully) enjoying right now, despite how idiotic it is :D  it's "was a 9/11 an inside job?" all over again! Why don't you ask why, say, the whole topic was picked up by worldwide media in the first place among all possible options? it's no like the story is any close in being hot, disgusting or whatever to 'staff sgt killing a couple dozen civilians for no apparent reason', no?