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Forums - Gaming Discussion - 2 questions about SONY...

blkfish92 on 24 December 2011

They lose out on the chartz because Americans like the all mighty xbox a little too much.



           

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MARCUSDJACKSON on 24 December 2011
blkfish92 said:
They lose out on the chartz because Americans like the all mighty xbox a little too much.

yep that's why i'm glad i'm part french and irish but wait, i was born in America! noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!

i'm cursed be stuck with the branding of the over loved Xbox in america, instead of the only true HD console, the dreamcast lol.



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sales2099 on 24 December 2011
Kynes said:
I'm going to say it again, since the networking division, Sony does not provide Playstation numbers. This last year they have merged almost all the divisions into one, so it's impossible to know if they are profiting or bleeding money in the PS brand.

Well one can make educated guesses based on previous facts.

Sony admitted to burn through all profits made by PS2 and sold PS3 at a tremendous loss for years.

Only since 2010 has there been any evidence at all that the division is back to profitability.

However, the high yen equates to almost all NA/European PS3 sales coming back to Japan with less revenue, plus they put themselves back in the red with the $50 price cut, judging by the Q2 2011 report. 

Best case scenario is that the PS brand by itself is only bleeding a little money. 



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blkfish92 on 24 December 2011
MARCUSDJACKSON said:
blkfish92 said:
They lose out on the chartz because Americans like the all mighty xbox a little too much.

yep that's why i'm glad i'm part french and irish but wait, i was born in America! noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!

i'm cursed be stuck with the branding of the over loved Xbox in america, instead of the only true HD console, the dreamcast lol.


LOL!



           

Silver-Tiger on 24 December 2011
snakenobi said:
MARCUSDJACKSON said:
snakenobi said:

1)

lets see what happens,January will bring out the official sales numbers from all 3

VGC has bad tracking in other parts of the world which leads to difference but every-time official numbers come out VGC adjusts its numbers and then PS3 comes out on top.

VGC's number of PS3 are way below as SONY has projected 15m for this Fiscal year and they have said that they are actually ahead of this numbers but VGC shows that SONY will most likely not be able to make it so there is definitely some tracking problems

 

2)

Sony's big numbers are revenue(total sales) which differs from profit or loss.

Also the strong YEN makes SONY earn less on every product sold out of  JAPAN as currency exchange rates coem into play

 

As for SONY sustaining it,SONY is a pretty big company so they have alot of money from the past and also it borrows if it needs more and because it has such a great brand,lenders loan money easily.

Sony lost $7b on PS3 from its launch but has been profiting from Q1(Jan-Mar 2010).Its recent losses have come from earthquakes,currency exchange volitality and R&D.

this .

the division that's really hurting them is their TV. brand (correct me if i'm wrong snake) Sony was set to make a profit this yr., before the hack and earthquakes happened. most of Sonys divisions are seperate divisions, but what i'm not sure of is are their movies and music divisions (entertainment)making any money?

a company that's made profit for yr.'s would have to have money stashed away so i wouldn't worry to much.

PS3 contributed to their losses this yr., but only do to the pricedrop, yet that division is making money, and their losses don't come from that division and, it seems as if the PSVita although selling at a loss will, will profit from the software selling so well at this point. digital sales are already exceeding expectations and i believe Vita only sold just a few hundred less then 3ds in Japan in it's only 2 days on the market.

as far as hardware sales go, yes it's true PS3 kicked ass from Jan. to Oct. but Sony has not lost yet, infact i expect  the gap by yr's end to be 500k after adjustments, and it still looks like(with vgc current numbers) that PS3 will finish 100k-200k a head of the 360.

VGC is showing 360 leading PS3 sales 160k-170 a wk, and with 2 wks left in this month to report, if that trend continues then the gap when vgc numbers come in on the first wk of Jan., the gap will likely only be 300k. 

yeah the falling TV sales are hurting badly

 

the movie and music division are making a profit

and PS3 is not making a loss even after price-cut.Sony is not gonna lose on PS3 anymore.They can cut PS3 price again next year and still not lose.


this year sony losses are due to:

 

TV division

Earthquake

Sony ericsson purchase

fabrication factory and other purchases

PS VITA hardware(very small loss or maybe they have broken even)

R&D costs(this are yearly cost every company bears but are covered by profits but sony can't cover them because of other loses)

Stron YEN against other currencies


Very informative post, finally a good breakdown.



