But the good of Vita edition is that's a new game within the universe of the series... and developed by some great artist of the gaming...

We don't know that, because Nintendo were stupid enough to launch the system when there was nothing worth buying on it.

As I said earlier, if they'd have launched it late October/early November with a launch lineup of Nintendogs, Layton, Zelda + 3rd party stuff and had 3D Mario/Monster Hunter + more 3rd party stuff for December... Followed by the early 2012 hitters + Mario Kart in the Quarter, as they planned it, then the games would have been there for people to think "Oh. Mario, Monsters, Puppies and Kittens, Karts, Zombies, Puzzles and an old Ocarina? Yeah. That's worth $250."

Instead people were saying "Oh. Puzzles, Puppies, Kittens and an old Ocarina? Sounds ni- What? $250? Nah."

It very true, we can't tell if 3ds failure at launch was exactly due to price/software or the factor of 2.
But 1 thing is true for the ps vita, is that it fails on both.
People often say software makes the system but there is really more than just that.
A lot of other factors contribute to the success of the system.

That can be blamed on the Vita being released, stealing some of the interest... And of course, them having to rush Mario Kart into the Holidays. It would have been the big killer app for the first Quarter for them.

Fair enough. To begin, your comparing the 3DS' Y1 against the PSV's upcoming Y1 is not a fair comparison. To explain, here are scenarios where Sony cannot deliver on big guns (sorry), while Nintendo could have. If you blame the 3DS' underwhelming sales only on pricepoint, you'll have no way to ensure it wasn't due rather to a lack of big hit games, or at least a mix of both pricepoint and big hit games. Put it this way: At 250$, with no big hit games, who will bite? In other words, you're missing the scenario where the 3DS released with big guns.

Now why did the 3DS launch fail? The 3DS did not get big guns at launch except for Nintendogs which, granted, is a massive seller. However, first and foremost, it appeals to an audience where a lower pricepoint works (the casual, female and elderly). Now had 3DLand, Mario Kart and MH released when the console was at 250$, in all realism, I can't see the sales results being much different from what we saw holiday 2011. Or, to be more fair, had the 3DS launched in holiday 2011 at 250$ with those hit games, I would've expected similar results. However, since Nintendo wanted to penetrate the market sooner than holidays so as to ensure momentum, and since big guns shouldn't really be released too far from holiday season, the big N was in a catch 22 priced at 250$. Even at 200$, they wouldn't have generated the interest to ensure 16mil unit sales (which ramped up as of August due to pricecut). Ultimately, they should have released the console at 200$, released lots of casual titles and important retro franchises (such as 2D Megaman and 2D Castlevania) for it to ensure a measure of core, then come holiday 2011, launch all the big guns and stay at 200$, projecting a 10Mil unit sale for the system. Thus, they would've guaranteed a solid pricepoint for the console throughout its lifetime, and alienated neither casual nor core (no worries launching some casual hits at launch, it's a launch).

Now the PS3 at 600$ is a 300$ increase over regular console prices. With a 250$ pricepoint being an 80$ increase over regular Nintendo handheld prices, I'm not sure this is a fair comparison. Next, Sony does not have the hits Nintendo has period, bar Gran Turismo. (See LBP Kart thread) Assuming Sony could have Mario, MH and Mario Kart, maybe its success would have been much greater despite the staggering price (even 500$ as you suggest could have made it possible). People buy the iPad at 400$, of course they can do alot with it, but strong tantalizing apps sell hardware especially if the IPs are properly handled.

Bottom line: Nintendo needed to reduce its projection and change strategies for Y1. 10Mil versus 16M is not a big deal, devs will support it at 10Million units, it didn't need a 16M userbase Y1. Focusing on casual titles at launch to herald the runner-up to the DS and encouraging 3rd parties to release their equivalents of NSMB, and at a more reasonable casual pricepoint, this should have held the 3DS up for the first half of its Y1, until holidays where they could launch the big guns.

Ultimately, pricing and game leverage are two ingredients that if properly managed can be optimised to sell maximal volumes. At 250$, at holiday season with big hits, the Vita could sell in droves, but that's not happening; big hits are a Nintendo thing. The Playstation brand sells on variety and long-term, not on explosive hits.

@bold. Glad you can still make me laugh.

@10M vs 16M. Selling 10M units before your competitor should reassure 3rd parties, especially if they are encouraged to launch New Megaman or New Castlevania as hit flagships (with marketing and AAA effort just like RE:R) and are taking part in the success 1 year in advance. Then, once Nintendo jumps in, they are encouraged to make games like RE:R. With 10M units 3DS units sold prior to competitor, and with the DS getting excellent 3rd party support all through its lifecycle with that same a much lesser time advantage over PSP, I don't see the worry.

(EDIT: stikethrough explained -> PSP launched 4 months after DS in NA, same time as DS in JN, 6 months later in EU.)

@original-point. Agree to disagree. Monster apps with deadly appeal and excellent marketing defeat mildly excessive pricepoint. With lack of a counter-example apart from the iPad, I'm at a loss.

@iPad. It's a portable with software apps. The type of software does not matter since they both target a similar consumer (casual and mass).

@DS-3rd-party. I see heavy 3rd party support for the DS. Quantity =/= quality. What is your argument?

Thanks, that helps. Now I understand much more what you meant.

Im on my phone so I wont quote.

I never said the Vita stole any momentum, Im saying it will do in sone form in the Feb/Mar NPD. They no longer have a big game to release, where as they had Mario Kart planned before it was rushed into 2011. With MK it would have still had the huge momentum despite Vita launch.

The reason why nintendo rushed the Release of 3DS was the same as SONY rushed vita's on japanese market.. to don´t let the competence take so much advantage... Nintendo wante to gain "momentum" and only gained once some good games come out and got a price cut. Sony Wanted to scratch some of teh Japanses market and release the console during holiday on at least one market, but it was uneffective, although they haven´t lose anything, jus rushed a console in a market without any games that support and represent based on the tastes of that market... Until western release we could not see if a price cut is necesary for the vita or Not... but the memory cards need one price cut that's for sure...

And I don't think that 3Ds could have sold as well on holidays with 250$ price tag even with the "trident" that have now... Because before the pricecut some people said: "is so much money i'll have to wait some games to buy one" And just after the price cut when the sales picked up: "Is cheaper now! I'll buy one and wait for the games over holiday or later!" For most of people is seemed like a Offer than a price cut...