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Forums - General - Is religion still relevant in modern society?

Mr Khan said:
theprof00 said:
half all all religious need was removed when the street lamp was invented.

Religion has always been first and foremost, a way to get people to obey the law when nobody is watching them. Almost all religions share an "omnipresent" being of some kind.
And almost all promise a reward for not being bad.
Basically, the whole of religion can be drummed up into, don't rob and kill that person on the street, if you can abstain from doing this, you will be rewarded beyond your wildest dreams in the afterlife.

Judaism has no afterlife to speak of, and Shinto puts very little influence on the afterlife. Buddhist morality is very far away from the Christian perception and their end-goal is very ambiguous in nature, nor do Confucianism and Taoism advocate much in the way of afterlife, though the latter at least makes a sense of cosmic order

In short, religion's role as a social glue is much more complex than a simple carrot-and-stick heaven-or-hell mentality that we often boil Christianity down to, since Christian social ethics also hinge upon far more than where you're going

It was a generalization that fits. You can't point out specifics to counter a generalization.

But maybe it was a little off.

Religion took root as a form of social ethics that allowed for people to live by a non-enforceable code of laws. Many religious codes are enforced by punishments and rewards (either extrinsic or intrinsic) provided by the imaginary creations of the religion.

How's that?

Before religion:

If someone does something wrong, they are bad. We will punish the person who does something wrong. We will thank the person who does something good.

After religion:

Even if the person who does something wrong is not caught, he will feel the repurcussions of it in some way.
and the opposite "even if this person is thankless, he will benefit from his good deed somehow".



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Not really, maybe in the beginning of the first societies it played an important role, but now? No, I think we've evolved past it. And many of the laws that are said to have come from religion, ultimately didn't, because we already saw those things as detrimental to society, each other and ourselves.

And over the years we've come to change our views and societies based on our knowledge and understanding of each other and how we can work together, not based on religion.

E.g. abolishing slavery, equal rights for everyone, giving and receiving aid to and from other nations etc. (the list goes on) would have happened with or without religion. Religion has definitely had an effect on the speed at which progress is made, for better or for worse, but we live in a time where religion is no longer needed for anything on a societal level. (Atleast in the developed world). Is religion relevant in your personal life? If you want it to be, and that's absolutely fine as long as it doesn't negatively affect those around you.



padib said:
Runa216 said:

aaaha, no. Your repeated inability to see through the fallacies of Religion should instantly disregard anything you have to say on the matter. 

aaaha, no. Your repeated inability to see through the fallacies of Atheism should instantly disregard anything you have to say on the matter. 

it's funny...because there are no inherent 'fallacies' in Atheism.  There are questions left unanswered,  yes, but the whole point of atheism is to accept these questions are unanswered and subsequently seek the truth about them rather than fill in the blanks as you deem fit.  Therein lies the fallacy of religion: Assumptions of truth rather than proof of it.  

Your crusade against atheism is frustrating to witness, that's for sure.   Your assumptions about me are equally frustrating. 



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padib said:
RolStoppable said:
padib said:

aaaha, no. Your repeated inability to see through the fallacies of Atheism should instantly disregard anything you have to say on the matter. 

padib, are you religious? That would explain a lot.

Rol, to tell you the truth I'm what you'd call a backsliding christian. I've gone through a phase of religious extremism, and that segment of my life is over. I went through a phase of refusal of my faith, but never stopped believing in a creator or in Jesus as described in the gospels.

Yeah, I'm a passionate person, you know that. The reason I said that above, is because Runa has a thing of bashing religion, I really just wanted to give him a taste of his own medicine. Who likes being bashed really?

EDIT: Rol, of all ppl and things don't take what I said to Runa personally for yourself, it's really just targeted at him. And I am curious at to what that would explain :D of course your opinion is what I want to hear, not some other bozo who barely talks to me.


Padib, what are the fallacies of atheism? Or more specifically, my agnostic atheism? 



Runa216 said:
padib said:
Runa216 said:

aaaha, no. Your repeated inability to see through the fallacies of Religion should instantly disregard anything you have to say on the matter. 

aaaha, no. Your repeated inability to see through the fallacies of Atheism should instantly disregard anything you have to say on the matter. 

it's funny...because there are no inherent 'fallacies' in Atheism.  There are questions left unanswered,  yes, but the whole point of atheism is to accept these questions are unanswered and subsequently seek the truth about them rather than fill in the blanks as you deem fit.  Therein lies the fallacy of religion: Assumptions of truth rather than proof of it.  

Your crusade against atheism is frustrating to witness, that's for sure.   Your assumptions about me are equally frustrating. 

QFT



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padib said:
it's funny...because there are no inherent 'fallacies' in Religion.  There are questions left unanswered,  yes, but the whole point of religion is to accept these questions are unanswered and subsequently seek the truth about them rather than fill in the blanks as you deem fit.  Therein lies the fallacy of atheism: Assumptions of truth rather than proof of it.  

Your crusade against religion is frustrating to witness, that's for sure.   Your assumptions about me are equally frustrating. 

 

Aaand you just officially lost the game.  Can we get a judge in here to call it? 