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snakenobi on 24 December 2011
sales2099 said:

You see MS has their division which is mostly made up of Xbox 360 and Windows Phone 7. So when we see their numbers, its pretty clear that their mostly from Xbox. You dont have people saying " They only profited because Windows Phone was carrying the Xbox brand". Thats just not done lol. 

cause MS isn't really a hardware company,most of their products in EDD division are start-ups and XBOX is the major portion from it.

Sony has alot of products grouped in

Sony on the other hand over the years has lumped the Playstation brand in with an increasing number of different products. The article I mentioned showed the division, a large division BUT included the Playstation brand nonetheless, posted hundreds of millions of losses. 

the division did,not the PS division inside it.

only thing that could bring loss is R&D on PS division but that would be covered by profits

Sony refuses to divulge purely PS numbers and continues to lump them in this large division. I speculate that its cause they can mask their PS losses in a crowd of other products so it will be hard to tell whats really losing money. 

alot of companies do that for various reasons like better linking of different divisions of the company.if you have been following SONY from a long time,then you will know that their divisions were so scattered.Alot of restructuring happened and thats why they came together.

But they could also do that for the reasons you pointed out

but SONY gives out sales numbers and PS3 has been profiting from Q12010





snakenobi on 24 December 2011
MARCUSDJACKSON said:
Degausser said:
Sony as a whole are hurting pretty bad right now for a lot of reasons, the main ones are generally accepted as the recession / economic downturn, high Yen, lack of innovation and competition taking a lot of their electronic market. I mean you just need to sort of look how TV's have come along in the past 10 years, since say, someone like Samsung entered the market - they made (For all intents and purposes) TV as good as Sony's at a much lower cost, in a recession. Sony did nothing to respond and their TV division is bleeding money from it.

It's hard to totally judge how the PS side of things is getting on. Obviously the PS3 bled a hell of a lot of money at launch but it's generally seen to be profitableish now. The latest Q2 (I think) earnings report was losses but PS is lumped in with other stuff that I believe is generally quite unprofitable... it's very hard to judge as I've no idea if revenue from stuff like PSN services is counted. Theres no doubt the PlayStation side of things for the most part has gone terribly this gen though and they really have a lot to address going forward.

Spiderman to the rescue i guess.

agreed, but they need a hero that death and kryptonite can't stop or kill lol.

they need somebody that is an artistic head like Steve Jobs or its own former Ken Kutaragi



Aprisaiden on 24 December 2011
Kynes said:
I'm going to say it again, since the networking division, Sony does not provide Playstation numbers. This last year they have merged almost all the divisions into one, so it's impossible to know if they are profiting or bleeding money in the PS brand.


IIRC SONY's 'comments' on the electreonics division losing ~$350 million were "Losses were incured as a result of the strength of the Yen, lower than excpected Vaio sales and falling Bravia/TV prices". This would imply that the video game section is actually profitable while they are bleeding money from TV sales.

 As for others commenting on SONY's HDTV business -- SONY needs to move development out of Japan, they need to focus on profit over market share and they need a little luck (IIRC in the last 3 months currency movement has result in Bravia's being ~7% more expensive for SONY to manufacture while Samsung - there major competitior in the region has seen costs drop by ~5%. That alone would have a massive impact on SONY's bottom line since they either reduce profit margins or lose market share and likely sales. 



SnakeDrake on 24 December 2011

Things might look up for Sony in 2012. The psv launch for NA/Europe plus Sony's biggest movie franchise Spiderman.



 

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MARCUSDJACKSON on 25 December 2011
snakenobi said:
MARCUSDJACKSON said:
Degausser said:
Sony as a whole are hurting pretty bad right now for a lot of reasons, the main ones are generally accepted as the recession / economic downturn, high Yen, lack of innovation and competition taking a lot of their electronic market. I mean you just need to sort of look how TV's have come along in the past 10 years, since say, someone like Samsung entered the market - they made (For all intents and purposes) TV as good as Sony's at a much lower cost, in a recession. Sony did nothing to respond and their TV division is bleeding money from it.

It's hard to totally judge how the PS side of things is getting on. Obviously the PS3 bled a hell of a lot of money at launch but it's generally seen to be profitableish now. The latest Q2 (I think) earnings report was losses but PS is lumped in with other stuff that I believe is generally quite unprofitable... it's very hard to judge as I've no idea if revenue from stuff like PSN services is counted. Theres no doubt the PlayStation side of things for the most part has gone terribly this gen though and they really have a lot to address going forward.

Spiderman to the rescue i guess.

agreed, but they need a hero that death and kryptonite can't stop or kill lol.

they need somebody that is an artistic head like Steve Jobs or its own former Ken Kutaragi

i know. thread started to become all buisiness. needed some humor.



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