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Forums - Nintendo - Wii never maxed out?

Just because something does not look impressive now, does not mean it was not impressive back then, and that's all I have to say on the matter.



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@fillet

You haven't played this game have you?

I only say this because you appear to be judging it based purely on these couple of screens. When this game was released Factor 5 were boasting higher poly counts the the maximum quoted for the Gamecube by Nintendo themselves.  There are massive dogfights with dozens of fighters, not to mention large fleets including star destroyers etc, 60fps with hardly a drop and all with more effects than seen in the majority of Wii games.  The only advantage for Wii games is the slightly higher widescreen resolution sported by most Wii games. (both 480p though)

I don't quite understand your point about the dropping resolutions through the generation. As far as I'm aware most if not all GC games supported 480i (480p for some) whereas the majority of Wii games supported 480p (some 480i,  i think). 

I still have this game along with all of the best looking Wii games and while the very best the Wii has to offer probably is a little better, that is a very short list of games.  I would still contend that the Wii has nothing better looking in this particular style/genre.



happydolphin said:
fillet said:

No, those graphics are not impressive.

Look what is actually being rendered there, a flat sea, a flat back ground and a few shipsthings with very basic polygon shapes. So yes, artisticly they can make those few things being rendered look quite good. What it does do, it does well. But it's really not doing much is it. Floor textures are heavily and obviously repeated, ships are repeated, geometry is more basic than many n64 games. It's making very good use of limited hardware and it ran at a high resolution because it didn't need to use the grunt on texturesgeometry. Skies are generally pretty empty you know ;)

 

Very ignorant comments here. Most Wii games are clearly doing a lot more, I would have thought that was obvious. It reminds me more of a tarted up version of a 20 year old wire frame untextured space shooter from the 80s. Of course this is not an insult to the game but a spade is a spade, and you guys are talking about spades. If your talking about teapots, then that's great, this has great teapots = teapots being very good good game design to hide shortcomings of a console and make the most of it.

teapots rock, and if they make a game look good, then I couldn't care less how the graphics were offered. True, to the discerning eye things may appear like paper art, but for the less savvy, a few games like this on the Wii wouldn't have hurt a sinch.


I completely agree.



hsrob said:

@fillet

You haven't played this game have you?

I only say this because you appear to be judging it based purely on these couple of screens. When this game was released Factor 5 were boasting higher poly counts the the maximum quoted for the Gamecube by Nintendo themselves.  There are massive dogfights with dozens of fighters, not to mention large fleets including star destroyers etc, 60fps with hardly a drop and all with more effects than seen in the majority of Wii games.  The only advantage for Wii games is the slightly higher widescreen resolution sported by most Wii games. (both 480p though)

I don't quite understand your point about the dropping resolutions through the generation. As far as I'm aware most if not all GC games supported 480i (480p for some) whereas the majority of Wii games supported 480p (some 480i,  i think). 

I still have this game along with all of the best looking Wii games and while the very best the Wii has to offer probably is a little better, that is a very short list of games.  I would still contend that the Wii has nothing better looking in this particular style/genre.


The output resolution of 480i or 480p has no bearing on the rendered resolution, same as Xbox 360 can output 1080p for all games but this is scaled from rendered resolution.

I assure you I have played the game and very much appreciated the silky smooth frame rate and high rendered resolution. I wish more games did things like this, I'm simply saying that it isn't quite as it seems, the impressive frame rate and resolution was achieved because of sparse environments and little on screen and the nature of space and baren wasteland type combat.

Nothing wrong with that, it's a good thing. But it's not technically impressive, it's just much more enjoyable to play.



fillet said:
hsrob said:

@fillet

You haven't played this game have you?