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padib said:
Runa216 said:
padib said:
Runa216 said:

aaaha, no. Your repeated inability to see through the fallacies of Religion should instantly disregard anything you have to say on the matter. 

aaaha, no. Your repeated inability to see through the fallacies of Atheism should instantly disregard anything you have to say on the matter. 

it's funny...because there are no inherent 'fallacies' in Atheism.  There are questions left unanswered,  yes, but the whole point of atheism is to accept these questions are unanswered and subsequently seek the truth about them rather than fill in the blanks as you deem fit.  Therein lies the fallacy of religion: Assumptions of truth rather than proof of it.  

Your crusade against atheism is frustrating to witness, that's for sure.   Your assumptions about me are equally frustrating. 

 

it's funny...because there are no inherent 'fallacies' in Religion.  There are questions left unanswered,  yes, but the whole point of religion is to accept these questions are unanswered and subsequently seek the truth about them rather than fill in the blanks as you deem fit.  Therein lies the fallacy of atheism: Assumptions of truth rather than proof of it.  

 

Your crusade against religion is frustrating to witness, that's for sure.   Your assumptions about me are equally frustrating. 

 

 

that didn't work so well.

Religion has an answer for everything.

God works in mysterious ways, right? Faith is the frog dna used to complete the dino dna in jurassic park. It's a big pile of nothing that keeps you from questioning the ridiculous plotline.



padib said:
Runa216 said:
padib said:
Runa216 said:

aaaha, no. Your repeated inability to see through the fallacies of Religion should instantly disregard anything you have to say on the matter. 

aaaha, no. Your repeated inability to see through the fallacies of Atheism should instantly disregard anything you have to say on the matter. 

it's funny...because there are no inherent 'fallacies' in Atheism.  There are questions left unanswered,  yes, but the whole point of atheism is to accept these questions are unanswered and subsequently seek the truth about them rather than fill in the blanks as you deem fit.  Therein lies the fallacy of religion: Assumptions of truth rather than proof of it.  

Your crusade against atheism is frustrating to witness, that's for sure.   Your assumptions about me are equally frustrating. 

 

it's funny...because there are no inherent 'fallacies' in Religion.  There are questions left unanswered,  yes, but the whole point of religion is to accept these questions are unanswered and subsequently seek the truth about them rather than fill in the blanks as you deem fit.  Therein lies the fallacy of atheism: Assumptions of truth rather than proof of it.  

 

Your crusade against religion is frustrating to witness, that's for sure.   Your assumptions about me are equally frustrating. 

 

 

No padib, just no.  
fallacy of atheism: Assumptions of truth rather than proof of it.    No, atheism isn't an assumption of anything, it's a lack of an assumption really. Atheism is the default position until evidence of the existance of god(s) is given. I'm not claiming there is no god, I'm just at my default position of not believing in one until someone gives me a reason to. You are the one making the claim that there is a god, therefore the burden of proof is on you. 

there are no inherent 'fallacies' in Religion. No comment.



We killed god almost 300 years ago...



padib said:
Andrespetmonkey said:
padib said:
Runa216 said:
padib said:
Runa216 said:

aaaha, no. Your repeated inability to see through the fallacies of Religion should instantly disregard anything you have to say on the matter. 

aaaha, no. Your repeated inability to see through the fallacies of Atheism should instantly disregard anything you have to say on the matter. 

it's funny...because there are no inherent 'fallacies' in Atheism.  There are questions left unanswered,  yes, but the whole point of atheism is to accept these questions are unanswered and subsequently seek the truth about them rather than fill in the blanks as you deem fit.  Therein lies the fallacy of religion: Assumptions of truth rather than proof of it.  

Your crusade against atheism is frustrating to witness, that's for sure.   Your assumptions about me are equally frustrating. 

 

it's funny...because there are no inherent 'fallacies' in Religion.  There are questions left unanswered,  yes, but the whole point of religion is to accept these questions are unanswered and subsequently seek the truth about them rather than fill in the blanks as you deem fit.  Therein lies the fallacy of atheism: Assumptions of truth rather than proof of it.  

 

Your crusade against religion is frustrating to witness, that's for sure.   Your assumptions about me are equally frustrating. 

 

 

No padib, just no.  
fallacy of atheism: Assumptions of truth rather than proof of it.    No, atheism isn't an assumption of anything, it's a lack of an assumption really. Atheism is the default position until evidence of the existance of god(s) is given. I'm not claiming there is no god, I'm just at my default position of not believing in one until someone gives me a reason to. You are the one making the claim that there is a god, therefore the burden of proof is on you. 

there are no inherent 'fallacies' in Religion. No comment.

No, you fail again. If you postulate that there is no God, you need to account for everything in life today; hence Evolution. Atheism isn't a convenient negative position as you would like it to be. Negating a grand cause, you need to make up for it with something else. 

But padib, I don't postulate that there is no god, I don't know, the part that makes me atheist is where I say I don't think there is one (if you want to know why, you can ask). But I'm not asserting this, as I said, I don't know. And I will think there is one when I'm given evidence of it. You assert that a god exists (based on past conversations with you). You got any evidence? And furthermore, any evidence that this god is the god described in the bible?

To the part in bold: No I don't, I simply say I don't know what happened before the big bang (assuming that's what you're talking about) and don't make any assumptions as to what did happen or if anything happened.