I only say this because you appear to be judging it based purely on these couple of screens. When this game was released Factor 5 were boasting higher poly counts the the maximum quoted for the Gamecube by Nintendo themselves.  There are massive dogfights with dozens of fighters, not to mention large fleets including star destroyers etc, 60fps with hardly a drop and all with more effects than seen in the majority of Wii games.  The only advantage for Wii games is the slightly higher widescreen resolution sported by most Wii games. (both 480p though)

I don't quite understand your point about the dropping resolutions through the generation. As far as I'm aware most if not all GC games supported 480i (480p for some) whereas the majority of Wii games supported 480p (some 480i,  i think). 

I still have this game along with all of the best looking Wii games and while the very best the Wii has to offer probably is a little better, that is a very short list of games.  I would still contend that the Wii has nothing better looking in this particular style/genre.


The output resolution of 480i or 480p has no bearing on the rendered resolution, same as Xbox 360 can output 1080p for all games but this is scaled from rendered resolution.

I assure you I have played the game and very much appreciated the silky smooth frame rate and high rendered resolution. I wish more games did things like this, I'm simply saying that it isn't quite as it seems, the impressive frame rate and resolution was achieved because of sparse environments and little on screen and the nature of space and baren wasteland type combat.

Nothing wrong with that, it's a good thing. But it's not technically impressive, it's just much more enjoyable to play.

I'm unaware of any hardware scaling done by the Wii or GC, the rendered and output resolution were the same.  Any scaling is done by your TV.

We are going to have to agree to disagree on the sparse environs.  Probably the best looking game on the Wii, Mario Galaxy 2, has relatively sparse environs as well but it doesn't in any way detract from the awesome visual presentation and excellent use of textures and effects on display.



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Yeah, Rogue Leader and Rebel Strike were beautiful games back then and, after looking at a couple of youtube vids, they still are great looking. I'm tempted to pop in Rebel Strike (which featured the entire campaign of Rogue Leader for split screen co-op!) but I remember being quite frustrated with these games, too. I'm not the gamer I used to be so I imagine I'd be pulling my hair out. Technically great, though--listen to the in game commentary and you'll see what tricks they were using to pull of such a nice looking game.



Viper1 said:
Chrizum said:
Conduit didn't even have true dynamic lighting and shadows, something many N64 shooters did have.

In my opinion, Super Mario Galaxy 2, Metroid Prime 3, Monster Hunter Tri and Muramasa have the best graphics on the Wii.


You are being facetious, yes?


If you zoom out far enough, then any game can have great graphics. lol

Galaxy 2 is the same as the first one, same engine, same effects...it just looks "good" because the camera is zoomed out so far.  Monster Hunter actually looks worse than Star Fox Adventures in my opinion.  Metroid Prime 3 looked pretty good, I guess.  Muramasa was more an outcome of the old-school pixel art style than "good graphics".  I suppose that's an objective term, though.



 

spurgeonryan said:
This was my first GC game. My friends picked up Luigis Mansion, but I got this game. Absolutely loved it! They really were beautiful graphics back then! I still think about them sometimes now. Not because they are still great now, but just because they were that good back then. It really felt like you were flying in some other galaxy, the game play was fast as well.
I think there were some towns that looks super fake though. They got the landscapes down to a science, but I remember flying around buildings still feeling like I was blowing up a town model instead of an actual town.

But I agree it was awesome!


I agree.  Luigi's Mansion was really impressive back then.  I remember my buddies and I were constantly amazed by how awesome the lighting effects were.  Luigi's Mansion 2 won't have the same visual surprise as the first one, so they'll have to make up for it by having deeper gameplay and more variety in level design.  I have faith Miyamoto can whip Next Level Games into shape to make an awesome game.



 

Galaki said:
If you spend $100,000 you get something shoddy.
If you spend $1,000,000, you get something better.
If you spend $10,000,000 you get something good.
If you spend $100,000,000 you get something great.

You can count the great games with 1 hand and still have some fingers to spare.


i think you were off a bit in your number of zeros.  not even wii dev budgets start out at $10.



Amazing!!! It's sad though I also think that the Dreamcast, Xbox, and the Saturn wern't maxed out either.